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Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by ruger9, Apr 18, 2017.
OH well then, thank goodness.... I'll just take a little Champ and and EQ pedal. Problem solved!
Both sound great, but unless everyone is being polite, or everything is being mic'd, a Bassman of any vintage will bury a Deluxe.
I love Deluxes for playing at home, but I can not use one at a gig.
I had an early 70s Deluxe in a Paul Rivera made maple cabinet with wicker grille in my youth.
It was the best sounding Deluxe I ever owned, wish I had kept it!
Not sure that a Bassman is the same as Blues Deville. You can turn down a Bassman,
+1, this is exactly my experience too.
I'll offer a slightly different take on this question. In many ways, a band is a team working together to produce an enjoyable performance for the audience. If you're concerned about how the music will sound for your audience, your band mates probably are, too. Communicate. Most people in the audience don't know and don't care anything about what we consider "tone". For the most part, they remember bands that play in tune, in time, are balanced, and aren't too damn loud.
Get the volume right for the room, then for the stage. Guitarist egos and tone snobbery aside, a great way to do this is often through whatever the house PA is. If we need/want to hear ourselves differently there are good ways to accomplish that without compromising the magical music we are making for the peeps in the club.
I also believe we tend to overthink volume and overlook where we sit in the sonic spectrum (which has a big impact on perceived volume). If we are playing in a three piece we need to take up a lot of space. If we are with a couple guitars, bass, horns, keys, multiple voices, etc. then we may sound best in a tight little pocket. I'd spend some time thinking about and discussing with your fellow guitarist what your respective roles in the songs of your set are sonically (not just the parts you'll play) and then wiggle yourselves up or down in the mix to best serve the song and get some separation. This may help a lot with the volume question, too, because you're less likely to trample all over each other or drown anyone out. It was pretty eye (ear?!) opening for me the first time I sketched out the frequencies instruments all occupy from cymbals, snare, down through vocal, guitar, keys, bass, kick, and so on. Certain ranges get really crowded. It'll probably sound more balanced and, perhaps oddly, more full to your audience even though you're each a little skinnier on your own.
It depends on which Bassman - a '58, for example, is much louder than a SF in most cases (assuming both are in good shape and are set up with good tubes and an average bias setting).
Very true. Often they don't even know what instruments is being played - insert a steel and many think it must be a keyboard - a mandolin is a ukulele. A bass is a really deep sounding guitar.
Back to the OP - "wattage" is usually irrelevant when talking about perceived volume. Amp design, speaker square inches & sensitivity and amp condition/adjustment are far more important. The 22 watt Supersonic and 22 watt DR are completely different designs, with the Supersonic ca-pable of much more volume when both are in normal stock form.
Regardless, balance and overall volume in the band is critical, and if band members can't agree about the overall volume it's often a terminal issue. I've quit bands when the drummer has no dynamics and only plays loud all the time; I've also fired guitarists who won't use a lower-volume amp or learn how to use their volume & tone controls (and picking dynamics).
Bad band situations aren't worth it.
I guess you would find out the answer to your question at band practice?
(re appropriate volume being more important than tone)
Unfortunately, many do not - which is why related topics are often "hot button", and why so many bands have "volume competition contests".
Of course. But that's not going to happen for awhile, we're all learning the setlist. This is a hobby for us- we all have "regular lives", and this band was put together as a no-pressure, FUN, situation: we aren't doing it to be rock stars or make extra money, we're doing it for the love of the music. We're all semi-pros (in the past), with hundreds of gigs under our belt. I don't expect any "issues" or "volume wars"... I was just wondering if a 22W could stand up against a 60W in a band situation, playing rock... it's been awhile since we've all had "real" gigs.... I just didn't know if I should be looking for an extension cab or another amp.... I've seen enough guys gig with DRs, no problem, but usually they are the only guitar, or the other guitar has a similar amp.
I gigged in a loud original rock band with my AC15. The other guitarist used my 50 watt Marshall JMP half stack. Not a problem at all. Could he bury me if he wanted? Of course. But we had no issues playing on the same stage and the two tones sounded really good and complimented each other well. We even played a few unmiced outdoor gigs that way, no problems.
Really? I would think experienced players with that many past gigs would understand comparative volume, the difference speaker dispersion makes, how the design and output tubes of different amps affect volume (and tone) and how little influence output power alone has on volume. You're comparing two completely different amps, but have no experience using even similar equipment - in hundreds of gigs? I'm curious what gear you've used in the past, just to get a "baseline".
Most of our gigs took place before we were married with houses and kids... it was 100-watt Marshall stack days.... alot different from small combos.
I've played a few shows with my SS22- with a LOUD drummer, and had no issues. I'm not worried about the drummer; I'm quite familiar with the Hot Rod Deville, and know how friggin' loud it is- especially if someone is trying to "get the goods" from the amp instead of using it as a clean platform for pedals. That's what my concern was- last show I saw this guy use it, P.A. was for vocals only. So drums and guitars were not mic'ed. It was HELLA-loud...
But I guess I'll find out when we get to rehearsal... which hasn't happened yet, this is a "no rush/no pressure" project; we aren't doing it for extra money, we're doing it for fun.
My silverface deluxe reverb w jbl d120f is quite a bit louder than my 4x10 ported bassman piggy back, but the bassman has 60s low efficiency cts alnico speakers, will your Super - sonic run 6l6 tubes , in a Deluxe reverb that bumps the watts to 35