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Expensive?

Discussion in 'Bad Dog Cafe' started by WetBandit, Mar 6, 2018.

  1. WetBandit

    WetBandit Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    27
    Oct 11, 2016
    37804
    The PRS/Ibanez thread really touched on something that really bothers me.

    I'm going to ask a question.

    What makes something Expensive?

    Feel free to answer however you like.


    I think there are alot of variables including

    Supply and demand/rarity/Scarcity

    Craftsmanship/quality/man hours

    Marketing/hype

    And last but not least....because the seller/manufacturer says so!

    As we all should know by now, nearly every production guitar in the world and even most of the "limited runs" are basically carved and in some cases assembled by machines.

    The CNC machine alone has both helped and hurt the consumers of electric guitars.

    Not only has it made guitar production more cost efficient and speedy, it has also raised general quality by way of consistency/ accuracy

    This allows us the consumer to get our hands on extremely low priced guitars that are of a level of quality that generations before us would have dropped dead for at sub 1k prices.


    This is good for the player...

    But it also creates a problem for the big money buyers...the guys who are looking for the "real deal", as the quality gap almost doesn't exist anymore.

    So what do the company's do to accommodate the guys that are wanting the "real deal" ?

    they build practically the same thing with the same processes...(CNC or the likes) and finish it in "special color" or with a special electronics compliment, or any combination of subtle changes that differentiate it just enough, from the "lower end" fair.

    They may even offer "higher quality woods" or "exotic woods" this is where they really put the screws to your wallet.

    Then it gets the final finishing by human hands that the other guitars get as well but this time it gets a few more steps and a bit more care taken the others didn't get...(sometimes this isn't even the case)

    And now folks, they present to you the "Real deal" and you present to them a big pile of money....

    They were selling and you were buying...bottom line.

    All value is a matter of perception.

    Alot of these "high end" guitars are of such little monetary significance to the manufacturer that they regularly give them away to YouTubers and other demo/review folks who hype it up so big that if you have the means and desire you WILL own it.

    I won't even start on the pedal side of the business..
    We have been down that road before.

    Things are expensive most of the time, because there seems to be more good salesman than people with good sense.

    Rant....to be continued.
     

  2. Frodebro

    Frodebro Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    48
    Aug 17, 2012
    Seattle
    The amount you're willing (or able) to spend on something will also strongly influence your perception of "value."
     

  3. WetBandit

    WetBandit Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    27
    Oct 11, 2016
    37804
    I agree with you 100%

    And this is where the saying "stupid people with dumb money" comes in.

    I never could wrap my head around it.

    Because I'm rich, I need to spend $10 dollars on a Hershey bar in a gold wrapper that is perforated squares instead of rectangles...

    I really have a hard time understanding how people with that logic ever got rich in the first place.

    Hubris, arrogance, and stupidity is what it seems like.
     
    knopflerfan likes this.

  4. Frodebro

    Frodebro Doctor of Teleocity Ad Free Member

    Age:
    48
    Aug 17, 2012
    Seattle
    Some people associate their self worth with their material possessions, at which point spending more for something makes them feel like they're worth more themselves. I have no problem spending a lot of gear and hobbies that I enjoy, but I don't place any sense of self worth in it. If what I truly want is $XXX, then I'll spend that $XXX and move on. But I'm extremely frugal in other areas-but again, I don't place any form of self importance on my frugal habits, either.
     
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  5. WetBandit

    WetBandit Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    27
    Oct 11, 2016
    37804

    I operate in an identical fashion myself...

    I honestly came close to buying a 3k Friedman Cali

    But I didn't because I know better, and I know what it takes to produce it.

    The people that do that as a measure of worth are probably the saddest people on the planet...

    It is honestly disgusting to me.
     
    Frodebro likes this.

  6. luckett

    luckett Friend of Leo's

    Jun 14, 2011
    .
    It's not stupidity. It's called marginal utility of money. The money means more to you because you have less of it.
     

  7. Jupiter

    Jupiter Telefied Silver Supporter

    Jun 22, 2010
    Osaka, Japan
    Yep. If you have a giant pile of money, couple thou is chump change. If I was a skajillionaire, I'm sure I'd drop 5 or 6 or 8 g's on a custom-built LP (though I'd prolly ask Gil Yaron to do it instead of Gibson).
     

  8. Darkness

    Darkness Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    50
    Apr 7, 2016
    Stygian Gulf
    Marketing. Evil stuff.
     
    Tommy Biggs, Obsessed and nojazzhere like this.

  9. WetBandit

    WetBandit Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    27
    Oct 11, 2016
    37804

    So...if not stupidity then definetly, hubris/arrogance and ignorance

    I see the idea of what you are saying but it still strikes me as what I mentioned above.

    I am saying why would a rich man pay more than a poor man for the same thing...

    I mean I buy a 5 dollar cheeseburger and the rich guy needs to pay 15 for the same burger...why?

    It's insane.
     

  10. supersoldier71

    supersoldier71 Tele-Holic

    Age:
    47
    759
    Nov 22, 2009
    Fayetteville, NC
    When I got to 10 guitars: 8 electrics, a bass and an acoustic-electric, I looked around my music room and had a "what have I done?" moment. Instead of ten, I could've purchased a truly special electric from just about any manufacturer, and a great acoustic, and while I may not have been happier, I would certainly have more room in the music room.

