Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com
Asher Guitars WD Music Products Amplified Parts Mod Kits DIY Nordstarnd Pickups Warmoth.com

5E3 Build using 1951 Radio parts

Discussion in 'Shock Brother's DIY Amps' started by kneedeepinit, Oct 25, 2017.

  1. corliss1

    corliss1 Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

    Sep 13, 2008
    Lansing, MI
    The pictures aren't showing up for me - I get a broken image.
     

  2. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    for some reason, I can't upload a picture so I have provided a direct link
     

  3. corliss1

    corliss1 Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

    Sep 13, 2008
    Lansing, MI
    So I'm not really a fan - tone control wiring has to cross more high voltage than usual with the power tubes right there, then a long run from the power tubes and OT to the jacks. I mean, in my brain anyway, the 5E3 is pretty well documented and while the standard layout is cramped for space in the Fender style chassis, it does work out nicely. If you want to tweak the grounds, fine, but it really doesn't need a whole lot of adjusting being a simple circuit from back when.

    There's always room to improve things, but I use a pretty traditional layout with things just spaced apart a hair more so it looks prettier and I don't have any noise/ground/hum issues.
     

  4. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    Corliss, I checked the traditional layout and see what you mean about the location of the 6V6.

    I have room to move the 6V6 to the back in front of the output transformer. This would put them away from the tone controls and be a very short run to the output transformer. I would then move the 5Y3 closer to the front but still next to the PT.


    Thank you for the comments. Is there anything else that I should look at?
     

  5. corliss1

    corliss1 Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

    Sep 13, 2008
    Lansing, MI
    I don't know if you're following the old school layout, but no one does the heaters grounded to one side anymore like the Fender layout. It's all connected to 4/5 and 9 on the preamp tubes and then 2 and 7 of the 6V6 tubes. I'm assuming you know that, but just pointing it out to be complete.
     

  6. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    I was thinking of using this one. The path I see is PT to pilot light, the 6V6 to 6V6 to 12ax7 to 12ax7.

    [​IMG]
     

  7. corliss1

    corliss1 Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

    Sep 13, 2008
    Lansing, MI
    Nope - that's the one you don't want to use :D

    Do the heaters like this, the rest like the Fender layout:


    5E3Ceriatone_edit.jpg
     

  8. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    I am glad I asked as I would have used the other one. I will review my layout and post an update when I figure it out.

    One question, for the indicator light, I need to tie in the 6.3 volts somewhere. Can you suggest the best location or does it matter?

    Do all of the star ground connections go to one singular point or should there be two star grounds?
     

  9. corliss1

    corliss1 Tele-Afflicted Gold Supporter

    Sep 13, 2008
    Lansing, MI
    Daisy chain just how you said - power transformer to pilot, then to tubes. Just use the two-wire system on the Ceriatone layout and not the one-wire system on the Fender.

    People get crazy when you talk about how to star ground. Fender did each separate ground to chassis, I do a couple different points, other people isolate everything and do just one, so it's really up to you. I've heard and seen good results with all methods.
     
    robrob likes this.

  10. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    I should be getting my turret board tomorrow so it will be a busy weekend. I was unhappy with the scratches so I sanded down to metal and two coats of primer. I should have done this on the first paint attempt.

    I also drilled out the grommet holes for the secondary transformer in order to rotate it 180 degrees. This will allow proper orientation to minimize wire lengths as per direction from corliss

    [​IMG]
     

  11. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    so this is the revised layout. For this picture, I am using a turret board which is significatnly loneger than the one I will be getting from mojotones but it shows the approximate location.

    The 2 power tubes are now right next to the output transformer and they should not interfere with the tone control signals. All of the tubes are on one side of the turret board, the controls and input jacks are on the other.

    The lead wires will be longer than a conventional build but the orientations look closer. I think I have to mirror image the turret board in order to get the connections to the tubes / controls on the correct side

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2017
    robrob likes this.

  12. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    OK, I have hit a snag. I definitely have to mirror image the turret board in order to simulate the conventional layout. My second lesson in this build is to consider the turret board before cutting the hole for the main transformer and the knobs / jacks. It did not dawn on me to check the turret board first when doing a custom build.

    Does anyone have a drawingfor a mirror imaged 5E3 turret board? Even if the value or some components are different, it will be a good starting point. I am pretty much convinced that I am going to mess up the polarity of something without a good drawing to reference when assembling the turret board and the hookup wires.
     

  13. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    my brain doesn't work real well with mirror images so this took quite a few trials before I think I have it right. Below is my interpretation of a mirror imaged 5e3 turret board. Maybe a mod can change the title of this thread to say Mirror Image 5E3 from 1951 radio components. Trying to find a mirror image on google was not successful. I suspect that this thread showing a mirror image will have greater future relevance than a thread showing my fabrication skills

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2017

  14. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    here is an image showing the interconnecting wires

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2017

  15. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    here is an image which shows the wires that connect to the valves and controls. The color wires refelct the colors used in the ceriatone 5E3 layout corliss provided above. The destination of the wires reflects the mojotone schematic layout but they use mostly yellow wire. I like using multiple color wires as there ends up being less chance of mistakes when I go to hook up the completed turret board.

    If I have made a mistake, please let me know and I will fix it and post it so that future non-planners like me will have a correct drawing.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2017
    Fiat_cc likes this.

  16. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    the kit was delivered today so I am off to the races. The first job was to populate the turret board. Here is a picture of a mirror image 5E3 turret board

    [​IMG]
     

  17. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    some more pics. I am not going to solder for a day or two until I know that I have not made any mistakes. If anyone can review and comment, I would be gratefull

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     

  18. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    the chassis is now fully drilled out. One more coat of primer than a few coats of paint and clear coat.

    [​IMG]
     

  19. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    I got bored and decided to install the leads and solder the joints. If anyone sees a mistake, I can always correct it. It pays to triple check because I missed a lead. I ended up having to solder it from the underside of the turret but it should be fine.

    [​IMG]
     

  20. kneedeepinit

    kneedeepinit TDPRI Member

    Age:
    54
    34
    Oct 3, 2017
    calgary
    this is what it is going to look like in the chassis

    [​IMG]
     
    Fiat_cc likes this.

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