SRV Fan

[Blues-Guy]

I am Christian who loves the lord but I also love the blues and still enjoy listening to guys like SRV, Clapton, etc. Is this a contradiction of my faith if I still listen to these guys? I love the old gospel tunes but just cant get into any of the contemporary Christian stuff.

Thanks for the feedback!

[reverbbb]

Just kidding. I think most of us on this part of the forum appreciate many types of music. Especially SRV, EC and ELO (oops, how did that get in there ).

Actually, many folks don't realize that in the last year of Stevie's life, he and Tommy Shannon were becoming very dedicated to their Christian faith. Tommy tells the story where Stevie and he were blowing some cocaine in the hotel room and Stevie suddenly realized how low his self esteem had gotten. So they both got down on their knees and prayed for 30 minutes to be released from their drug addiction. It took a while, but they both cleaned up and SRV began to really get involved in his search for God and His word.

A guy at my church said that he saw SRV perform in Nashville just a few weeks before the crash. If I remember his story correctly, Stevie openly discussed his new found faith and began to witness to the crowd.

EC has always skirted the direct faith subject in his songs. But I see a lot of spiritual influence when he interviews. I think that he feels that he should keep the two subjects of music and his faith separate. Perhaps he feels that it is a private matter or he just avoids the inevitable alienation of some of his hard core long time fans.

Billy Preston ROCKS!!! And he is as spiritual as any of them. He happens to be constantly on tour with EC and appears on his recent albums too.

You are in good company here Matt. I was VERY uncomfortable with singing and playing P&W songs at church 6 years ago. Our song director found out that I could play and he literally begged me for nearly two years to help him start a Praise band. My heart had to be right before I could take the challenge.

Also, I started discovering bands like Third Day, Mercy Me, Sonic Flood and listening to the "rockin" intensity to Michael W. Smith, Hillsongs and Chris Tomlin. I no longer think that all Christian music is as light as Twila Paris (?).

This subject has come up before on this forum. I'm sure that there are many that can offer some artist suggestions that lean towards the flavor that you enjoy.

Welcome to TDPRI and our little corner of the forum.

[ravindave_3600]

Sometimes this can be awkward. On the one hand, we love great music and great guitar playing. On the other hand, a lot of said great music is near-pagan and sometimes outright blasphemous.

For myself (and I'm the only self I can speak for on this - Romans 14:4,13) I've come to the conviction that any good music is good. I've got a lot more Clapton, Springsteen, Beatles, and Muddy Waters than I do MWS or 4Him (a wifely fave). At Christmas I listen to the Alligator Records Christmas Collection a lot more than I do Kathy Troccoli (again, a wifely fave).

And while listening to this great music, I keep one eye on my heart and the other on my mind. "Honky Tonk Women", "Cocaine", and a certain Jimmy Buffet tune that includes the line "they say that you're an ice queen" are no longer on my play list because (much as I love them) they leads me to places I don't belong.

What I can't listen to and love God at the same time, I don't listen to. For the rest, I accept it with joy and thanksgiving and do my best to keep up.

Welcome to the conversation, bro. Be blessed!

[Ptrallan01]

And I love the blues. Have trouble reconciling some songs with my faith so I don't bother to play them. But SRV's version of little wing still gives me the chills. Don't care for hymns and modern praise music often leaves me flat because my cultural perspective is different. But if I ever get good enough I hope to record a CD of church gospel/blues tunes. After all they both came out of the same cotton field. How we use them determines what they are. If you really want to hear some great blues licks and riffs hear one of the old deacons in a mississippi church sing a Doctor Watts and listen to the blues scale runs in the vocals!

Don't feel bad to like secular music but as Brother Dave said what doesn't square with your faith should be moved aside.

