Should Church Musicians be....friends?

[Thighbanez]

I'm asking this because I keep feeling the urge to be friends with everyone in the music section but the sentiment is not being returned. I'm having a hard time leaving it at the music because I would like to learn more.

I have ZERO opportunities to play with anyone outside of church (before anyone asks) so I believe that is why I feel such an urge to "hang about" and try to be these people's friend when I don't even know them and they obviously don't like me much. I know I'm not like them at all and I know I'm smart enough to realize I don't fit in besides playing guitar.

I just like playing music.

[StootMonster]

Don't sweat it, Thighbanez. You have ton consider the nature of online 'friendships'. They are as simple as "add friend" "delete friend". You have to take them with a grain of salt as far as getting hurt or frustrated by them. Nothing wrong with putting your full energy into it, how else would you actually make a true friend otherwise?

Anything you looking to know, go ahead and ask it. If I can help, I'll surely explain techniques, tips, tricks, licks etc...

[StootMonster]

Also, this isn't a very frequented area of the forum. Seems like sometimes days go by with no posts.

[TxTeleMan]

Should? I don't know.

It's like at work... I don't have to like the people I sit close to, but as long as they are professional in their job, we'll get along just fine.

I played at two churches in the last 10 years. I can't be friends with everyone, but I tried to be professional and get along with everyone, and hoped that at least respect that I was musical. One church contained a lot of folks who had a long history together, and I was never part on the "in crowd". Not much I could do about that, except to earn some musical respect.

Your situation?

Be a friend... make a friend.

[goldtopper]

Go out for coffee between services. That way, it's sort of in between Church and social. If anything's gonna happen, it may well at the coffee shop.

[StootMonster]

Wow did I misread that or what?

doh!

People are people. You have to just try to relate and if they still won't be open, then don't bother, just be friendly and love one another just like "the entity who may or may not have created humanity" has commanded us to.

[Bolide]

I didn't know Quakers had instrumental music in their services.

[Jhengsman]

Originally Posted by Thighbanez

I'm asking this because I keep feeling the urge to be friends with everyone in the music section but the sentiment is not being returned. I'm having a hard time leaving it at the music because I would like to learn more.

I have ZERO opportunities to play with anyone outside of church (before anyone asks) so I believe that is why I feel such an urge to "hang about" and try to be these people's friend when I don't even know them and they obviously don't like me much. I know I'm not like them at all and I know I'm smart enough to realize I don't fit in besides playing guitar.

I just like playing music.

I take it you are not a member of this church. In effect you may not see you as part of the family just hired help as they pray for a member to step forward and fill your seat. If you are a church member, I don't know what to say.

Originally Posted by Bolide

I didn't know Quakers had instrumental music in their services.

There are two basic groups of Quakers, Programmed Quakers are much like Mainline Protestant churches. Unprogrammed Quakers will come in to a meeting and sit in silence until the spirit moves somebody to speak.

[still_fiddlin]

It may not [just] be you. It depends on whether all the other band members are in the same congregation, how long they've all been playing together, and how long you've been in the band, etc. I'm in my 2nd church band, and while I like everyone, I don't really get the impression we have that much in common other than the church music. Plus, if it's a part time thing for everyone, as these things can be, there may just not be any time left in their schedule for "hanging out." Just relax and be yourself. Also, if the band members are active in the church, find out what fellowship activities they like. Show up there and see if you like the same things. That will help you decide whether there's any areas of common interest, besides the music.

[bawdyli'lmonkey]

I do believe that its important to be friends with people in your ministry team. Its a business of sorts, but its so much more. Community, family, "account-a-bili-buddies," support group... You may not get along with everyone, I know I have my favorites, but if you or they are only in it for the music the point of church is being missed... maybe suggest a group study of Acts 2?

[Tamo101]

I totally agree with everyone here.

As a former leader of my home church, I tried to make sure that we were a family first and bandmates a distant third or fourth. In a religious situation, relationships on-stage can be reflected in the music and if things are anonymous or even rocky between musicians, there can be distractions for the congregation.

Have you tried to get together after service/practice for coffee/food? These little things will build friendships over time.

[eedwards]

Relationships take time to develop. How long have you been in the band? You have been 'allowed' to play with the band, so I'd say give it some time.

Maybe the whole band is made of introverts who don't like to talk a lot anyway. Or as was stated earlier, maybe everyone has limited time to play and there is no time to 'hang-out'.

You said they don't like you much - why do you think that? I assume that you did not do anything offensive, but you need to examine you actions prior to joining the band and immediately afterward to see if you did something that crossed a line for someone. You may not think it was a big deal, but they might and they are trying to be nice, but not overly so.

Just ideas, see if any help.

[franchelB]

I play music with quite a few church musicians at our church at one time or another. I try to get along with them, but I also get the feeling that some don't feel the same way about me...

which is not a big deal to me. I play music at church because it's my way of prayer. If people like my "joyful noise", then great! If I make friends because of it, even better!! But I know I can't please everybody, (and in this case, it's some of the other musicians), then too bad. I'm not at church to impress my critics.

