Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com

Black Line Silverface? What's teh deal?

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by noah330, Dec 5, 2017.

  1. jondanger

    jondanger Friend of Leo's

    Jan 27, 2011
    Charm City, MD

  2. noah330

    noah330 Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 10, 2009
    Maryland
    When I was a kid I was really into old guitars and maps. At that time I was pretty broke and aside from the few books you could find on the subject, what you picked up talking to people and what I would read in Guitar Trader there wasn't a whole lot of information on old stuff.

    Once I got into high school I was more concerned with playing, writing songs and listening to as much music as I could. My goal was to graduate from Berklee, and being from a single parent household in one of the most economically depressed areas in the country it was a long shot.

    Guess what? At the end of the day I did it and now I'm doing ok financially, own a pretty decent music related business and work in a field I love. Also have a wonderful family.

    Along the way I haven't had the time to study every single variation of map Fender made or researched every stomp petal known to man.

    I am very thankful to everyone who has given me some cool info and I'm open to learning but to be honest playing guitar, writing songs and recording music is what I do. I simply don't have time to focus on every piece of minutia about guitar gear.

    I don't see that as asking someone to copy their homework (when is the test?), I see it as asking some questions when someone says something that I didn't know.

    Anyways, here is a picture of the t00b chart and the only other number I found on it. Thankfull for any information. Maybe I can help someone out with a ProTools issue or a playing thing at some point in trade.

    Namaste!

    There is a number: A 11320 stamped on the back right of the chassis.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017

  3. noah330

    noah330 Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 10, 2009
    Maryland
    That's probably it. I have a bunch of old stuff that I've collected over the years. I'm very fortunate in that I got in the market at the tail end of it being affordable but, like I said, at that time information just wasn't as readily available like it is now.

    I saw a VHS of Robbie Robertson playing a brown Fender and started looking for one. I found a Bandmaster combo but couldn't swing the $750. I actually found my brown Vibrasonic at a music store way out in the middle of nowhere a few years later. I can't really tell you what model it is or what speakers are in it or anything but it sounds great.

    With guitars it's easier because there seems to be less variation and you can spot if things are refinished or tuners are changed, etc... but the boxes not so much.

    Like I said, I like learning about stuff I have but I'll never be a walking encyclopedia of gear knowledge and I'm thankful for people who are. I'm the d00d who is afraid to even buy any new petals but have all the ones that people are just now looking for, but chances are I got them cheap years ago.

    I do like sharing my stuff with other people. That's why I had this blooze daddy over to my office. I've even had people who I've met on forums to my pad to check out stuff. Seeing the look on someone's face if you hand them an old Gretsch, Goldtop or Burst or plugging in 4 or 5 Plexis at once makes owning the stuff enjoyable on another level.

    Anyways, I digress. But here is a cool map if you ever come across one. I'll have to crack it open next as you don't see too many of these.

    [​IMG]
     
    deytookerjaabs likes this.

  4. buckwalder

    buckwalder Tele-Meister

    359
    Jun 25, 2014
    utah
    Just remember, double green thread grill cloth, snowman eights,no washers on the back panels and black lines on the faceplate are the the earliest
    Version.
    The smaller versions are the least likely to suffer from any CBS tomfoolery.
     
    noah330 likes this.

  5. noah330

    noah330 Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 10, 2009
    Maryland
    Thanks. This is the grill cloth. Honestly, I'm pretty done buying maps in general except for the occasional this or that. Like I said, this box I was asking about because it's pretty sentimental to me.



    [​IMG]
     

  6. buckwalder

    buckwalder Tele-Meister

    359
    Jun 25, 2014
    utah
     

  7. buckwalder

    buckwalder Tele-Meister

    359
    Jun 25, 2014
    utah
    Yes,it is.
    This grill cloth has a smooth texture to it also.
    It makes me wonder why fender only offered it for about 6 months.
     

  8. noah330

    noah330 Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 10, 2009
    Maryland
    Cool man, thanks! I always liked the way it looked. When I moved to Boston for college one of the first things I did was buy a blue light for this one. At the time I had never even seen a blue jewel. A few years back I changed it back to red because everyone it seemed had gone blue on these. The red light and even the smell of this one remind me of being a kid!

    Back then I played teh blooze and I worked my ass off cutting lawns, delivering papers and shoveling snow. The day I put down $250 in cash for this map, my 1980 Les Paul Standard, MXR D+, Justina tuner and a couple brass ended Guild cables (which I shined up real good!) it was the best day of my life.

    Like I said, I had never even heard of a Les Paul. I just knew Gibson made good guitars because my dad had one. On the front of this box there is a spot of white paste to this day. That's silver polish because I was trying to shine it up!1!!!

