Are toploaders truly evil??? - Page 2

daviddoubleu · November 18th, 2006, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bones

The Sparkle one is a top loader with 3 steel saddles. It's a partscaster that I have about $160.00 into and I love it, sounds great, good sustain and all that(everyone here hates the black headstock

)

Really nice trio Bones!

backalleyblues · November 18th, 2006, 02:04 PM

Having bought my '83 top loader brand-new back in the day, I can honestly say it's still my favorite guitar after all these years. LOTS of resonance, and very well put together. There is definitely something about the neck p/u that screams blues (you are SO right, Skully!!) and the neck profile, although strange by telly standards, is actually very comfortable and playable (at least to me!). BTW, mine is Sienna sunburst w/maple neck, and weighs 8.5lbs (measured on a UPS scale).

Franc Robert
Back Alley Blues Band
www.backalleybluesband.com

Telestrator · December 11th, 2007, 11:30 PM

I have a 83 top-loader and when I got it that was it. I love it though I replaced the neck for a rosewood. Your guitar is your guitar and forget what anyone else thinks.

aman · December 12th, 2007, 12:04 AM

Nothing wrong or inherently evil about top loaders.... well, except it's harder to find vintage bridge for them... grrrr... but they play well and I love mine.

viking · December 12th, 2007, 01:43 AM

Toploaders are ok. If theres a problem with he break angle over the saddles , or someone wants to try something different, shim the neck and raise the saddles.

Fourth Feline · December 12th, 2007, 04:25 AM

Just another thought Will,

Now I am the owner of a top loader and a string through, all other things being roughly equal, the top loader seems to play easier / softer under the fingers than the through - body. Some kind gentleman on this forum confirmed that this would probably be the case .

Just a thought ...

colonelrobert · December 12th, 2007, 05:19 AM

Welcome to the party!
I play a top loader and love it.

neocaster · December 12th, 2007, 05:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourth Feline

Just another thought Will,

Now I am the owner of a top loader and a string through, all other things being roughly equal, the top loader seems to play easier / softer under the fingers than the through - body. Some kind gentleman on this forum confirmed that this would probably be the case .

Just a thought ...

If your hands tell you that, they're not lying. It may be for other reasons, but if it feels easier to play to you, or if it sounds better to you when you play it, yield to the observed reality. It's a moving target. Play for yourself, even if others have to / get to listen.

smoke · December 12th, 2007, 05:38 AM

Quote:

Jim Campilongo DEFINITELY sounds evil.

And straight into a Princeton w/ rarely a pedal in sight!

MailMan · December 12th, 2007, 06:07 AM

I think Jeff Buckley played a standard USA '83 toploader, how can that ever be evil?

His sound was quite unique (listen to the early live performances) and Im still trying to get his sound.

Rich Rice · December 12th, 2007, 07:14 AM

Nothing "wrong" with toploaders. Just "different". I love both through body and toploaders. Not a big fan of six individual barrel saddles, but I've played a few of those that were OK too. Case by case, some seem to be more stable than others. Sometimes I'll play a $2500 Osprey II, sometimes I'll play a $200 MIM Telecaster with topload and six barrel saddles. Both are great. Tone is in the hands, so play what works in your hands.

FraKo · December 12th, 2007, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weelie

The lack of break angle or low pressure on the saddles is the only bad thing about toploaders that I know of. Low resale value might be another one, though.

Right. That's fixable by mounting SLOTTED or THREADED saddles, in order to avoid string rattles. In case you've got a vintage three-saddle bridge, of course.

mildwild · December 12th, 2007, 07:38 PM

Bones

Is the red tele on the left in your pix a James Burton Std with a mint guard ?

Sorry for the hijack

Telejammer · December 12th, 2007, 08:37 PM

a 1983 Toploader and love it!

XKnight · December 12th, 2007, 08:53 PM

I'm in love with my toploader and try to never miss a photo op.

e-merlin · December 12th, 2007, 09:12 PM

I wish I still had my 83. It was a nice sunburst and had a great neck and one of the best neck pickups ever. I didn't mind the toploader part, but the Elite saddles had a bad habit of buzzing that drove me nuts.

