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Floyd Casista Teles (Guthrie Trapp/Kenny Vaughan)

Discussion in 'Other T-Types and Partscasters' started by gregj1964, Mar 17, 2017.

  1. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    Dear All,

    This is my first time ever on a forum, much less this one. I read this one religiously, however. I wanted to post something about my experience buying a Floyd Casista Tele (like the one Kenny Vaughan—Marty Stuart plays). I also hope this is the appropriate place to post this. If not, then my apologies. I am happy to remove it.


    I had Floyd make me a guitar on the model of Kenny Vaughan's teal/tele thinline with a bigsby. First, the good stuff. Floyd was good about me paying on it while I was away in England teaching. It took about 7 months, which was fine since I was away almost that entire time. The first incident we had that turned out to be a foreshadowing was that I had to buy the Bigsby. This was not in our original agreement, which we did over the phone (my huge mistake). My partner was there and heard everything, including the final price of $1950, inclusive of everything we discussed about the guitar (Fralin pickups, plus Bigsby). So, Floyd gave me a story about how he didn't say that, and I paid an additional $170 or so for the Bigsby.

    Second, the guitar arrived fine, but I had to pay shipping, and provide a case. Floyd said he couldn't provide a case. Any of us know if you pay close to 2k for a guitar, it will always come with a case. Not Floyd. So, that was another $125 or so.

    Now the bad:

    First, I take my guitars to my local techs. There are two in my area, both of whom are certified Fender and Gibson, have made guitars for folks like Alice in Chains, and whose guitars are sold buy Wildwood guitars. If you know guitars, you know that store. Top shelf. So, I always have them look at my guitars. I did this after I had the Floyd for a year. I was gone again for 6 months teaching, and the guitar was in the case in a climate controlled storage unit.

    Second, I went to pick up the guitar and was told by my tech, whom I trust, that the wood in the neck had turned bad and created too much backbow. He stressed the work was awesome, but that bad wood happens. He, who makes and sells his guitars at Wildwood, suggested I speak to Floyd about the warranty and get a neck replacement. Faulty wood, no fault of Floyd.

    Third, I spoke to Floyd. He agreed to build a new neck, AND pay for shipping both ways. This was Sept. 2016. He then says he can't pay for shipping, so I paid to ship it to Tennessee. I told him I would be away on leave again in the Fall and would not need the guitar back until the end of the year.

    Fourth, Floyd got the guitar and said he disagreed with the two tech's assessment, and instead of keeping the discussion about the faulty wood, Floyd attacked these luthiers personally (i have all of this on Facebook archive, BTW). I told him it was not about their work, as he doesn't know them. I also stressed neither of them attacked or said anything negative about his work. Just the opposite. But, Floyd took it all personally and claimed the neck was fine. BUT, he still agreed to build me a new neck. This is significant: He could have just said no, and refused, but despite his disagreement he AGREED to build the neck despite his disagreement. Had he said no, that would have been the end of it. I would have been mad, but that's that. So, his agreement to rebuild the neck ANYWAY was agreed on.

    Fifth, Floyd said he would have the guitar done by Thanksgiving. No problem, as I was out of town. November comes and I hear nothing, but it's no matter since I am away until the end of December.

    Sixth, Floyd finally replies and says he's been ill and making guitars for needy kids, and that the guitar will be done and to me by the end of December. Fine.

    Seventh, I return back to Tacoma, where I live, and of course nothing from Floyd. I write him and finally he replies. He gives yet another set of excuses, but ends up insisting the neck will be done by the end of January.

    NOTE: at no time during these months did Floyd refuse or go back on building the neck, even though initially as I note above he disagreed and had the opportunity.

    Eighth, end of January. Nothing. Mid-Feb. Nothing. So, after sending Floyd messages on Facebook and he never answering, I finally posted on his wall. We then spoke on message, where he said it would be done and to me by March 15th. I said, and there is record of all of this, that he could have until the 20th but if it was not TO ME by then, then he could keep his original neck, reimburse me for the cost of a neck, and return my body.

    Floyd agreed to this. It's all on record in Facebook archives.

    Ninth, last week it becomes clear I am not going to get the neck, as I've heard nothing from Floyd. So, once more I try to find out when my guitar is now going to be to me. No way, at this point it will be here with the time it will take to ship. \

    Nothing from Floyd.

    Tenth, I post on Floyd's facebook wall. At this point, I don't care about decorum and giving benefit of the doubt that causes one to speak on message on not for all to see. It's been 6 months since I sent him the guitar.

    Eleventh, Floyd replies, and offers more excuses, then goes on about the neck not being bad, just as he did 6 months earlier. He invokes the Plek and again calls into question my techs, and, then makes the statement that if I have a problem with something like this in the future, I should speak to those who manufacture the material about the warranty, as if to say, if my Fender Tele neck goes bad, I don't speak to Fender, but the people who provided the wood. Then he accused my techs of not being certified, without knowing anything about them.

