Esquire???

Marshall Thinline · September 30th, 2005, 11:20 PM

Is there really a big difference in tone with these guitars?
Does losing the neck pu make it sound different? If so, what am I missing? Could someone tell me what I am missing out on?

Mark Davis · September 30th, 2005, 11:30 PM

The best way to hear the difference is have a 2 pickup Tele and remove the neck pickup and rewire it Esquire. It makes a huge difference in string harmonics first thing I noticed was the big E was totally harmonicly rich and I could get the chime sounds almost anywhere on the string instead of just at the major harmonic nodes.

Michael Murphy · October 1st, 2005, 01:22 AM

In addition, the Esquire is more lively, more responsive since the strings vibrate more freely without that magnetic influence from the neck pickup.

Also, the direct output bypassing the tone control makes it more aggressive.

I never used my tone control on my Teles except on rare occasion- it always stayed wide open. With the Esquire, I back it off just a touch (1/8- 1/4 turn) in the center position. Makes the pickup sound a little sweeter, and makes the contrast between the center and rear positions greater when I slap the switch back.

Try it- I pretty much guarantee you'll like it.

I *love* my Esquires...

-Michael
Charter Member S. Texas He-Man Emoticon Haters Local #316

Marshall Thinline · October 1st, 2005, 03:48 PM

I wonder if I would get the same type of effect with a my thinlines.
I haven't seen a "Thinline Esquire" yet.

But I am sure someone will post a photo of one now that I mentioned it!! :D

Mark Davis · October 1st, 2005, 04:00 PM

The neck pickup has to be over the imaginary 24th fret location. I think the thinlines might not have the neck pickup in the wrong place like a Tele is so if its not over the 24th fret location it wont make much difference at all.

Roli · October 1st, 2005, 04:10 PM

Then what about 24 fret guitars or axes with a turn-around humbucker in the neck?

Roli · October 1st, 2005, 04:12 PM

[deleted] (double post)

Marshall Thinline · October 1st, 2005, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Davis

The neck pickup has to be over the imaginary 24th fret location.

Now things are starting to make sense. That is probably why the harmonics jump out of the guitar better. They are being robbed by the neck pu at that critical point.

Essex Boy · October 1st, 2005, 05:48 PM

I cain't wait to get my Esquire soon. Mark D, how is the stock pickup on the 50s MIM Esquire in your opinion?

I played one Friday and it really sounded great, but of course things never sound quite like they do when you get home and play it through your rig.

Tele295 · October 1st, 2005, 06:42 PM

You didn't ask me, but the stock pup on the MIM 50's Esquire is very good. I would have kept mine stock, but I couldn't stand the buzz from the lights, so now I have a Barden in there.

TG · October 1st, 2005, 07:01 PM

I've found that sitting home with an Esquire isn't much different than playing a tele on the bridge pickup.
But playing with a band thru a relatively cranked tube amp and you can really hear, or rather, feel the difference. More harmonics and overtones (or whatever it's called) around the notes.
Just more musical in general. It's a little bit like the difference you get when you go from a good tranny amp to a tube amp and suddenly everything just sounds nicer somehow.

It shows how having a magnetic neck pickup up near the neck does affect the strings' vibrations.

But I'm sticking with a regular tele mostly anyway. I'm in a wedding band and I need the middle and neck position sounds quite alot. But I wish I could drop the neck pickup into the body, or something, when I switch to the bridge.

Mark Davis · October 1st, 2005, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essex Boy

I cain't wait to get my Esquire soon. Mark D, how is the stock pickup on the 50s MIM Esquire in your opinion?

I played one Friday and it really sounded great, but of course things never sound quite like they do when you get home and play it through your rig.

Its an ok pickup but there are so many more that sound better it could be changed for an improvment.

Mark Davis · October 1st, 2005, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marshall Thinline

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Davis

The neck pickup has to be over the imaginary 24th fret location.

Now things are starting to make sense. That is probably why the harmonics jump out of the guitar better. They are being robbed by the neck pu at that critical point.

Yep thats why the Esquire is more harmonicly rich.

Whats interesting is the JD sig Teles had the neck pickup moved 1/8" closer to the bridge to eliminate this problem.

DO a harmonic chime on your Thinline and see if its directly over the neck pickup.

Mark Davis · October 1st, 2005, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roli

Then what about 24 fret guitars or axes with a turn-around humbucker in the neck?

A true 24 fret guitar wouldnt have this problem as the 24th fret a major harmonic node wouldnt have a pickup magnet under it.

Flaco · October 1st, 2005, 10:31 PM

I buy the argument that the magnetic pull from the neck pickup affects harmonic overtones, but in my opinion it isn't related to the 24th fret position. Otherwise it would only be apparent on open strings because the 24th fret position changes as soon as you fret a note. But the "Esquire Effect" is noticeable on all the notes all up and down the neck.

Mark Davis · October 1st, 2005, 10:40 PM

Anyone with a 2 pickup Tele try this.

Be plugged in flip the switch to the neck position.