Peter

[Blues-Guy]

Thanks for the comments. As stated, I love blues guitar and I am currently studying the blues masters and their techniques. I hope to take what these guys (SRV, Robert Johnson, Albert King, Clapton etc) did and or are doing and blend it into my own style. I am very self conscious about lyrics and always make sure my mind is in the right place. Sadly, I like some of the old Hendrix tunes but I just cant listen to all of them because of lyrics. Someone also mentioned to me, how can you like Hendrix and be a Christian? I told him, I appreciate his musianship not that he took drugs or promoted fornication in his lyrics.
Heck, I still like Elvis.

I wonder how the congregation in my church would react to a rendition of Riviera Paradise by SRV. If only I could play it half as good as SRV.

God Bless.

[ECpicker]

I think good music is good music no matter if it's metal country or somewhere inbetween. If you look at "Christian Music" there is several different styles out there. You have Metal, Gospel, Pop, Rock, Country and to some extent Blues. There is a style for everyone. The music is the same for the most part as top 40. The only difference is the lyrics. Look at Claptons Crossroads, what a song, probly my favorite, some awsome guitar but look at the words not bad at all. Look at Pat Greens Wave On Wave if you really look at the lyrics this is a christain song and I wouldn't be afraid to play it in church. All in all what brought you to play guitar? I bet it was hearing some screaming guitar licks from the local rock station as you grew up. I believe a true musician listens and plays all sorts of music from Bach to Kiss and you can take some of your classic rock licks, tweak them a bit and use them in a Christian song, no prob. I know doubt feel better when I play for the Lord. But I also don't think I could if I wasn't inspired by SRV, EC, or Skynyrd. I don't see it as a problem I see it as being diverse. Yes you should be selective because of lyrics but don't let the devil stop you from being creative, turn the tides on the hot one and make him burn from within.

[ravindave_3600]

Originally Posted by Ptrallan01

Don't care for hymns and modern praise music often leaves me flat because my cultural perspective is different.

Amen, my brother.

I actually LIKE hymns because a good one well done has so much theology and vibe. If it's lasted 100-300 years, I think it's at least exploring. But I never liked secular Top-40 pop, so it's not surprising I don't like Christian Top-40 pop. Not that it's bad music, but I've always prefered a more raw, muscular sound.

Anyway, if you ever get that CD of church gospel/blues tunes going, I hope you'll have room for another guitarist.... :-)

[PraiseCaster]

When I first came back to the faith, around 1982 (geesh, now I know why I got all the gray hairs), I was coming out of a semi successful power trio band, that played the Hollywood club circuit, and opened for all the top and up n coming bands.

When I surrendered my life back to him, a brother in CHrist told me, I have to get rid of all that devil music I had (my album collection). I had about 5,000 to 7,000 LP's. Almost 100% first issue Beatles, Cream, Iron Butterfly, Jimmi Hendrix, YES, Genesis (w/ Peter Gabriel), VH, Led Zepplin, you get the idea. Well that brother convinced me to destroy them all. Yes, I said destroy. I think I should have listened to God, rather than listening to that guy, cause 6 months later, her was back partying in the clubs, and I was kickin myself for 86ing all of those LP's (boy, I wonder what they would go for on ebay today?).

No doubt, some those LP's deserved the trash can. But there were some, that I really dont feel were an afront to my faith at all.

What you need to do bro, is get with God, yourself, and let Him lead you in what you need to do. Be honest with Him, and yourself, and others. I wish I would have heard this lil analogy before doing an awful lot of things because brother so n so said so:

Church Member: Pastor, I want to become a missionarry to Africa.

Pastor: Really! Why?

CM: Cause Brother so-n-so said he had a dream, and saw me in Africa preaching the Word. And well, I want to do Gods will.

Pastor: Is brother so-nso going to go with you?

CM: No.

Pastor: Well he should, cause it seems God is only telling him what you need to do, so you'll need him there to tell you when to come home!

Moral: Let God speak to yiour heart, and when you hear Him, you'll be ok.

Oh yeah, me and my Praise and Worship Pastor have been caught listening to SRV many, many times, and we are not ashamed. Oh, and dont tell anyone, but our Pastor enjoys listening to SRV on accassion, shhhhhhh!

