Anybody have a good volume roll off circuit?

MBradford6288 · January 16th, 2006, 09:02 PM

Right now I'm using a .001 cap and a 220 k-ohm resistor in parallel between the in/out of the volume pot. Anybody have a better one. This is smooth, but I feel like there might be something better.

fezz parka · January 16th, 2006, 09:09 PM

I don't like the treble bleed resistor cap thing. It just hypes the high as you back off the volume. The way the tone is wired in the drawing below, you'll get all the high end you need without the hyped sound from the resistor cap thang...

Here's the one for the Tele. Just move the wire that goes from the volume pot to the tone pot from the outside lug to the center lug:

straleno · January 16th, 2006, 09:20 PM

I recently tried a bunch of different values in my Jazzmaster, and my favorite was the old standby 1000pf cap in parallel with a 150k resistor. I've never Fezz's set up.

ruger9 · January 17th, 2006, 07:19 AM

fezz has it right. I've tried many different versions of the "treble bleed" mod, and the one in the diagram works the best IMHO.

Now that I have a guitar without a tone pot (only a master volume), I need a treble bleed circuit for that, so the diagram above doesn't help me. I guess my only option is to try all the different cap/resistor combos & pick the best one. Oh well.

eryque · January 17th, 2006, 11:14 AM

I never understood why people use that resistor in parallel with the bypass cap. All it does is alter the value & sweep of the pot.

fezz parka · January 17th, 2006, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruger9

fezz has it right. I've tried many different versions of the "treble bleed" mod, and the one in the diagram works the best IMHO.

Now that I have a guitar without a tone pot (only a master volume), I need a treble bleed circuit for that, so the diagram above doesn't help me. I guess my only option is to try all the different cap/resistor combos & pick the best one. Oh well.

ruger9, what's the master volume guitar you've got and how is it wired up?

jhundt · January 17th, 2006, 02:12 PM

I use a resistor/cap in parallel because I read about it somewhere (I think it was the dreaded Torres Engineering) maybe 12 or more years ago. When I tried it, it worked! I played my old Strat for years and never touched the volume knob because turning it down made the guitar sound like crap. When I put on the little r/c combo the volume control became a useful device, finally. I read where some guys hate it, some love it, some use no cap, some use no resistor... but if you try something and it works... well - there you go!

eryque · January 17th, 2006, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhundt

I use a resistor/cap in parallel because I read about it somewhere (I think it was the dreaded Torres Engineering) maybe 12 or more years ago. When I tried it, it worked! I played my old Strat for years and never touched the volume knob because turning it down made the guitar sound like crap. When I put on the little r/c combo the volume control became a useful device, finally. I read where some guys hate it, some love it, some use no cap, some use no resistor... but if you try something and it works... well - there you go!

I've read all kinds of wacky things about that resistor, like it improves the bass, etc. You'll retain the highs with the cap, the resistor just changes the value and slope of the pot.

Ain't like it's a big deal, though. That ten cents spent on a resistor probably isn't hurting anyone's pocketbooks ;)

ruger9 · January 17th, 2006, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fezz parka2

ruger9, what's the master volume guitar you've got and how is it wired up?

It's an Artcore- 2 humbuckers, 1 master volume. No tone controls, no individual volume controls. It's just
pickups>switch>vol pot>output jack.

Fuzzyhead · January 17th, 2006, 06:29 PM

Fezz's mod is pure gold! Try it. Probably the one most useful mod out there!!!

fezz parka · January 17th, 2006, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ruger9

Quote:

Originally Posted by fezz parka2

ruger9, what's the master volume guitar you've got and how is it wired up?

It's an Artcore- 2 humbuckers, 1 master volume. No tone controls, no individual volume controls. It's just
pickups>switch>vol pot>output jack.

What value pot are you using?

(Thanks fuzzyhead. Checks in the mail...

)

Crazyquilt · January 17th, 2006, 08:28 PM

Fezz, for those of us playing at home, can you explain why that mod works?

(Yes, I'm trying to actually udnerstand this wiring bidness!)

fezz parka · January 17th, 2006, 11:48 PM

It changes the way the pots load down the pickups.:D

jpkusa · January 18th, 2006, 12:14 AM

I tried it tonight - not really my thing. My guitar still got a little too bright when you turned down the volume, for my taste. I went back to the cap/resistor combo I've been using so far. However, the mod DOES work. Nice, Fezz!

I know little to nothing about electronics, but I'm guessing that with Fezz's mod, the tone cap is also acting as a treble bleed cap. Am I off-base?

jpkusa · January 18th, 2006, 12:17 AM

By the way, here is a very informative thread on this subject that I found helpful.

ruger9 · January 18th, 2006, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fezz parka2

What value pot are you using?

Whoops. 500K.

elgorgon · January 18th, 2006, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazyquilt

Fezz, for those of us playing at home, can you explain why that mod works?

(Yes, I'm trying to actually udnerstand this wiring bidness!)

You're only tapping the current output rather than the full load of the pot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eryque

Quote:

Originally Posted by jhundt

I use a resistor/cap in parallel because I read about it somewhere (I think it was the dreaded Torres Engineering) maybe 12 or more years ago. When I tried it, it worked! I played my old Strat for years and never touched the volume knob because turning it down made the guitar sound like crap. When I put on the little r/c combo the volume control became a useful device, finally. I read where some guys hate it, some love it, some use no cap, some use no resistor... but if you try something and it works... well - there you go!