TomD · December 12th, 2007, 09:13 PM

I have an MIK toploader (Squire) and an MIM standard string through. The toploader plays easier and has a much better tone. I know there are many other things to consider than the bridge, but there is no comparison between these two guitars, the MIK is a better guitar.

It did take me a while to get the bridge set up right. You have to have the height screws set exactly right so there is equal pressure on both sides of the barrel, or there will be rattles and tuning problems.

I don't understand why Fender didn't put something on both sides of the barrels to hold them together, not allow them to move side to side. But once you get them to set square on the bridge, they work pretty well as they are.

I'd really like to put a better quality bridge on it, not sure if the aftermarket ones would fit my MIK, seems to be a bit unstandard. It sounds great as it is, but changes in setup are usually difficult to get right.

micpoc · December 12th, 2007, 09:56 PM

One possible advantage of toploaders which bears mentioning (particularly since J. Campilongo has been brought up several times) is that, if you do much in the way of alternate tunings or detuning while playing, a toploader is probably more forgiving due to the much shallower angle.

Rob J · December 12th, 2007, 10:17 PM

I like my toploader just fine. I would like to change the six saddle bridge to a vintage style three saddle if I could locate one. Not sure where to start looking.

Overall, though, this is a great Tele.

seafoamtele · December 12th, 2007, 10:45 PM

can be found here:
http://store.guitarfetish.com/wicotebrbrsa.html

I got one & it works just fine. Inexpensive,too.

Grin'n'pick · December 13th, 2007, 08:11 AM

I'm Jonesing for a Custom Shop Esquire top loader I keep playing in a shop in London. I was a bit put off by the top loader aspect when I first saw it but having played it I am very deeply in love that particular one

. It does feel quite a bit different to my tele but I don't know if that's down to the top loading, only having one pup, setup, a combination, or simply that it is a different guitar. It does feel looser. I need that guitar! It is the total expression of a players guitar and all about the sound.

jumpnblues · December 13th, 2007, 08:51 AM

Is'a komoonist kunsperisee!

Tom

Jim Campilongo · December 13th, 2007, 10:52 AM

I think there are some trade offs - one negative is ... you can't really, absolutely, unequivocally NAIL the Roy Buchanan 1st album sound on a top loader.

BUT one can try and capture Roy's *musicality* and achieve something good and valid.

Roy had a great ear and a great discriminate range of influences - to me, that was the essence of his style and is the reason I've been listening to him for 30 years.

Of course Roy's style palette was expressed and defined on our beloved Telecaster, but to emulate his style isn't going to be prohibited by the string angle on your Tele.

Musicality, technique and note choice is the bottom line, not striking a note and scrutinizing it like a wine connoisseur. Despite the importance of a guitars voice and tonal capabilities - obsessing on those details would be a distraction that would keep me from concentrating on what strengths a particular guitar does possess and in turn, exploiting those unique attributes.

I think any debate about top loaders vs string through bodies, can be fun and interesting, and I certainly enjoyed reading every single post on this thread - But to me, it's really splitting hairs and not addressing the real heart of things.

franchelB · December 13th, 2007, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob J

I like my toploader just fine. I would like to change the six saddle bridge to a vintage style three saddle if I could locate one. Not sure where to start looking.

Overall, though, this is a great Tele.

That looks exactly like mine!
And though I like my MIM Tele, I used to wish for a Fishman Tele Powerbridge...it would just "drop in" with a string through the body bridge as opposed to having to carve out a chunk of wood for it.

mikfer · December 14th, 2007, 07:46 AM

I passed on a red tele in a pawnshop in Richmond because it was a toploader, believing that "real Teles" are string through. Then I came on this board and found out that the neck on that series of Telecasters (late 70's, early 80's?) had a neck to die for. Of course, by the time I got back to the shop, it was gone. Since then, I've had to convert a Squier 20th Anniversary Fat tele to a toploader because of intonation issues with the original six saddle bridge. That fact that it's a toploader doesn't make it any less a Tele . . .