    [​IMG] Teh young blooze man! Albert Collins t-shirt and all, lolz! Not that cool in the 80s but at least I wasn't following the trends :p

    [​IMG]
     
    t guitar floyd likes this.

  9. Piggy Stu

    Piggy Stu Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    38
    Feb 26, 2017
    Manchester UK
    I eventually found why 'bumched shrit' is considered hilarious but if someone wants to explain why 'map' is the new word? Or indeed the humour in cargo shorts?
     

  10. noah330

    noah330 Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 10, 2009
    Maryland
    I have no idea what bumched shirt means.
     

  11. BobbyZ

    BobbyZ Doctor of Teleocity

    Jan 12, 2011
    Snellman MN
    That Vibrosonic is cool !
    If I'm not mistaken that was the first of the tolex amps and actually cost a little more new than the high powered tweed Twin. I believe the only speaker offered in those was a JBL. Pretty rare amp.

    Tube chart on your Vibrolux Reverb is a blackface chart. But like the blacklines, doesn't mean that's what's inside.
    Apparently CBS just used up whatever charts they found laying around.
     

  12. coldengray

    coldengray Tele-Meister

    Age:
    39
    252
    Sep 30, 2009
    Charlotte, NC
    Some people like to know how to cook. Some people went to school to build amps. It’s ok to be interested in how things are made. It’s also ok to not be interested. I went to college for business but I still play guitar. To each their own.
     

  13. keithb7

    keithb7 Friend of Leo's

    Age:
    46
    Jan 9, 2010
    Western Canada
    Another vote for an explanation on what a vintage Fender map is, and what a bumched shirt is. Thx.
     

  14. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    58
    Mar 2, 2010
    Maine
    So does the Vibrasonic get you some Robbie Robertson toanz?
    He was a huge early influence on me, but as a developing player it never occurred to me that the same gear would help me learn a given players stuff.
    The guitar is just an interface, I use what fits my hands and outputs a nice clear signal.
    The amp is what makes the toanz!
    Gotta have lots of amps!

    ... Sorry for the bad attempt at hip talk, I'm a redneck after all, but I'm tryin'.

    I was in Boston near Berklee a lot from '84-'89 and then from '98-'08.
    Lots of testosterone fueled guitar battles in Daddys Junky Music.
    Every time I tried out a piece of gear there was at least one player trying to cut me.
    Was it like that when you were there?
    I miss that chain of music stores, and all the fun guitar battles too.
     

  15. telemnemonics

    telemnemonics Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    58
    Mar 2, 2010
    Maine

  16. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    56
    Mar 17, 2003
    Spring City, Pa
    The humble beginning...
    I'm pretty sure "maps" is just from typing fast and swapping letters.
    Noah, for instamce, often typed "teh" for "the". It has no sinficance or occult meaning.
     
    telemnemonics likes this.

  17. noah330

    noah330 Tele-Afflicted

    Feb 10, 2009
    Maryland
    Cool. I was finishing up around '98. I do miss the old Bargain Basement at Daddy's. Three quarters of the stuff down there would be "vintage" in forum land. Right around that time (98) they did the big remodel and closed the basement and the focus of the store really shifted. At that time I worked at another now defunct store in the same area that was amazing and really got super into buying and selling on the side.

    I remember the old store back in the 80s that was just crammed with great stuff but I can't say I went there a lot back then. I do remember going to LaSalle's with my dad when I was really young.

    I never got into guitar battles with anyone except for one time. Like I've said, I was always more into writing and working on my own playing back then. In that pool I was never going to be the best guy and I was aware enough to see that the people who were monster players were kind of limited in what they could do when they left. Being a kid who needed a job I really worked on my playing but focused a lot on my technical skills (I was MP&E/Music Synth - which is Music Technology now) and my writing.

    The one time I did get into a guitar battle is kind of an interesting story. Like I said earlier, I was into blooze when I was a young player. I got this Robert John Stone record that only had 29 songs. I would sit around in my dorm room and practice out of Melodic Studies for Pick Style Guitar by Bill Leavitt but my heart was with teh blooze because I was in a music school with a 10:1 guy/girl ratio and terrible food.

    I ended up getting a job in a nursing home and one day I heard the most soulful harp (that's harmonica for you squares) blowing that I had ever heard. When I walked in the room, an elderly black gentleman was standing there in a hospital gown singing the most down home blooze I ever heard. He did the stomp, the flat tire, the lazy duck and the boom boom shuffle all solo. Instantly I knew that Mr. Fulton was the one and only Blind Dog Fulton - harmonica player for the legendary Robert John Stone!!!!!

