Attenuator or plexi shield?

Discussion in 'Amp Central Station' started by charlie chitlin, Mar 9, 2019.

  1. DrB

    DrB Tele-Meister

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    Check this out:

    http://www.tdpri.com/threads/taming-5e7-head-clone-with.918268/

    As long as the vol drop is not huge. attenuators I think sound quite good provided that the OT of the amp can take a bit of extra work. For example, my 1987 clones and Vox EF86 clone with a plexi 1987 OT sound quite good with L-pad attenuators. Yet, 5e7 and 5e3 clones start behaving a bit weird and conjuring some "distortion" on top of the regular sounds especially when the vol drop is high.

    Making L-pad attenuators is not difficult. If you can swap your pickups, you can do it. The ugliest part concerns drilling holes for jacks into the enclosure. The resistors are not expensive at all...

    B

    PS. Brake Lite is an L-pad with 25Ohm paralel and either 25 or 50 Ohm series at max vol drop.
     
  2. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

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    One thing I did try with the amp in question was turning it around and push it into the back wall. I've heard 2 other amps sound great like this.
    Mine sounded horrible and I turned it after the 1st song.
    I wonder if this gave me an idea of how it would sound with a shield.
    Maybe, like almost everything, it depnds on the amp and the house.
    Maybe I need to make a cheap one out of pegboard or sheetrock or something and try it. ;)
    It's hard to imagine a piece of plastic in front of an amp helping it sound good, unless it's for mic'ing/isolation, but who knows?
     
  3. schmee

    schmee Friend of Leo's

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    Yeah, I used to do that. But now days I dislike the sound. I think in a place with hard surfaces it may be better. But last few times It sounded super middy and nasal, probably from the sound off the back of the speaker.
     
  4. schmee

    schmee Friend of Leo's

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    I had a Z28 with the factory attenuator. I sold it because it was too loud but sounded terrible with the attenuator.
     
  5. gusfinley

    gusfinley Tele-Holic

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    I attended a concert in the first few rows of a modern rock band, The opening band had a 100W marshall with the cab pointed straight at me. OUCH!

    When the main band came on, their cabs were backwards. I thought that was weird. But I didn't get the beam from just one amp and was very grateful for that!

    Another story: At college I had access the University's anechoic chamber. I took my Marshall 1987 in there and cranked it ALL the way up! I measured 67 watts output out of it! I was amazed that with the cab pointed at the non-reflective walls, I could actually stand in front of the cab and play almost comfortably.

    perhaps if you pointed the cab backwards, then put some sound absorbing material against the wall, you could get the sound you want with a mic and monitors?
     
  6. bigben55

    bigben55 Friend of Leo's

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    I dont know what to tell you. I play mine out on 2 clicks all the time, love my tone, get compliments on it all the time. Last night included. This rig exactly...[​IMG]

     
  7. schmee

    schmee Friend of Leo's

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    Glad it works for you! I have no problem with that. Tone is in the ears of the beholder for sure. Audience has no idea of the difference usually. I know musicians who love SS amps, me, cant stand 'em, but the deficits are very subtle really...
     
  8. bigben55

    bigben55 Friend of Leo's

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    I respect that. Tone is indeed in the ear of the beholder. I just cant see how you can say it "sounded terrible." I've heard some terrible sounding amps in my 30+ years of playing, but the Z28, attenuated or not, ain't one of them. Maybe it was broken??? Spent tubes/cold bias? Wrong speaker for the amp??? Idk

     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
  9. dweeb686

    dweeb686 TDPRI Member

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    What kind of amp do you use in the first place? Not sure what kind of music you are playing but in my world it would be embarrassing to use a plexi shield live
     
  10. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

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    It's a '58 Bassman. Sometimes I'd like to turn it up a little more into the sweet spot.
    I don't get embarrassed.
    Ever.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2019
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  11. bluesholyman

    bluesholyman Tele-Afflicted

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    Weber makes a harness that is suppose to "adapt" the bassman outputs for use with an attenuator - you can read about it here https://www.tedweber.com/bmh

    Now the other part of that, assuming your 58' is 2-ohm output, is that you need an attenuator that can match that and handle the wattage - again, weber has one: https://www.tedweber.com/mass

    Can't speak to how well it works but I think some people have had success with it.

    Hope you find a solution that works.

    BHM
     
  12. codamedia

    codamedia Friend of Leo's

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    Different tools for different purposes...

    Plexi is great at stopping the directional beam of the amp, but it really doesn't help with volume.
    An attenuator helps with volume, but it doesn't help with the directional beam of the amp.

    Identify your problem... choose the tool!
     
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  13. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

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    I think I'll just continue playing too loud.
    Cheap, easy and fun.
     
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  14. schmee

    schmee Friend of Leo's

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    Well, maybe only terrible to me and that is probably an exaggeration. But If I'm not in the "tone zone" at the volume I need to be at for the venue... I'm not having fun. Nah, the amp was fine when not attenuated, the speaker was a nice Red Fang. But attenuated it was just a bit lifeless and kinda had a... "wet blanket over the amp" tone to me. But I'm not looking for ZZ Top tone. I kinda wish I had kept it for outdoor gigs, probably woulda been great for that and a small package. But realistically, indoor I use a Deluxe Reverb and it's almost always on 3.
     
  15. Old Deaf Roadie

    Old Deaf Roadie Tele-Meister

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    My former employer provided house sound for a nightclub that had a plexi for the drum riser. It spoiled me...
     
  16. bftfender

    bftfender Friend of Leo's

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    trainwreck 3 PPIMV, play my jmp50 at whisper levels to whatever is needed. The type of MV basically brings down..retains all the goodies..it will become slightly nastier tho(good thing) as vol comes down but move knobs to adjust it back ...people laugh at me..my plexi is the best bedroom amp no shields-atten..just a simple add on to make the amp do all things needed at all levels
     
  17. teledude66

    teledude66 Friend of Leo's

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    I've been thinking of making a plexi shield. We played at a brewery, and the owner was there, and doesn't like bands loud. My Vibrolux was on 1-2 and the sound guy kept telling me to turn down, I'm thinking, dude, I'm in at the bottom now, there's nowhere to go. I think in that case it was more perceived loud, than actually loud. They were micing us, and I finally just moved the mic away, I couldn't even hear myself with it tilted back, aimed at my head. I think if I had it dispersed some it may have helped.
     
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  18. archetype

    archetype Fiend of Leo's Silver Supporter

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    I haven't used one, but it strikes me that shields are good mainly for live or recording situations that are miked and the guitar is in the monitors/headphones. Otherwise, you're not going to get stage volume and decent tone, if that's what you like/need when playing.

    I saw Bill Kirchen play 2 songs through a BF Deluxe Reverb with a plexi shield, then pick up the shield and toss it to the back of the stage.
     
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  19. bigben55

    bigben55 Friend of Leo's

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    If you ever get another chance, try a different speaker. Red Fangs are great, but they're VERY loud and very midrange heavy. The Z28 is midrange heavy itself. Crank that combination up, then add attenuator compression, and I can hear that wet blanket of mids from here. I had a Greenback for a bit, same thing but not as loud. The G12H30 types are more recessed in the mid and WORK better here.


     
  20. dweeb686

    dweeb686 TDPRI Member

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    I know this is a completely different beast, but swapping my clean channel preamp tube in my Deville from 12AX7 to 12AY7 made it a lot easier to find that sweet spot without blasting my face off. And 12AU7 worked even better for me.
     
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