1 + 1 = 3 ?

Discussion in 'The Stomp Box' started by RetroTeleRod, May 7, 2019.

  1. 11 Gauge

    11 Gauge Doctor of Teleocity

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    The most memorable stacking success that I recall was from roughly a couple of years ago. I was running a Bosstone-like fuzz into a mildly modified OD-3. It was a more rare instance of having three equally great sounds. The OD-3 on its own was fairly mild, kind of like an amp just starting to budge a little bit, just starting to sweat some. The Bosstone on its own was "pretty much Spirit in the Sky," if that makes sense. The Bosstone into the OD-3 had this incredible vibe with controllable feedback at somewhat modest volumes. The OD-3 tamed the Bosstone's buzzier characteristics just the right amount - it made it so that there was almost the effect of running a fuzz into a dimed amp.
     
  2. 4pickupguy

    4pickupguy Poster Extraordinaire

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    Not sure if anyone else has experienced this but the BD-2 sounds so great in front of a chain but sounds like a box of hammered Shih Tzu with any high out put pedal in front of it. The input level to that pedal is really touchy. I have a buddy who runs a BD-2 in front of an AT Angry Charlie set to a crunch tone into a Hot Rod Deluxe and it is glorious. He pushes the AC with the BD-2 for lead tones and it screams. I can see why Andy Timmons uses them. I guess it is the whole gain staging thing. The worst combo I have tried is my Rat into my Silver Pony (klone), just Yoko Ono bad, like really bad. The Rats ridiculous low end just isnt kind to any pedal down stream. The BD-2 into the Rat isnt very nice either. With my current rig I can only run my Rat by itself on the clean channel. I have been running it a pretty high gain and rolling off the volume knob for surprisingly cleaned up tone. Man what a great pedal the Rat is.
    Ages ago I had a TS and two Rats into 2 Super Reverbs. One Rat was set to crunch the other to a lead tone. Punching the crunchy Rat with the TS is the lead tone I used 80% of the time. My current rig has a very Super Reverb'esque vibe to it, but, a TS sounds aweful through it, just aweful.
     
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  3. Lies&Distortion

    Lies&Distortion Tele-Holic

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    I liked the Ethos alone best, then the first example, then the 2nd. On my computer at low volumes. But they all sounded good.

    Seems like having the pedal with the most bass last in line works best for stacking, like you say about the Rat.

    But I only hear that tinkering, by myself. Jamming with friends - I don't have time for subtle stacking and I can't imagine trying it in front of an audience. But that's me - might work for others. I'll still push a fuzz into an OD for "crazy distortion" solo stuff. But not for a base tone.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2019
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  4. Hatfield92

    Hatfield92 Tele-Meister

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    I use a JHS modded Rat2 coupled with a DeltaLab tube overdrive.

    With the Rat, which comes first in the signal path, I’m seeking the smoothest, most filtered version of overdrive I can muster. I want little-to-no actual crunch at this point. What I do want is sustain, some compression and harmonic magic. The Rat can provide all manners of distorted savagery, but I left that hangup in my twenties.

    The Deltalab pedal gives me the type of grit I actually want: something that sounds in the ballpark of real tube overdrive. It works quite well, especially paired with the Rat set up the way I use it.

    I have both pedals set up so that the outgoing sound level is the same whether the pedal is actually engaged or not. I use my guitar to adjust my volume. This way, I can use any combination of my pedals and the volume remains all relatively the same.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2019
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  5. RetroTeleRod

    RetroTeleRod Poster Extraordinaire

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    :lol::lol::lol: Oh my, that is bad! :lol::lol::lol:
     
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  6. artdecade

    artdecade Poster Extraordinaire

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    Thanks to Frank.

     
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  7. 4pickupguy

    4pickupguy Poster Extraordinaire

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    Wow, Ok ok, maybe I way over exaggerated how bad my Rat into the Klone is..... Not sure a cat into a blender sounds that bad...
     
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  8. RetroTeleRod

    RetroTeleRod Poster Extraordinaire

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    Tried stacking my Gain Changer into my Plimsoul last night. It's a good match too. :cool:
     
  9. 11 Gauge

    11 Gauge Doctor of Teleocity

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    Fully agree with that, unless the intention is for some kind of "out there" effect.

    And even if it doesn't sound bad with a more bassy pedal overwhelming the next one in line, you still end up with the bass filtered out, which kind of defeats the purpose.

    ...Which is why I never understood why anyone would prefer stacking a pair of pedals that are overly light on bass, like two Tubescreamers.