    Twelfth, Floyd says he has no money to ship the guitar back, then tried to go back 6 month to when he first said the neck was, in his opinion, fine, even though he had every opportunity to say no, send my guitar back, but HE REFUSED TO DO SO AND AGREED ANYWAY TO MAKE THE NECK.

    Thirteenth, so, I said to Floyd: I'd pay for shipping on one condition: That he mailed my guitar the next day. Otherwise, he would have to do it.

    Fourteenth, he mailed back my original guitar, no new neck, and, after 6+ months I finally have it back. I still think the neck has issues, but at this point I am tempted to use the guitar as firewood.

    I write this lengthy review on here for the following: Avoid Floyd guitars, or at least if you buy them, then make sure you have it in writing or I promise you he will engage in some kind of shady business with you.

    Two final things. First, I know I am not the only one this has happened to. I received emails on Facebook from total strangers who have had something similar happen. I am not putting them up here because I didn't ask them. Floyd knows who they are in Texas especially.

    Finally, I suggest if you want one of his teles be very careful. I do like the guitar, but dealing with him has made the guitar not worth the hassle.
     

  2. deytookerjaabs

    deytookerjaabs Tele-Afflicted

    Jun 5, 2015
    Nashville
    Ewwwwe. Well, I guess the best bet is to score a completed used one in a shop then check it over!

    I remember I scoped out his website once and immediately thought "nope." There's no shortage of legit fellas on this site & others who know 21st century communication etiquette and will build what you desire at a similar price point.
     
    SnidelyWhiplash and Doug 54 like this.

  3. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    July 2017 Update

    I want to update my Floyd Tele neck concerns.

    The short is that the neck in question has turned out to be stable and really good. In fact, I have had zero issues since posting my reply above. Now, I do string it with 11s and 12s and maybe this helps to keep the neck in position. I don't play with anything lighter, mainly because I play mostly jazz stuff. I have not put 10s on it to see, but I am willing to say it would be fine.

    I want to make it clear: The guitar is great. It plays and sounds terrific. The neck,a soft V, is really easy to play and the sound has to do in large part to the double F hole and the Fralin pickups. My post above may be read to think this guitar is no good. That's not correct. What is no good is dealing with Floyd. I stand by what I write above, but it's necessary not to throw the baby out with the bath water!
     

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  5. deytookerjaabs

    deytookerjaabs Tele-Afflicted

    Jun 5, 2015
    Nashville
    Cool that it works, yeah, like I posted before there's just some folks who are old fashioned like they're waiting on a telegram then every once in a while throw on flip flops, head to the library, and log into the computin' machine.


    If it makes you feel any better Guthrie had/has some neck problems with his floyd too! If you ever get a pic post it, sounds like a neat guitar.
     

  6. danpan

    danpan Tele-Meister

    180
    Sep 25, 2013
    South Dakota
    Wow!! I'm sure glad your guitar turned out to be a good one, but OMG what a hassle you went through!! A good part of the reason I build my own. Would love to see a pic of your Floyd though!! Sounds like a very cool guitar! :)
     

  7. DaveGo

    DaveGo TDPRI Member

    34
    Mar 14, 2014
    Austin
    My experience and the resultant guitar was far less pretty than yours (after nine months of waiting on a four month estimated build). I was sent a guitar that has extremely poor fit and finish (think high school shop project quality), and more importantly has intonation problems that will likely cost me several hundred dollars to address and attempt to make playable, though I won't put another dime into this guitar. Have not played it for more than 5 minutes since I got it a month or so ago. It will be my reminder that though it's possible for custom builders to make fine guitars - think Hahn, Crook, Kirn, et al, my small collection of Fender made Telecasters are fine guitars which will always be better guitars than I am a player.

    Dave
     

  8. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington

    Yea, I should have probably known better, but I searched for about 3 years to find him after I saw Kenny Vaughan playing it.

    I heard this about Guthrie's neck after he had it refretted. This makes it clearer why he seems to be playing a different tele in some of his videos over the last several months. I'll post a couple pics below.
     

  9. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    Danpan,
    Hassle is an understatement man! I wish I had the talent and artistry to build my own, but I am afraid I lack neither the craft nor the patience!!!
     
    danpan likes this.

  10. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington

    Dave,

    I am so, so sorry to hear this. I can relate, and I am sure you understand why I was ready to make this firewood. Honestly, even though the guitar neck seem totally fine, I still have such a negative disposition against it. I feel like I have to make myself not hate it, and keep telling myself it's like a child in a divorce battle—they are not the blame, even if the anger sometimes generated toward them my indicate otherwise.

    I would love to sell it. I put it on Reverb. A good dude in Colorado asked me about it after finding my post here. I decided it's probably better to take it off rather than try to explain the details. My post was written out of a lot of anger, and I suspect it will turn someone away from taking the guitar seriously. So, I will make my peace with it, put it in a case that I bought(!), and play my Riggio tele to remind me how a guitar should be. I am in the process of trying to get a Kirn. Any suggestions you have would be great. I also have a tele built and painted by Gord Miller in canada. I bought it years ago when he was just starting. It's Allparts with DUncan antiquities, but the guitar is great. Joe Riggio is a friend of mine and he sets all of my things up. That's the difference in the end I think. Anyway, sorry to hear you had this happen. Unfortunately, I am certain we are not the only two.
    Greg
     

  11. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    Fellas,

    Here are two pictures of the Floyd tele I just took. Apologies for the less that professional quality, and the smudges! I have been playing it the last two days through a new quilter 101 mini head and 12" extension cab I got for my birthday. I want so much to hate this guitar, but it's really a nice sounding guitar and I do like the V neck.