[ravindave_3600]

Originally Posted by PraiseCaster

dont tell anyone, but our Pastor enjoys listening to SRV on accassion, shhhhhhh!

don't you know SRV stands for "Satan's ReVenge?"

and EC is the Enti-Christ????

[PraiseCaster]

Originally Posted by ravindave_3600

don't you know SRV stands for "Satan's ReVenge?"

and EC is the Enti-Christ????

OH-NO! I wonder if that is why my head likes to spin around on its own?

[JDO]

as if you haven't already gotten good advice.....

for me, music is music but lyrics are the touchie area. i think there is some really good music out there done by christians with christian lyrics. there is also some stuff sold in christian book stores that have bad theology IMO and i won't listen to them. on the other side, there is some great music done by non-beleivers that has some really good messages.

one of my favorite examples is dave mathews "ants marching". that has a great message. it talks about living a life with no chances. the christian life is all about chances. missionaries take chances when they go to other countries.

or let's look at metallica's "creeping death". listen to the words and you can see that it's straight out of exodus.

anyway, if it's in contrary to God's word, then i don't listen. if it in any way draws me away from God, then i don't listen.

just my thoughts.

[trag-o-caster]

Oh I had a nasty argument with the preacher at my mom's (Pentecostal) church when I was about 16. He found out that I was jamming with some school friends, and it was his duty to let me know that if we were playing ANY music other than the Lords music, we were going to hell. I had to remind him that he, and many others in the congregation would be tuning the country station in on their car radios on the way home. His reply? "That's different". I never set foot in a church again for DECADES.

[Wahwax]

Originally Posted by ECpicker

I think good music is good music no matter if it's metal country or somewhere inbetween. If you look at "Christian Music" there is several different styles out there. You have Metal, Gospel, Pop, Rock, Country and to some extent Blues. There is a style for everyone. .....

+1

[Wahwax]

I love SRV. I don't think it's a contradiction.

If you want to hear some good Christian Blues check out Glen Kaiser, Darrell Mansfield and Ashley Cleveland.

[Matt Plescher]

You have to decide for yourself how impressionable you are with lyrics. If lyrics really affect you than you will have to be careful what you listen to. If you can listen with discernment, than you can listen to a pretty broad range. After all, you have to understand the culture around you in order to engage it. You do always have to have a critical ear engaged though, which means as a Christian you can't just sit back and let it pour into your brain, and that goes for the Christian marketing machine products also. You have to engage it ALL critically.

As far as the music, once you strip away lyrical content there is good music and bad music, not Christian and non Christian.

Cheers
Matt

[Ptrallan01]

Search for the posting on the Gospel Benefits of a Fender Tee Shirt. This falls right in line with that concept. The last two posts have reminded me how much easier it is to reach the unchurched where they are than to force them to come to church.

A young man in my congregation gave me a Rap CD that he had made and asked me to listen to it. I didn't particularly care for it but appreciated the effort and the talent that created it. I in turned gave him some CD's of the precursors to Rap music. Revolutionary poetry of the 1960's and 70's. We discussed them both good and bad. Today several years later he is a Deacon in Training, writing praise songs, playing piano and drums and singing in the church choir.

None of the music we discussed had a Christian theme, in fact some of it was anti christian but we were able to talk and that was more important than the music. He is now a good friend who trusts me and I can trust him because we are united by Christ.

Peter

[PraiseCaster]

Originally Posted by Ptrallan01

Search for the posting on the Gospel Benefits of a Fender Tee Shirt. This falls right in line with that concept. The last two posts have reminded me how much easier it is to reach the unchurched where they are than to force them to come to church.

A young man in my congregation gave me a Rap CD that he had made and asked me to listen to it. I didn't particularly care for it but appreciated the effort and the talent that created it. I in turned gave him some CD's of the precursors to Rap music. Revolutionary poetry of the 1960's and 70's. We discussed them both good and bad. Today several years later he is a Deacon in Training, writing praise songs, playing piano and drums and singing in the church choir.