    If you analyze the circuit of more complex drive boxes, you'll typically find that what makes them sound more amp-like, or "harmonically rich," or whatever, is due to the fact that you've kind of got the equivalent of hardwired stacked pedals, internally.

    ...In the case of something like the BD-2, it's got the least bass at the 1st gain stage, then gets a bunch of bass added at a hardwired tone circuit, then adds more bass at the 2nd gain stage, and then has a "post-volume" (active) bass boost, on its output. IMO, that's why stacking with the BD-2 is so tricky, because it's already internally hardwired as multiple stacked drive boxes (with a boost on the output).

    I'd imagine that if someone wanted better performance by stacking something BD-2'ish with other pedals that they may want to try its (IMO) predecessor - the OD-2. With the OD-2, there's no post-volume bass boost, so its output is way more mild (and probably is what made it less appealing than the BD-2). IOW, the OD-2 is a bit less "internally hardwired as multiple stacked drive box circuits," especially in non-turbo mode (is literally just a single gain stage with a passive tone circuit, IIRC).
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
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  10. kevsonic

    kevsonic Tele-Meister

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  11. RetroTeleRod

    RetroTeleRod Poster Extraordinaire

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    Gain Changer on main board...
    IMG_20190505_150332.jpg
    Timmy on travel board...Oh yeah!
    IMG_20190421_220337011.jpg
     
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  12. 65 Champ Amp

    65 Champ Amp Tele-Afflicted

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    You should be ashamed. I'm pretty sure you could have found an esoteric boutique or two that would do the same thing.:D

    I think I've seen you say the same thing in another thread recently. Tell us how you have the two DS1s set. I'm wagering lower gain than some would expect.

    Agree with whoever said a compressor counts. Not only does it sound fatter and fuller, but it makes anything behind it saturate more. Tried some others, but realized that I always dialed them in to try to duplicate the sound of my old DOD Milkbox, so I quit messing around and put the MB back on the board.

    I have a modded BD2, set with the gain around 10:00, going into a Spark Booster on the Fat setting with the gain maxed. That SB gives a really nice non-grainy light od on it's own that is addictive (to me).
     
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  13. gkterry

    gkterry Tele-Meister

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    >>>>1 = 1 - 3 ?

    Yes! New Math.
     
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  14. RetroTeleRod

    RetroTeleRod Poster Extraordinaire

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    Like so...
    Pedal #1 - one tone
    Pedal #2 - second tone
    Both together - third tone.

    When you think about it it's as easy a ACB.
     
  15. stevemc

    stevemc Tele-Meister

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    i stack a ts9 into a bd2.both keeley modded.ts gain down level max.bd gain 10ish level to taste.also a ts into a black secret is nice for a change.
     
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  16. Marc Morfei

    Marc Morfei Tele-Holic

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    Yes, this exactly. Set two or more to different degrees of light gain, then combine as needed.
     
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  17. j5jarod777

    j5jarod777 Tele-Meister

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    Took the Full-Drive 2 off and put the Blues Driver back on the board. BD-2 into a Marvel Drive sounds great.
     
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  18. twangjeff

    twangjeff Tele-Afflicted

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    I think about the mids. Essentially something with mids going into something with flat mids. A TS type into a Blues driver type works well, a Klon type into a DOD 250 type works well. Also like 11 Gauge said, using the overdrive to be a 'dirty amp' and then putting a fuzz in front works great.

    My fave combo for fuzzy sounds is the Vick Audio '73 Rams Head --> Sparkle Drive, of course I'm going into a Carr Rambler which is a BF fender style amp without a ton of midrange so those 2 together work really nicely.
     
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  19. 4pickupguy

    4pickupguy Poster Extraordinaire

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    This thread has me revisiting my "crunch" drive. Re-auditioned a few dusty drives again:
    1. I cant seem to get a Mojo Mojo to work on my rig with anything, anywhere.
    2. My Klone (BYOB Silver Pony) sounds pretty good for pushing the Ethos preamp but its missing the BF Fender vibe of the BD-2. On this rig I am discovering that I'm not a Klone guy yet.
    3. The Blue Note is very versatile pedal. It works anywhere in the chain and can go from transparent push box to mid centered drive and sounds fantastic. I am adding it to the board again.
    4. There is something about the Nobels Odr-1 that I'm not bonding with anymore either, so, off it comes again.

    I've decided I am going to a Damp/Dry/Damp rig and all of this will no doubt change anyway. My GAS is way out pacing my pocket book lately....
     
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  20. noah330

    noah330 Friend of Leo's

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    Klon into 808 here.
     
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