December 12th, 2007, 04:25 AM	#46 (permalink)
Fourth Feline Tele-Holic Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Yorkshire, England. Age: 49 Posts: 668	Just another thought Will, Now I am the owner of a top loader and a string through, all other things being roughly equal, the top loader seems to play easier / softer under the fingers than the through - body. Some kind gentleman on this forum confirmed that this would probably be the case . Just a thought ... __________________ " The blues is the truth : happy or sad - just the truth "

December 12th, 2007, 05:19 AM	#47 (permalink)
colonelrobert Tele-Meister Join Date: May 2007 Location: Mississippi Age: 56 Posts: 453	Welcome to the party! I play a top loader and love it. __________________ *The Man With The Golden Pen!*

December 12th, 2007, 07:14 AM	#51 (permalink)
Rich Rice Friend of Leo's Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In a dream world.. Just ask my wife. Age: 53 Posts: 2,450 11 Photos	Nothing "wrong" with toploaders. Just "different". I love both through body and toploaders. Not a big fan of six individual barrel saddles, but I've played a few of those that were OK too. Case by case, some seem to be more stable than others. Sometimes I'll play a $2500 Osprey II, sometimes I'll play a $200 MIM Telecaster with topload and six barrel saddles. Both are great. Tone is in the hands, so play what works in your hands. __________________ Please visit my website! If you are driven to play, you will find a way.

December 12th, 2007, 08:37 PM	#54 (permalink)
Telejammer Tele-Meister Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Greenville, Michigan Age: 57 Posts: 144	I also have a 1983 Toploader and love it! __________________ Telejammer...

December 12th, 2007, 09:12 PM	#56 (permalink)
e-merlin Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Sioux Falls, SD Posts: 5,438	I wish I still had my 83. It was a nice sunburst and had a great neck and one of the best neck pickups ever. I didn't mind the toploader part, but the Elite saddles had a bad habit of buzzing that drove me nuts. __________________ WARNING:This post may contain items including, but not limited to, sarcasm, irony, hyperbole intended to bring humor to this discussion. Those of you who are overly sensitive or who have no sense of humor are better off ignoring this post.

November 18th, 2006, 02:04 PM	#42 (permalink)
backalleyblues Tele-Meister Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay, FL, USA Age: 45 Posts: 227	Having bought my '83 top loader brand-new back in the day, I can honestly say it's still my favorite guitar after all these years. LOTS of resonance, and very well put together. There is definitely something about the neck p/u that screams blues (you are SO right, Skully!!) and the neck profile, although strange by telly standards, is actually very comfortable and playable (at least to me!). BTW, mine is Sienna sunburst w/maple neck, and weighs 8.5lbs (measured on a UPS scale). Franc Robert Back Alley Blues Band www.backalleybluesband.com

December 12th, 2007, 12:04 AM	#44 (permalink)
aman Tele-Meister Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: KL, Malaysia Age: 26 Posts: 238	Nothing wrong or inherently evil about top loaders.... well, except it's harder to find vintage bridge for them... grrrr... but they play well and I love mine.

December 12th, 2007, 01:43 AM	#45 (permalink)
viking Tele-Meister Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Denmark Age: 42 Posts: 281	Toploaders are ok. If theres a problem with he break angle over the saddles , or someone wants to try something different, shim the neck and raise the saddles.

December 12th, 2007, 06:07 AM	#50 (permalink)
MailMan TDPRI Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: the Netherlands Posts: 28	I think Jeff Buckley played a standard USA '83 toploader, how can that ever be evil? His sound was quite unique (listen to the early live performances) and Im still trying to get his sound.

December 12th, 2007, 07:38 PM	#53 (permalink)
mildwild Tele-Meister Join Date: May 2004 Location: Toronto Ontario Canada Posts: 418 52 Photos	Bones Is the red tele on the left in your pix a James Burton Std with a mint guard ? Sorry for the hijack

December 12th, 2007, 08:53 PM	#55 (permalink)
XKnight Tele-Meister Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: TX Posts: 419	I'm in love with my toploader and try to never miss a photo op.