    BUT: if any of you want to get a good deal on it, let me know!!

    Thanks for the words of support. I have read this forum for years, but never got on to participate. You guys make me wish I had jumped in way earlier. Cheers to all of you.
    Greg
     

    Attached Files:


  12. Mike Simpson

    Mike Simpson Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    60
    Mar 19, 2006
    Gilbert, AZ (PHX)
    So.. after slamming the guy on the internet... basically you and your guitar techs were all wrong about the neck and the builder was right all along but you still want to slam him for not admitting he was wrong when he wasn't.

    .
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017 at 1:55 PM
    cdwillis likes this.

  13. Mike Simpson

    Mike Simpson Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    60
    Mar 19, 2006
    Gilbert, AZ (PHX)
    I like the color.
    The switch plate over the F hole looks awful to me and I dislike pickup rings and would prefer a "tuff Dog" shaped pickguard
     

  14. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
     

  15. Mike Simpson

    Mike Simpson Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    60
    Mar 19, 2006
    Gilbert, AZ (PHX)
    Please don't take my comments as any kind of personal attack on you.
    Yes I did read all your 14 numbered bullet points in your initial post from May 2017.
    I also noticed that only one member had responded to that until your return post reactivated it yesterday.

    I am just tired of one sided vendetta posts making attacks for a personal agenda to tarnish a defenseless vendor.
    This type of post used to be frowned upon and deleted here years ago.

    As far as my aesthetic preferences, everyone likes what they like.
    I look at things from the point of an amateur builder and I often see guitars differently than someone who does not build. I make my own necks and bodies so I am very familiar with the process. That guitar either should not have the lower F hole or it should have the controls mounted in the lower bout without a plate like a 335. The plate running across the open F hole does not look well thought out. Perhaps it was not the builder's idea and was spec'd that way by a Kenny Vaughan or another customer initially and this is a recreation of that.

    All the best to ya!
     

  16. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    Mike,

    You accused me of saying something I did not say, claiming I was slamming a vendor, and just now accused me further of trying to exact a vendetta. Those are personal attacks, not founded on any evidence except what you've made up. Why not own this?

    Am I wrong or are vendors not welcome here? How can a public forum, known virtually to all including Floyd (he told me) be a place where he and others invited to participate are defenseless? You seem to suggest I am doing this in anonymity. In am not. My name is clearly displayed. Further, if you read what I said you'd notice I made multiple efforts to resolve this issue before I went online to share my concerns.

    Why am I and others not free to share their experiences when, in this case, they are not great? Why accuse them of an agenda other than wanting to share their experiences? It seems you oppose sharing criticism on a public forum. This is odd.

    As to your point that only one person responded before yesterday. The implication here is that there is, in your mind, a correlation between lots of replies and legitimacy. Perhaps an analogy will help.

    I had a loOK at your band on youtube. I saw the link on your profile. Great sound. Kudos. But, if you look closely, not a lot of folks have viewed your videos. By your reasoning that might mean there is no substance or legitimacy in what your band is doing. That's what you suggest by appealing to few responses. If I had wanted to insure lots replies, I would have made an intentional decision to write about something I knew would get replies, say, the persistence of vendetta driven replies on TDPRI.

    On the aesthetic one might say the opposite is the case. Seeing the design of this guitar or anything that is not within the horizon of the same (e.g. your 335 example) shows precisely the difference between seeing something with an amateur''s eye and that of a refined perspective. Your "should" presupposes a lot that is ultimately your own likely unshared perspective.

    I
     

  17. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    I don't mind thoughtful disagreement. I'm not keen on being accused of things for which there is no evidence. Even if unintentional it's still personal.
     

  18. Mike Simpson

    Mike Simpson Doctor of Teleocity

    Age:
    60
    Mar 19, 2006
    Gilbert, AZ (PHX)
    Nice personal attack on me and my band.

    You are grasping at straws here trying to twist what I said. You admitted you and your guitar setup guys were all wrong. You just want to hate.
     

  19. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    That was a compliment to you and your band. If anything your response shows exactly you were attacking me personally. Do you know what an analogy is?
     

  20. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    Don't want to hate. Just don't appreciate you being judgmental in your post without knowing literally anything about it and then again saying I said things I didn't. Apparently people don't call you out on this. But, it's not cool for you to be so disrespectful.
     

  21. gregj1964

    gregj1964 TDPRI Member

    Age:
    53
    14
    Mar 17, 2017
    tacoma, washington
    Just show me where I said me and my set up guys were wrong and I'll admit you're right. I never said that. Those are your judgemental words.
     

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