None of the music we discussed had a Christian theme, in fact some of it was anti christian but we were able to talk and that was more important than the music. He is now a good friend who trusts me and I can trust him because we are united by Christ.

Peter

Originally Posted by trag-o-caster

Oh I had a nasty argument with the preacher at my mom's (Pentecostal) church when I was about 16. He found out that I was jamming with some school friends, and it was his duty to let me know that if we were playing ANY music other than the Lords music, we were going to hell. I had to remind him that he, and many others in the congregation would be tuning the country station in on their car radios on the way home. His reply? "That's different". I never set foot in a church again for DECADES.

I just really felt like these two quotes had to be together. I think it is all self explanatory. For those that dont make the connection:

One person makes one on one connection with someone outside the Faith.

The other alienates (not you trag, that pastor!).

[rags71]

I used to enjoy SRV and other contempory blues guitar heros. As I grow spiritually, i started to dig into the rich heritage of christian music (or books and literature in that matter) that was left behind for us to discover. I found a wealth of music from Blind Willie Johnson to Five Blind Boys of Alabama that still works for me today.

I work in an "upper room" at my church office and am listening to Mahalia Jackson singing "In The Upper Room" from her "Gospels, Spirituals & Hymns" CD even as I'm writing this. Her sweet wailing of "In the upper room with Jesus ..." sends shivers, convincing and encouragement down my spine ! With a nice pair of monitor speakers, nothing beats immersing your soul to good Gospel music of the past.

I still like SRV and good contemporary music and occasionally still sit down to listen to them. It's not any more sinful than the sin of hating somebody in your heart or being indifferent. I'll work on loving others if the music we listening to doesn't hinder us from growing towards more of that.

[ravindave_3600]

Originally Posted by rags71

I still like SRV and good contemporary music and occasionally still sit down to listen to them. It's not any more sinful than the sin of hating somebody in your heart or being indifferent.

I agree with you, brother, about the great music of the past. Mahala, The Blind Boys, the Carter family, and other Gospel greats have the soul that's good for the (saved) soul!

But I've got to disagree about SRV and other contemporaries being "not any more sinful than the sin of hating somebody in your heart or being indifferent." If I'm misreading your intent please forgive me, but it seems you're implying that listening to secular blues is a sinful activity, although one no worse than other sins.

The fact is, God clearly declares hatred and indifference to be sin; He never says that of ANY kind of music. If listening to this music causes our brother who asked the original question to stumble, or if he feels it to be sinful and does it anyway, then to him it is sin. But...
since it doesn't violate the Word, and
if it doesn't violate his own conscience, and
if the Spirit doesn't convict him of it,
then he can listen, and enjoy, with freedom.

[holndav]

Originally Posted by PraiseCaster

I had about 5,000 to 7,000 LP's. Almost 100% first issue Beatles, Cream, Iron Butterfly, Jimmi Hendrix, YES, Genesis (w/ Peter Gabriel), VH, Led Zepplin, you get the idea.

Man, I feel bad about the hundred or so I was convinced to destroy...

Anyhoo...Blues Guy,

SRV was called home after cleaning up his life. He was really the first guitar hero that died that really shook me up. I've been to concerts at the place where the copter crashed. It's so horrible to imagine.

As far as enjoying his music goes. Do just that! If ever there was a guy who played and did NOT play clams...it was Stevie Ray. He really did channel the music from his heart to his hands. Amazing. Part of why it really got me when he died was that I had dozens of chances over the years to see him live but never did...always saying..."I'll catch him next time. He'll be around". :(

Labeling any type of music as a whole as "Wrong" or "Immoral" seems silly. Sure this "Death Metal" crap is a little much but the Blues...naw...no worries!

Ever hear the cut on 461 Ocean Boulevard "Give Me Strength"? Pretty moving and spiritual too. :)

David

[Blues-Guy]

Hey David,

Really enjoyed reading your comments as was with all other comments. I am making a commitment to studing all the blues masters (Albert King, Robert Johnson, Buddy Guy, BB etc.) I have always been a big SRV fan along with Clapton, Hendrix and so on. Its my understanding that these guys also studied the blues masters when crafting there own style.