[jb12string]

Unfriendly people at church is very unfortunate. How long have you been playing with them?
It's actually almost funny, the person that probably likes me the least in our praise band is my brother...

[bawdyli'lmonkey]

Originally Posted by jb12string

It's actually almost funny, the person that probably likes me the least in our praise band is my brother...

nice. ;)

[bawdyli'lmonkey]

Originally Posted by franchelB

I play music with quite a few church musicians at our church at one time or another. I try to get along with them, but I also get the feeling that some don't feel the same way about me...

How big is your church and the music ministry you participate in? What is the ministry motivation? Are you an entertainment venue using ONLY the best or an equipping station willing to train less skilled future members? Pro Session musicians vs body of Christ growing together as in Acts 2. I think that has a lot to do with it.

my group is the same 12 every week, for us its extremely important that we more than get along. If we don't, it really does have a negative impact.

[livinblood]

To make friends you must be a friend. Also it is very important for the worship team to get along. You may not all be true friends with each other but you should at least get along. It is not only your form of prayer and worship as an individual but your also an element of the team that leads the congregation into worship. If there is a clash then there will be a struggle during worship; spiritually speaking.

To end I would say go into prayer for guidance.

[Rubsoul]

Originally Posted by franchelB

I play music with quite a few church musicians at our church at one time or another. I try to get along with them, but I also get the feeling that some don't feel the same way about me...
which is not a big deal to me. I play music at church because it's my way of prayer. If people like my "joyful noise", then great! If I make friends because of it, even better!! But I know I can't please everybody, (and in this case, it's some of the other musicians), then too bad. I'm not at church to impress my critics.

I like how FranchelB put's it above.
Churches, are kinda like life. You probally can count your true friends on one hand, and then there is the other people you know.
Being new is no fun, alot of hand shakers, but also alot of judgement going on. Me and the wilfe are going to a new church, just got a new Pastor, and we are not in any click. (kinda feel on the outside).
Karaoke screen is the current form of worship....
The new Pastor wants a full Worship band... and he now knows both me and my wife can play guitar. I'm eagerly waiting for the new Pastor to get settled and see how this pans out.
Hey Thighbanez, your a step ahead of us being in the band. Give your bandmates some time.
John

[Thighbanez]

Originally Posted by TxTeleMan

Should? I don't know.

It's like at work... I don't have to like the people I sit close to, but as long as they are professional in their job, we'll get along just fine.

I played at two churches in the last 10 years. I can't be friends with everyone, but I tried to be professional and get along with everyone, and hoped that at least respect that I was musical. One church contained a lot of folks who had a long history together, and I was never part on the "in crowd". Not much I could do about that, except to earn some musical respect.

Your situation?

Be a friend... make a friend.

That's the exact situation I'm in. I am just not part of the "IN" crowd for whatever reason. I think that the more I accept that...the better off I will be instead of expecting something that isn't going to happen. All of us in the music ministry love music...I guess we just operate in different circles. There is a distinct difference between us all though. I'm not like them in the fact that I don't like hip-hop, Gospel or most "Black" music. I'm more into Hendrix, Mayer, Tool, Depeche Mode, Boards of Canada and Contemporary Christian music. I don't get or understand a lot of the references they have and use and when I try to listen to the music it bores me.

Originally Posted by goldtopper

Go out for coffee between services. That way, it's sort of in between Church and social. If anything's gonna happen, it may well at the coffee shop.

I tried that as well, but outside of church and music I really have nothing in common with them. I don't understand their jokes, I don't listen to their music, I don't talk like them and I don't even watch the same things on TV that they do. Just feel like I'm on the opposite end of the seesaw as everyone.

Originally Posted by Jhengsman

I take it you are not a member of this church. In effect you may not see you as part of the family just hired help as they pray for a member to step forward and fill your seat. If you are a church member, I don't know what to say.

Well, that's the sad part then. I've been a member of this church since 2003. I have played guitar since 2006, but recently (2009) started playing in church so that I could learn to play with others. I do a lot in the church besides play guitar. I produce and manage the DVD and CD ministry and also manage the video recording and electronics repairs. I've done that pretty much since I joined the church...I guess that's all people will ever see me as. The quiet guy in the back managing the machines. Talk about being pigeonholed.

Originally Posted by still_fiddlin

It may not [just] be you. It depends on whether all the other band members are in the same congregation, how long they've all been playing together, and how long you've been in the band, etc. I'm in my 2nd church band, and while I like everyone, I don't really get the impression we have that much in common other than the church music. Plus, if it's a part time thing for everyone, as these things can be, there may just not be any time left in their schedule for "hanging out." Just relax and be yourself. Also, if the band members are active in the church, find out what fellowship activities they like. Show up there and see if you like the same things. That will help you decide whether there's any areas of common interest, besides the music.

