5F1 (Champ) through a 12 inch ceramic speaker...who's done it, is it worth it?

Discussion in 'Amp Tech Center' started by cmm71, Nov 15, 2015.

  1. cmm71

    cmm71 Tele-Meister Gold Supporter

    Posts:
    216
    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2007
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Hey All,

    I have a nicely built 5F1 chassis that's set up for an 8 ohm speaker. I had originally planned to mount it into a custom cab with a 12 inch speaker, that's why I had him give me the 8 ohm tap instead of the standard 4 ohm. Then I changed my mind and loaded it into a Mojo cab and bought an 8 ohm, 8 inch Jensen alnico speaker for it. We all know how nice a classic tweed Champ sounds and this one nails it. Now I'm wondering, what would it have sounded like if I'd have stayed the course and loaded into a bigger cab with a 12 inch speaker. Has anyone ever done this? Can someone tell me what a little 5 watt 5F1 circuit sounds like through a 12 inch ceramic speaker? Is the bottom fuller, does it transform the amp's tone at all? Does it sound just like a Champ, our does the larger package spoil the magic? Is there any point to it?
     
  2. robrob

    robrob Poster Extraordinaire Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    7,431
    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Location:
    United States
    Yes it's been done. A 12" vs. a 10" of the same model speaker sounds louder, fuller and usually better.
     
  3. MickM

    MickM Friend of Leo's Ad Free Member

    Posts:
    4,343
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2006
    Location:
    A steel guitar engagment.
    If anything,you get more versatility.You don't lose anything by going into a 1x12 cab, actually gain some headroom and volume.
    My Li'l Dawg 8W 5F1 has a 12" Celestion Gold and an external jack in a Mather tweed cab which is a great rig for raw blues/early Zep or mellow cleans. (just ride the vol/tone controls). Also sounds bigger and louder with another 12 added like a weber silver bell or whatever you like.

    Got a buddy with a 4x12 cab? Plug it in and run everything on 10. Should make you giggle like Phil X.
     
  4. Guitarteach

    Guitarteach Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    7,569
    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2014
    Location:
    UK
    Yep. Ran my modded tweed champ build with my EVM 12" first, then my 2x12" boogie cab. Awesome tones, much bigger and fuller tone.

    Go for it. It's with an alnico blue now but I've swapped around with a Celestion g12m. Very similar tones.
     
  5. LKB3rd

    LKB3rd Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,617
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2013
    Location:
    CT
    Victoria 5112 amp is just this and it sounds great. Like stated above, a little louder, a little more bass.
    I've been running my Blackface Vibro Champ through a 1 x 12 closed back cabinet intended for a Bassman and it sounds really good too. It has a WGS Veteran 30 in it.
     
  6. 6942

    6942 Poster Extraordinaire

    Age:
    65
    Posts:
    6,333
    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2006
    Location:
    Santa Fe, NM
    5F1 home built clone, into an opened back EarCandy 1x12 cab with a 1960 Jensen P12R speaker.

    Steve
     
  7. cmm71

    cmm71 Tele-Meister Gold Supporter

    Posts:
    216
    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2007
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Interesting. I have a 12 inch Eminence Alissandro SC64 speaker that I had already bought for the original project. I may give this a go. Thanks all.
     
  8. charlie chitlin

    charlie chitlin Doctor of Teleocity Silver Supporter

    Age:
    57
    Posts:
    13,405
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2003
    Location:
    Spring City, Pa
    I've got a tweed Princeton driving a 12 and it's pretty damned glorious.
     
  9. dankilling

    dankilling Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,437
    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2014
    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    My son's AA764 champ pushes a '67 Jensen 12" ceramic. Sounds fantastic.
     
  10. JazzboxBlues

    JazzboxBlues Tele-Afflicted

    Posts:
    1,241
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2014
    Location:
    Crook County IL
    I have a Clark 12" 5F1 that had a Celestion Blue until I installed a Victoria Eminence speaker. They both sound really nice but I prefer the Eminence.
     