By the way, I also passes up a show to see Stevie with Jeff Beck. I dont know what I was thinking. I did though see Stevie live in Saratoga NY back in the late 80's. I have scene many great guitarist in my life but none that has quite touched me like SRV. He just seemed to do everything riight with the guitar and that amazed me.

Matt (Blues-Guy)

[broadcaster]

I recall reading something on the web some time ago about Stevie giving his life to Christ :o, back around the mid-eighties when he was going through drug rehab. This was a letter written by his mom.

Back in '90, I had a chance to see SRV play at Alpine Valley Music Theater. That was his last show. I live about 1/2 hour drive away from that venue. I opted to see the Allman Bros Band there the week before the SRV/Clapton/Robert Cray show instead. Oh well, I seen him in '88 at the Wisconsin state fair and was FLOORED by his performance!

[rags71]

Originally Posted by ravindave_3600

But I've got to disagree about SRV and other contemporaries being "not any more sinful than the sin of hating somebody in your heart or being indifferent." If I'm misreading your intent please forgive me, but it seems you're implying that listening to secular blues is a sinful activity, although one no worse than other sins.

I agree with your disagreement :-) I apologise as I didn't mean it that way. I wanted to bring across the point that humans haven't pay enough attention to more "obvious" problems like hatred and indifference before focusing on subjective issues such what music we listen to. I don't mean to imply that listening to secular blues is sinful although some people do. Sorry if I haven't expressed it correctly.

[ravindave_3600]

Originally Posted by rags71

I wanted to bring across the point that humans haven't pay enough attention to more "obvious" problems like hatred and indifference before focusing on subjective issues such what music we listen to.

In that case, I couldn't agree with you more :-) So what are you doing in Singapore?

[rags71]

Originally Posted by ravindave_3600

... So what are you doing in Singapore?

I'm in a discipleship & church planting movement, leading the children's ministry. We have around 80-90 kids with around 30 volunteers. My other portfolio is with IT in the church office.

As there's a general lack of good musicians in the ministry, i've recently started to roll up my sleeves to play (not that I'm good, infact it shows that's how bad we currently are ... ha ha!). I want to introduce kids to the good ole' Telecaster sound which has been my motivation to improve the quality of sound engineering in our children services.

It's a joy lugging my own modest gear to church on alternate Sundays when I'm on even though I have to lug my family of 5 along too. Glad to be able to serve our good Lord with a Tele.

What about you, are you a pastor/deacon in your congregation ?

[ravindave_3600]

Originally Posted by rags71

Glad to be able to serve our good Lord with a Tele.

What about you, are you a pastor/deacon in your congregation ?

I'm pastor, van driver, janitor, and chief teleplayer at a small baptist church. We're a nice motley mix of anglos, african nationals, hispanics, japanese and one cute chinese chick I happen to be married to.

[rags71]

.. You are the only Tele playing pastor I know.

[Matt Plescher]

Originally Posted by rags71

.. You are the only Tele playing pastor I know.

made me think of

Rev Spanky.

Spanky has passed on but was a fixture of the TDPRI.

[Joe Bonner]

The first or second time I met Spanky (at one of the very early Hudson Valley jams), he was talking about his upcoming move to Queens, and how he wanted to set up a coffeehouse kind of thing for a youth ministry. He gave me a standing offer to stop by and said they'd be playing a lot of gospel songs. As he explained, "Gospel is just the blues with a different message."

Joe

[ravindave_3600]

Originally Posted by rags71

.. You are the only Tele playing pastor I know.

Don't forget Ptrallan01, who ministers in Chicago, and a guy I've just met who pastors children in Singapore.

Rev. Spanky is somewhat legendary around here. We just passed the first anniversary of his passing, and I wish I'd had the chance to meet him. Oh well, I'll just catch him later :D

[Ptrallan01]

It's nice to be remembered!