Try to do a harmonic chime at the 5-7-12 frets hear anything?? Now do a chime while the switch is in the neck position and flip it to the middle or bridge now you hear the harmonic.

Essex Boy · October 2nd, 2005, 07:13 AM

Mark which pickup would you recommend for a big pure tele twang on the Esquire? One that sounds nice and ballsy with overdrive.

undafonk · October 2nd, 2005, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flaco

I buy the argument that the magnetic pull from the neck pickup affects harmonic overtones, but in my opinion it isn't related to the 24th fret position. Otherwise it would only be apparent on open strings because the 24th fret position changes as soon as you fret a note. But the "Esquire Effect" is noticeable on all the notes all up and down the neck.

I totally agree with Flaco on this. I had been reading the comments about the magnetic pull that the neck pickup exerts at the node located where the 24th fret would be, but all the nodes on a string would move the moment you fret a string; this would make the theory futile. But, indeed, there is such a thing as an 'Esquire Effect', so the magnetic pull on the strings by the neck pickup must be present, and not necessarily only at the vibration nodes ...

Fuzzyhead · October 2nd, 2005, 08:24 AM

Also: Don't the American Standard guitars have a 22 fret neck? Would the neck pickup still be at this imaginary 24th fret position there?

TG · October 2nd, 2005, 08:48 AM

Much of the 'Esquire effect' is noticable when you are playing leads higher up the neck where, as people have said, the '24th fret' open harmonic would have nothing to do with it anyway. (It's no longer there as soon as you fret.)
When you play higher up the neck you are pressing the strings closer to the neck pickup and its magnets, so with an Esquire that is when any tonal difference due to NOT having magnets damping the strings' vibrations would be most noticable.

Mark Davis · October 2nd, 2005, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by undafonk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flaco

I buy the argument that the magnetic pull from the neck pickup affects harmonic overtones, but in my opinion it isn't related to the 24th fret position. Otherwise it would only be apparent on open strings because the 24th fret position changes as soon as you fret a note. But the "Esquire Effect" is noticeable on all the notes all up and down the neck.

I totally agree with Flaco on this. I had been reading the comments about the magnetic pull that the neck pickup exerts at the node located where the 24th fret would be, but all the nodes on a string would move the moment you fret a string; this would make the theory futile. But, indeed, there is such a thing as an 'Esquire Effect', so the magnetic pull on the strings by the neck pickup must be present, and not necessarily only at the vibration nodes ...

The pull is the strongest at the 24th fret cause thats where the magnet is. The string pull caused by the magnet is always there no matter where your fingers are on the frets. I guess if your at the 5th 7th 12th etc frets any of the major nodes the effect would be more pronounced.

Fatmanstratman · October 2nd, 2005, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essex Boy

I cain't wait to get my Esquire soon.

Ben, you have contracted SERIOUS * G.A.S. * since you joined this forum! But isn't it fun?

Are you going for the white blonde (mmm, tasty!) or the sunburst? They look really cool - when you get it, don't forget to send some pics and a write-up to the fat Scouser......

BTW - at LAST I've managed to find a 62 RI in CAR - she's on her way to me from Japan as I write. Details will be posted on the forum soon!

GAS? Me? hmmmmmmmm..............

Mark Davis · October 2nd, 2005, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essex Boy

Mark which pickup would you recommend for a big pure tele twang on the Esquire? One that sounds nice and ballsy with overdrive.

Fralin Blues Special or a 10k Nocasster would work nice.

The older SD Broadcasters are wound pretty hot those sound real good too.

Essex Boy · October 3rd, 2005, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fatmanstratman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Essex Boy

I cain't wait to get my Esquire soon.

Ben, you have contracted SERIOUS * G.A.S. * since you joined this forum! But isn't it fun?

Are you going for the white blonde (mmm, tasty!) or the sunburst? They look really cool - when you get it, don't forget to send some pics and a write-up to the fat Scouser......

BTW - at LAST I've managed to find a 62 RI in CAR - she's on her way to me from Japan as I write. Details will be posted on the forum soon!

GAS? Me? hmmmmmmmm..............

Good stuff Steve. You're gonna LOVE that guitar.

As for the Esquire, I'm in a real quandry as whether to get that or a white blonde Classic 50s tele.

How much did the 62RI run you?

September 30th, 2005, 11:20 PM	#1 (permalink)
Marshall Thinline Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 632	Esquire??? Is there really a big difference in tone with these guitars? Does losing the neck pu make it sound different? If so, what am I missing? Could someone tell me what I am missing out on? __________________ Shameless plug.... The Offenders

September 30th, 2005, 11:30 PM	#2 (permalink)
Mark Davis Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bakersfield Ca. Age: 58 Posts: 12,876	The best way to hear the difference is have a 2 pickup Tele and remove the neck pickup and rewire it Esquire. It makes a huge difference in string harmonics first thing I noticed was the big E was totally harmonicly rich and I could get the chime sounds almost anywhere on the string instead of just at the major harmonic nodes. __________________ I'm so blind my seeing eye dog needs glasses.