December 12th, 2007, 09:13 PM	#57 (permalink)
TomD TDPRI Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Defiance Ohio Posts: 33	I have an MIK toploader (Squire) and an MIM standard string through. The toploader plays easier and has a much better tone. I know there are many other things to consider than the bridge, but there is no comparison between these two guitars, the MIK is a better guitar. It did take me a while to get the bridge set up right. You have to have the height screws set exactly right so there is equal pressure on both sides of the barrel, or there will be rattles and tuning problems. I don't understand why Fender didn't put something on both sides of the barrels to hold them together, not allow them to move side to side. But once you get them to set square on the bridge, they work pretty well as they are. I'd really like to put a better quality bridge on it, not sure if the aftermarket ones would fit my MIK, seems to be a bit unstandard. It sounds great as it is, but changes in setup are usually difficult to get right.

December 12th, 2007, 09:56 PM	#58 (permalink)
micpoc Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Louisiana Posts: 560	One possible advantage of toploaders which bears mentioning (particularly since J. Campilongo has been brought up several times) is that, if you do much in the way of alternate tunings or detuning while playing, a toploader is probably more forgiving due to the much shallower angle.

December 12th, 2007, 10:45 PM	#60 (permalink)
seafoamtele TDPRI Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: new orleans Age: 53 Posts: 79 5 Photos	vintage style top-loader bridges can be found here: http://store.guitarfetish.com/wicotebrbrsa.html I got one & it works just fine. Inexpensive,too.

December 13th, 2007, 08:11 AM	#61 (permalink)
Grin'n'pick Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Sarf Eas' Laandon Posts: 1,853 38 Photos	I'm Jonesing for a Custom Shop Esquire top loader I keep playing in a shop in London. I was a bit put off by the top loader aspect when I first saw it but having played it I am very deeply in love that particular one . It does feel quite a bit different to my tele but I don't know if that's down to the top loading, only having one pup, setup, a combination, or simply that it is a different guitar. It does feel looser. I need that guitar! It is the total expression of a players guitar and all about the sound.

December 13th, 2007, 08:51 AM	#62 (permalink)
jumpnblues Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Midwest Age: 58 Posts: 1,553	Is'a komoonist kunsperisee! Tom __________________ jumpnblues

December 13th, 2007, 10:52 AM	#63 (permalink)
Jim Campilongo Tele-Meister Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Brooklyn , New York Posts: 247	Mr Evil I think there are some trade offs - one negative is ... you can't really, absolutely, unequivocally NAIL the Roy Buchanan 1st album sound on a top loader. BUT one can try and capture Roy's musicality and achieve something good and valid. Roy had a great ear and a great discriminate range of influences - to me, that was the essence of his style and is the reason I've been listening to him for 30 years. Of course Roy's style palette was expressed and defined on our beloved Telecaster, but to emulate his style isn't going to be prohibited by the string angle on your Tele. Musicality, technique and note choice is the bottom line, not striking a note and scrutinizing it like a wine connoisseur. Despite the importance of a guitars voice and tonal capabilities - obsessing on those details would be a distraction that would keep me from concentrating on what strengths a particular guitar does possess and in turn, exploiting those unique attributes. I think any debate about top loaders vs string through bodies, can be fun and interesting, and I certainly enjoyed reading every single post on this thread - But to me, it's really splitting hairs and not addressing the real heart of things. __________________ http://www.jimcampilongo.com

December 14th, 2007, 07:46 AM	#65 (permalink)
mikfer TDPRI Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Charlottesville, Virginia USA Age: 48 Posts: 96	I passed on a red tele in a pawnshop in Richmond because it was a toploader, believing that "real Teles" are string through. Then I came on this board and found out that the neck on that series of Telecasters (late 70's, early 80's?) had a neck to die for. Of course, by the time I got back to the shop, it was gone. Since then, I've had to convert a Squier 20th Anniversary Fat tele to a toploader because of intonation issues with the original six saddle bridge. That fact that it's a toploader doesn't make it any less a Tele . . .