You know you have a standing invitation to come play with us and worship with us whenever you get to town.

If any of you guys are ever in Chicagoland and want to worship in a small congregation in the NW suburbs come on out. It would be nice to meet the faces behind the names and learn how to play this crazy plank I love so much.

Peter

[tom grossheider]

And I'm in the sw suburbs of Chicago, and are always welcome here too. I attend Moraine Valley Chuch in Palos Hills.

[rags71]

Originally Posted by ravindave_3600

Don't forget Ptrallan01, who ministers in Chicago, and a guy I've just met who pastors children in Singapore.

... in our church, someone wouldn't be a pastor until there are 100 people in the flock, so technically i'm still not a pastor. I'm just a regular messed up guy which I am truly glad the Lord has found some use of ...

[ravindave_3600]

Originally Posted by rags71

... in our church, someone wouldn't be a pastor until there are 100 people in the flock, so technically i'm still not a pastor. I'm just a regular messed up guy which I am truly glad the Lord has found some use of ...

LOL "pastor" describes a heart, a ministry, a calling, and a relationship; it is not a size.

And that's a good thing for me, because the biggest church I ever pastored had about 95 people. Others have been 30s-80s. If you are the flock's shepherd, you are the pastor.

[Ptrallan01]

There are five offices (some say 4) Apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, teacher (some say pastor/teacher is one). I believe that each of us fits into one of those roles/offices. In a cell church a cell leader performs a pastoral function. A choir director or minister of music performs a pastoral function. A sunday school director performs a pastoral function as does the leader of the ushers, mother board, etc., etc. The early church had multiple episcopos leading them. If the church is 1000 or 10 it still needs some form of leadership and focus.

GB

Peter[/b]

[Ptrallan01]

There are five offices (some say 4) Apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor, teacher (some say pastor/teacher is one). I believe that each of us fits into one of those roles/offices. In a cell church a cell leader performs a pastoral function. A choir director or minister of music performs a pastoral function. A sunday school director performs a pastoral function as does the leader of the ushers, mother board, etc., etc. The early church had multiple episcopos leading them. If the church is 1000 or 10 it still needs some form of leadership and focus.

GB

Peter[/b]

[ravindave_3600]

Wellll....there ya go! :D

[boogaloo]

how much I appreciated reading through these posts. As a Born-Again Christian and a lover of classic rock and BLUES, it was encouraging, and interesting and...well thanks. I've been over on the Tele talk, and Amp Central, Stomp Box etc. but had not checked this out. I'll have to spend some more time over here!

Brian

[WallyArms]

Welcome aboard Boogaloo!

I have kept up with this thread but not posted up to this point. Lots of good points have been made already. I think the bottom line is you can't judge the "Godliness" of music by genre....every act, in fact every song, has to be judged on it's own merit - is it blasphemous? Does it conform to a Christian world view? Does it honor God and build up your faith? Will listening to it cause you or your brother to stumble? Will your association with it help or hurt your witness?

As for blues, I think most of it comes from a Christian world view lyrically - what I mean is that it acknowledges good and evil and points out the problems in the world that sin has created. The problem is that a lot of the songs wallow in the sin (glorify it) instead of offering a way out (salvation).

I like a lot of blues and rock too, btw, so I hope no one misunderstands what am trying to say.

[rags71]

Originally Posted by ravindave_3600

Wellll....there ya go! :D

Yeap, that's why I said 'technically' i'm not ... but i do know that in function that's why i'm doing .. agree with ptrellano & yourself on that one.

Where i am now, all member (well almost) plays a pastoral role as 'shepherd' to someone else. We have 6 to 700 members so we are full of lay leaders but we cannot call everyone pastor. We are just glad to be functioning as one towards our little flock, no matter how small or big it may be. However when our flock grows to 100, then the so called 'title' creeps in.

So by that definition, i am yet to be a 'tele pastor'. :-)