    I've been actively downsizing the stable since December.

    That to say this: buy what you like, but don't expect a direct correlation between the price and your satisfaction.

    And don't pay too much attention to what other people do or don't do with their money, that will certainly make you unhappy.
     

  11. Obsessed

    Obsessed Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Nov 21, 2012
    Montana
    It is today's marketing strategy. Price points pure and simple. Look at the competition and meet or exceed their price points. From fast food hamburgers to the full line of sports cars.
     

  12. 3fngrs

    3fngrs Friend of Leo's

    Oct 30, 2017
    Ohio
    It's not hubris, it's available funds. The more I make, the nicer my stuff gets.

    I like nice things and I buy them when I can afford to.

    When I was your age, I was broke and my gear mostly reflected that. Now I'm older, make a lot more, kid is out of the house and I don't have a ton of bills. I'm buying cool gear! I earned it it, I'm spending it.
     
    DrPepper, Ebidis, Jimmy Owen and 3 others like this.

  13. nojazzhere

    nojazzhere Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    66
    Feb 3, 2017
    Foat Wuth, Texas
    Actually, many wealthy people don't spend "stupid" amounts on anything. They live in the same house they've owned for twenty years, they drive the six-year-old Camry, and they still shop at Target and Walmart. Many (not all) that you see driving a Lexus and living in a McMansion are in hock up to their eyeballs. Unlike what Jupiter said, people who have a Skajillion dollars are more frugal about a dime than you or me....they VALUE the money they've earned. The lottery winner, with "quick riches" is more likely to buy flashy stuff, and more likely to be broke a a few years.
     
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  14. 3fngrs

    3fngrs Friend of Leo's

    Oct 30, 2017
    Ohio
    Yep. Most of the rich people I've known have been tightwads. That's how they got that way.
     
    DrPepper and nojazzhere like this.

  15. JuneauMike

    JuneauMike Friend of Leo's

    May 5, 2015
    Alaska
    Here's a mind bender for you.

    Imagine yourself as a good, decent guy who loves music and has always dreamed about building guitars. Or pedals, if you prefer.

    You have a wife who you love. You have two little kids who have so much personality it makes you laugh and cry at the same time. You also have two employees who also have great wives who make them better people, and kids they love. One of your employees has a daughter, and she's got a strange lump. No one is panicking yet, but it's on your employees mind.

    Sometimes things are expensive because they are expensive. Resistors and diodes are cheap, but the very real human beings who install them are not. And not everyone trying to sell their wares are greedy jerks.

    Money is not the most important thing in life. But commerce is very important. It gives men purpose, it feeds families and it lets people decide what they need and what they just want.
     

  16. DougM

    DougM Tele-Afflicted

    Jul 5, 2017
    Honolulu, HI
    Our society is so shallow that we're programmed to judge people on their income and wealth rather than their character. If I have a $300k Ferrari and you only have a $250k one, that means I'm better than you.
    I don't know how many times I've tried to explain to someone that money is a man-made arbitrarily valued item that is only worth what we agree that it's worth.
    But, that's true of everything, including food, water, and air (fortunately they haven't figured out how to charge us for air yet), which in the end are the only things that have actual worth.
    Everything else- cars, boats, guitars, etc... are in many ways just another version of shiny rocks.
     
    nojazzhere, WetBandit and Obsessed like this.

  17. Jupiter

    Jupiter Telefied Silver Supporter

    Jun 22, 2010
    Osaka, Japan
    Nah, I don't think it's either of those things. Really, a dollar is simply not worth the same amount to everybody. The value of a dollar is the amount of trouble it takes to replace it. And the price of a guitar is not the dollar amount; it's what you have to give up to get it. I'm not rich by first-world standards, and I really sweat before spending more than a couple hundred bucks on a guitar. For me, 800 bucks is EXPENSIVE, though I've gone higher than that a couple times, after saving up first and thinking about it a LOT. But if I want a cheeseburger, I'm not even looking at the price: ima get me a cheeseburger even if it's eleven whole dollars. It's not hubris that makes eleven dollars irrelevant to me; it's that eleven dollars represents only several minutes of work, and I'm gonna enjoy that burger.
     

  18. JuneauMike

    JuneauMike Friend of Leo's

    May 5, 2015
    Alaska
    People respect achievement. Money is a version of achievement for some people. Its not the only measure, but it is one measure.

    But theres lots of other measures that have nothing to do with money. Those are good too.
     
    matrix, davidchagrin and 3fngrs like this.

  19. DougM

    DougM Tele-Afflicted

    Jul 5, 2017
    Honolulu, HI
    Unfortunately, in our society there are people who can make huge amounts of money in a very short amount of time, without ever achieving anything, or doing anything productive, but by playing perfectly legal financial shenanigans.
     

  20. JuneauMike

    JuneauMike Friend of Leo's

    May 5, 2015
    Alaska
    Uh, maybe a few here and there. Not enough to be bitter towards them though. And besides, rich people gotta spend their money somewhere.

    And the world keeps on spinning. Yay!!!!!
     
    Ebidis, noah330, Tommy Biggs and 2 others like this.

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