I often get the same feeling. This is my first church band and while everyone ignores me, they don't seem to have any problems asking me for computer help or requesting my help rewiring the whole audio section for the musicians pit so things look more "Professional" (Which I have been avoiding because of my bad feelings). I don't want to help them because when I do I'm not included in the benefits. For Example: The last time I helped re-organize the church audio and musicians area, the rest of the music ministry had a jam session at the church. Now, I knew about the session because I overheard the drummer asking the other musicians if they were coming...but no one invited me. So now, I am not volunteering my services to help anyone. Why should I only to get kicked in the butt?

Originally Posted by bawdyli'lmonkey

I do believe that its important to be friends with people in your ministry team. Its a business of sorts, but its so much more. Community, family, "account-a-bili-buddies," support group... You may not get along with everyone, I know I have my favorites, but if you or they are only in it for the music the point of church is being missed... maybe suggest a group study of Acts 2?

If you're referring to the whole "Footstool" thing...I get you. I guess I will just have to continue to play and just trust in my faith to get me by without being a sucker.

Originally Posted by eedwards

Relationships take time to develop. How long have you been in the band? You have been 'allowed' to play with the band, so I'd say give it some time.

Maybe the whole band is made of introverts who don't like to talk a lot anyway. Or as was stated earlier, maybe everyone has limited time to play and there is no time to 'hang-out'.

You said they don't like you much - why do you think that? I assume that you did not do anything offensive, but you need to examine you actions prior to joining the band and immediately afterward to see if you did something that crossed a line for someone. You may not think it was a big deal, but they might and they are trying to be nice, but not overly so.
Just ideas, see if any help.

Well, most of the band are close friends outside of church...that or siblings.
Before I came along, the only musicians were the keyboardist and drummer. The old drummer has since left and been replaced (wanted to be paid for his services) and the keyboardist was the only melody instrument doing everything. Now that I am there I have noticed a competitive spirit and so has the pastor. He has prayed over the two of us openly in front of the church for peace and not to have a competitive spirit. I know that he notices that when I play, his son (The keyboardist) always tries to play over me or asks me to play the same thing as him. I have explained to him that every instrument has their place and I can't play the same lines as him in the same key because then what would be the point of me playing? If he is playing low, I play in a higher key. If he is playing in the high keys, I play low or in the relative key so that it adds to the music and fills it out. He is spoiled in the fact that he has been self-trained and the only music/melody instrument in the church since it started in 1998. He is also only 22 and still relatively immature...which I can understand. However, these things don't make it any easier to get him to understand. I dunno, maybe it's me? I've only had training from playing Bass in another worship band and from a Paul Baloche worship learning DVD... I know I don't know it all, but I know that we can do better if we would just work with each other instead of him trying to cover everything.

Originally Posted by Rubsoul

I like how FranchelB put's it above.
Churches, are kinda like life. You probally can count your true friends on one hand, and then there is the other people you know.
Being new is no fun, alot of hand shakers, but also alot of judgement going on. Me and the wilfe are going to a new church, just got a new Pastor, and we are not in any click. (kinda feel on the outside).
Karaoke screen is the current form of worship....
The new Pastor wants a full Worship band... and he now knows both me and my wife can play guitar. I'm eagerly waiting for the new Pastor to get settled and see how this pans out.
Hey Thighbanez, your a step ahead of us being in the band. Give your bandmates some time.
John

I will give it time and continue to push on. I'm going to play guitar and I'm going to play how I know regardless of the haters. If they don't want to include me, it won't stop my learning or me playing. I will continue to let my gift make room for me. I will not be used/abused and I won't take this all so personally.
It's only church folk...the focus IS and always will be worship.

Thank you all.

[scooteraz]

Wow, this really depends on your definition of friends. I have any number of what we will call subject matter or activity friends. I have friends who I hunt and fish with, shoot with, play basketball with, scuba with, skydive with, fly with, bicycle with, motorcycle with, ski with, rock climb with, work with and by the by, play music with in a church environment. Many of those I only see in the mutual interest environment, very rarely in any other unless it is to plan some activity. And it is not like I don't trust these friends, as you can see by the activities, in some cases I trust my life to them. But we are not close in the interpersonal relationship area.

Then I have somewhat closer friends. Mostly either from church or work where we occasionally sup together, know each others kids and what is going on in each others lives. Some of those friends share one or more activity interests.

Then I have long time close friends. Folks who may not actually share any of the activity interests. But there is a bond with these friends due to our having mutually experienced some "great event" together. These friends may not be close in actual distance but in being able to communicate and enjoying each other's company, they are true friends.

I have never been in a playing situation where I was not at least activity/subject matter friends with the other folks. Oh, there have been a couple of unfriendly musicians that have been in and out of groups I have been part of, but I have been at least that first friend level with most of the group.

Thighbanez, you seem to be looking for a deeper friendship with folks than the subject matter friendship. That takes time and effort. Not just on your part, but theirs as well. You say that they don't like you, and while that may be the case, I'm guessing that they just think of you currently as a guitar player, and not necessarily a long term part of the group. Perhaps they are unwilling to put effort into trying to be a friend to someone who is transient in nature.

BTW, why don't you fit in? Just curious.