I've read all kinds of wacky things about that resistor, like it improves the bass, etc. You'll retain the highs with the cap, the resistor just changes the value and slope of the pot.

The resistor in the high pass filter keeps the highs from passing until the resistance is less than through the pot's current setting (meaning it doesn't start working as a high pass filter until the amount the pot is turned down is of higher resistance than the resistor on the high pass filter).
Without the resistor highs pass immediately which can sound like thinning bass depending on the high pass cap value and your guitar/amp settings and setup.
As you wrote, it does change the pot's taper.

Coach · January 19th, 2006, 09:27 AM

Fezz-

Do you have a diagram for doing it your way on a stock Strat also? I'm going to try this on my Tele this afternoon.

January 16th, 2006, 09:02 PM	#1 (permalink)
MBradford6288 Tele-Meister Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 141	Anybody have a good volume roll off circuit? Right now I'm using a .001 cap and a 220 k-ohm resistor in parallel between the in/out of the volume pot. Anybody have a better one. This is smooth, but I feel like there might be something better. __________________ Classical music is the kind we keep thinking will turn into a tune. -Kin Hubbard (1868 - 1930) Music makes one feel so romantic - at least it always gets on one's nerves - which is the same thing nowadays. -Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900)

January 16th, 2006, 09:09 PM	#2 (permalink)
fezz parka Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: A town south of Bakersfield... Posts: 1,283 45 Photos	I don't like the treble bleed resistor cap thing. It just hypes the high as you back off the volume. The way the tone is wired in the drawing below, you'll get all the high end you need without the hyped sound from the resistor cap thang... Here's the one for the Tele. Just move the wire that goes from the volume pot to the tone pot from the outside lug to the center lug: __________________ www.myspace.com/cjneel

January 17th, 2006, 07:19 AM	#4 (permalink)
ruger9 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hackettstown, NJ Posts: 1,663	fezz has it right. I've tried many different versions of the "treble bleed" mod, and the one in the diagram works the best IMHO. Now that I have a guitar without a tone pot (only a master volume), I need a treble bleed circuit for that, so the diagram above doesn't help me. I guess my only option is to try all the different cap/resistor combos & pick the best one. Oh well. __________________ "I've got callouses, from all those nights, spent playin' a Telecaster, 'till my fingers bled Bud Light" - Travis Tritt

January 17th, 2006, 11:14 AM	#5 (permalink)
eryque Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: albany, ny [not chicago] Posts: 7,127 44 Photos	I never understood why people use that resistor in parallel with the bypass cap. All it does is alter the value & sweep of the pot. __________________ my blog: eryque.blogspot.com Updated 9.17.08! Subscribe_____________________

January 17th, 2006, 02:12 PM	#7 (permalink)
jhundt Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Netherlands Age: 54 Posts: 3,012 9 Photos	reply to eryque I use a resistor/cap in parallel because I read about it somewhere (I think it was the dreaded Torres Engineering) maybe 12 or more years ago. When I tried it, it worked! I played my old Strat for years and never touched the volume knob because turning it down made the guitar sound like crap. When I put on the little r/c combo the volume control became a useful device, finally. I read where some guys hate it, some love it, some use no cap, some use no resistor... but if you try something and it works... well - there you go!

January 16th, 2006, 09:20 PM	#3 (permalink)
straleno TDPRI Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 29	I recently tried a bunch of different values in my Jazzmaster, and my favorite was the old standby 1000pf cap in parallel with a 150k resistor. I've never Fezz's set up.

January 17th, 2006, 06:29 PM	#10 (permalink)
Fuzzyhead Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Bonn (Yer-up) Age: 25 Posts: 1,350 23 Photos	Fezz's mod is pure gold! Try it. Probably the one most useful mod out there!!! __________________ about me: blog, photos & musical preferences

January 17th, 2006, 08:28 PM	#12 (permalink)
Crazyquilt Tele-Meister Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 138	Fezz, for those of us playing at home, can you explain why that mod works? (Yes, I'm trying to actually udnerstand this wiring bidness!)

January 17th, 2006, 11:48 PM	#13 (permalink)
fezz parka Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: A town south of Bakersfield... Posts: 1,283 45 Photos	It changes the way the pots load down the pickups.:D __________________ www.myspace.com/cjneel

January 18th, 2006, 12:14 AM	#14 (permalink)
jpkusa Tele-Holic Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Nowhereseville Posts: 585	I tried it tonight - not really my thing. My guitar still got a little too bright when you turned down the volume, for my taste. I went back to the cap/resistor combo I've been using so far. However, the mod DOES work. Nice, Fezz! I know little to nothing about electronics, but I'm guessing that with Fezz's mod, the tone cap is also acting as a treble bleed cap. Am I off-base?

January 18th, 2006, 12:17 AM	#15 (permalink)
jpkusa Tele-Holic Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Nowhereseville Posts: 585	By the way, here is a very informative thread on this subject that I found helpful.

January 19th, 2006, 09:27 AM	#18 (permalink)
Coach TDPRI Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: York, PA Posts: 76	Fezz- Do you have a diagram for doing it your way on a stock Strat also? I'm going to try this on my Tele this afternoon.