  11. mgwhit

    mgwhit Tele-Holic

    Posts:
    873
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2008
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    I played my 6L6 5F2A through a 2x10" with pretty efficient speakers (Eminence Ragin' Cajun and Ramrod) at band practice yesterday, and it was the first time I've really had enough clean headroom with that amp to cut through when I took a lead. I've tried it through a 1x12" with a Greenback and loved the sound, but never actually played with the band that way.
     
  12. bparnell57

    bparnell57 Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    5,961
    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2014
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    I played my Muchxs 5F1 (stock alnico 6x9) through the 12" Celestion Seventy 80 in my Sundown which I'm about to get rid of actually, and it took the amp to a whole new level.

    Same deal with playing it through the 2x10 Celestions in my Prosonic. It was basically like having a Marshall 18 watt style circuit that had a volume knob, nice balanced tone settings, and reasonable volume. It screamed, roared, and could fill a room with warm cleans.

    It however was missing any sort of speaker compression or breakup due to the low powered amp.

    This is where the stock 6x9 comes in. Amazing tone for the stock champ cab size.
     
  13. seekir

    seekir Tele-Holic

    Age:
    64
    Posts:
    685
    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2007
    Location:
    Hilo, Hawaii
    Posted by MickM:
    Though I think my new Monoprice 6V6 5W is a bit louder and maybe better in some ways through my Bravo 112's speaker, what may be lost is the portability and convenience of a lighter, smaller speaker and cab. Maybe a 12" external cab for the show would make sense?
     
  14. Doctorx33

    Doctorx33 Tele-Afflicted

    Age:
    63
    Posts:
    1,439
    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Location:
    Atlanta
    Hell, I run my home built 5F1 through a JBL D130.
     
  15. bparnell57

    bparnell57 Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    5,961
    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2014
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA

    That's the beauty of a stock 5F1 or an optimized Little Morph aka Muchxs' flexible 5 watt combo, when loaded with an 8" or 6x9".

    The combo is lighter and more portable than most 20 watt heads. Add a little extension speaker jack that cuts out the internal speaker like mine has and you can use your champ as a head all day long.

    Use an oversized set of transformers, with output windings for 4 or 8 ohms, or even 4-8-16 if you can find it (PS look at old hifi and integrated amps from projectors) and throw in a 5881, and you have a champ that can be a nice little combo for warm clean quiet practice, or it can be loud enough to gig with if you put it through a very efficient 2x10, 2x12, 1x15, or 4x12 cab.
     
  16. bluesfordan

    bluesfordan Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,724
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2006
    Location:
    Nashua NH
    I've run my SF champ in a musicmaster bass amp cabinet with a jensen C12N and it sounded fantastic.

    I've procured a 1x12 combo cab to house the chassis and speaker in, can't wait to do the swap.
     
  17. bparnell57

    bparnell57 Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    5,961
    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2014
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA

    But the champ chassis would fit in the Musicmaster Bass cab. Why not put it in that and then put the Musicmaster bass amp in a custom 2x10 stacked vertical cab, or head cab?
     
  18. jmp81sc

    jmp81sc Tele-Meister

    Posts:
    223
    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2015
    Location:
    Orange County
    I use a 5F2A that I built as a head, through a Cannabis Rex in a big box that sounds great. I use it for band practice at lower volume and could easily do coffee house or quieter gigs with it.
     
  19. bluesfordan

    bluesfordan Friend of Leo's

    Posts:
    2,724
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2006
    Location:
    Nashua NH
    Of the two amps, I liked the champ better. I used the musicmaster to procure the custom champ cab. The custom cab is slightly taller than my Princeton NR and I'm hoping to get to it this weekend to assemble.

    I need a handle. Use the black vinyl handle from the silver face cab or buy a brown leather handle to match the ostrich tolex and wheat grill
     
  20. bparnell57

    bparnell57 Poster Extraordinaire

    Posts:
    5,961
    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2014
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA

    Hmmm. Sounds like a cool cabinet. I know who builds big champ cabs! Haha.
     
IMPORTANT: Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult!
No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.