    The next day I brought this really sweet vintage guitar I had bought for $12 at a flea market and tried to get Mr. Fulton to teach me the missing 30th song that Mr. Stone never recorded. He denied being Blind Dog Fulton and tried to convince me by becoming confused when I asked him what the best petal to use for a Politician tone through an EL-84 map and which brand of NOS glass I should use but I kept on him. He told me that the key to being a bloozeman was to buy a guitar that was all beat up. He trusted me now and said he had something to tell me, but I just wasn't ready for it until I passed the MCSE exam for IT or got into dental school.

    After a couple weeks he confessed to me that he had killed a man and if he left the nursing home he would have to go to jail in Mississippi. I agreed to smuggle him out so he could die a bloozeman's death in the Delta. I smuggled him out and we took a bus down south. We finally got to about 20 miles of the delta and were out of money. We went into a pawn shop and I got a walk around map and we got a couple blooze hats and Mississippi String Ties - that's what a bloozeman wears when he's gigging. Next, we headed to Guitar Center and did a tough gig. It was a snakepit in the Platinum Room but Blind Dog and I paid our dues and cut our teeth playing every GC and Mars Music in the area.

    One night we were hassled by a law enforcement type because bloozemen know all about being discriminated against. The racist manager of a guitar store wanted us to leave because he didn't want our "type" in his store. We had been in there for about a week from open to close playing 5 sets a day. It was a good gig but because of racism and his inability to match an online price + 15% off we were asked to leave. I learned more about race relations playing blooze music than anyone will teach any of you people in "school". This "school" was the road and the lessons were all in "blooze".

    It was at this time that Blind Dog told me I was almost a real bloozeman and he bestowed the name "Lightning Boy" on me. We went to Macy's to try to find some new tan pants. The girl working there was super beautiful. I straightened up my Mississippi String Tie and walked up to her. Tipped my hat and said, "Monin' mam. I'm Lightning Boy and this here is Blind Dog. Would you care to hear us play a song?" She said, "Lightining Boy and Blind Dog? What the hell are you guys supposed to be? "We're Blooze Men", I answered. She was unimpressed because obviously she didn't like "real" music. How could she? We were road dogs and she could never understand the struggles people like us faced playing blooze music.

    We arrived at our destination. At the Crossroads Bar and Grill, an upscale eatery that serves the best steak and bbq in the area as well as an amazing selection of craft beer and single malt scotches there was an open mic jam. Blind Dog and I had been waiting for this and it was our big break. The only problem is this roadside juke joint was a snakepit. If you cut with the wrong person it could end your career quick and the guy who ran the jam was all about cliques. He agreed to let Blind Dog and I have a slot, but we would have to keep the volume low and not use our own maps or fiddles. This was a big problem because I had never plugged into the obscure booteek map that was provided for the jam, plus I had to play a Strat which has the volume knob in the wrong place for blooze.

    It was an epic battle of good vs evil and for the survival of teh blooze as a genre. This diabolic jam daddy even counted off Mustang Sally in A (instead of E) to try to throw us but Blind Dog and I survived, although I vowed that night never to play another non-true bypass cable my toanz were obviously in my hands as I wowed the crowd.

    The next day we hung up our Blooze Hats and changed teams. We decided it was much easier to become men of God. Now Blind Dog and I gig in a P&W band. In a lot of ways I miss the road, the juke joints and the hard lessons you learn out there but being able to guarantee a big crowd because we play during the service and being done with the gig at 11:00 - right when Guitar Center opens makes up for it.

    Namaste my brothers in blooze!
     
    telemnemonics likes this.

  18. Wally

    Wally Telefied Ad Free Member

    Mar 17, 2003
    Lubbock, TX
    Noah, that serial number agrees with 1968. That tube chart is incorr3ct, and if you are running a GZ34 in that amp the voltages are higher than they should be for a VR. That AB568 circuit calls for a 5U4 rectifier. One thing I like about vr’s is that most of them run lower voltages than do other 6L6 Fender guitar amps....and the sonics differences between the VR and say a Pro Reverb or Bandmaster Reverb are the result of the lower B+ In the VR, ime. The GZ34 is safe to run there.....but the voltages are not ‘correct’.

    Telemnemonics, that lead dress has NOT been changed. That is stock....I have never seen another one this neat. For instance, the number of twists for the heater filaments os higher than normal, and that twisted pair is on a dead line from any direction....no sag, no veering from the line. Take a look at the circuit board and see if you see anything else??
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017 at 9:49 AM
    telemnemonics and coldengray like this.


IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.