October 1st, 2005, 01:22 AM	#3 (permalink)
Michael Murphy Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: I can hit the Pacific Ocean and/or Canada with a rock from here... Age: 62 Posts: 1,073	In addition, the Esquire is more lively, more responsive since the strings vibrate more freely without that magnetic influence from the neck pickup. Also, the direct output bypassing the tone control makes it more aggressive. I never used my tone control on my Teles except on rare occasion- it always stayed wide open. With the Esquire, I back it off just a touch (1/8- 1/4 turn) in the center position. Makes the pickup sound a little sweeter, and makes the contrast between the center and rear positions greater when I slap the switch back. Try it- I pretty much guarantee you'll like it. I love my Esquires... -Michael Charter Member S. Texas He-Man Emoticon Haters Local #316 __________________ *Just an analog boy in a digital world...*

October 1st, 2005, 03:48 PM	#4 (permalink)
Marshall Thinline Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 632	I wonder if I would get the same type of effect with a my thinlines. I haven't seen a "Thinline Esquire" yet. But I am sure someone will post a photo of one now that I mentioned it!! :D __________________ Shameless plug.... The Offenders

October 1st, 2005, 04:00 PM	#5 (permalink)
Mark Davis Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bakersfield Ca. Age: 58 Posts: 12,876	The neck pickup has to be over the imaginary 24th fret location. I think the thinlines might not have the neck pickup in the wrong place like a Tele is so if its not over the 24th fret location it wont make much difference at all. __________________ I'm so blind my seeing eye dog needs glasses.

October 1st, 2005, 04:10 PM	#6 (permalink)
Roli Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: ¤ Hungary ¤ Age: 30 Posts: 1,573 5 Photos	Then what about 24 fret guitars or axes with a turn-around humbucker in the neck?

October 1st, 2005, 04:12 PM	#7 (permalink)
Roli Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: ¤ Hungary ¤ Age: 30 Posts: 1,573 5 Photos	[deleted] (double post)

October 1st, 2005, 05:48 PM	#9 (permalink)
Essex Boy Tele-Holic Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 679	I cain't wait to get my Esquire soon. Mark D, how is the stock pickup on the 50s MIM Esquire in your opinion? I played one Friday and it really sounded great, but of course things never sound quite like they do when you get home and play it through your rig.

October 1st, 2005, 06:42 PM	#10 (permalink)
Tele295 Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Haunted Amp, CA Posts: 3,403 14 Photos	You didn't ask me, but the stock pup on the MIM 50's Esquire is very good. I would have kept mine stock, but I couldn't stand the buzz from the lights, so now I have a Barden in there. __________________ "Turn it up and it doesn't need any reverb." - Danny Gatton www.dannygatton.info Tiger Town Aces - Music That Bites Back In Redd we trust! Free Bill Kirchen! If lawyers are disbarred and clergymen defrocked, doesn't it follow that electricians can be delighted, musicians denoted, cowboys deranged, models deposed, tree surgeons debarked, and dry cleaners depressed?

October 1st, 2005, 07:01 PM	#11 (permalink)
TG Friend of Leo's Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Beside a bog in the west of Ireland Age: 47 Posts: 4,504 7 Photos	I've found that sitting home with an Esquire isn't much different than playing a tele on the bridge pickup. But playing with a band thru a relatively cranked tube amp and you can really hear, or rather, feel the difference. More harmonics and overtones (or whatever it's called) around the notes. Just more musical in general. It's a little bit like the difference you get when you go from a good tranny amp to a tube amp and suddenly everything just sounds nicer somehow. It shows how having a magnetic neck pickup up near the neck does affect the strings' vibrations. But I'm sticking with a regular tele mostly anyway. I'm in a wedding band and I need the middle and neck position sounds quite alot. But I wish I could drop the neck pickup into the body, or something, when I switch to the bridge.

October 1st, 2005, 10:31 PM	#15 (permalink)
Flaco Tele-Meister Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Austin, TEXAS, USA Posts: 426 6 Photos	I buy the argument that the magnetic pull from the neck pickup affects harmonic overtones, but in my opinion it isn't related to the 24th fret position. Otherwise it would only be apparent on open strings because the 24th fret position changes as soon as you fret a note. But the "Esquire Effect" is noticeable on all the notes all up and down the neck. __________________ Shawn "Flaco" Jones

October 1st, 2005, 10:40 PM	#16 (permalink)
Mark Davis Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bakersfield Ca. Age: 58 Posts: 12,876	Anyone with a 2 pickup Tele try this. Be plugged in flip the switch to the neck position. Try to do a harmonic chime at the 5-7-12 frets hear anything?? Now do a chime while the switch is in the neck position and flip it to the middle or bridge now you hear the harmonic. __________________ I'm so blind my seeing eye dog needs glasses.

October 2nd, 2005, 07:13 AM	#17 (permalink)
Essex Boy Tele-Holic Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 679	Mark which pickup would you recommend for a big pure tele twang on the Esquire? One that sounds nice and ballsy with overdrive.

October 2nd, 2005, 08:24 AM	#19 (permalink)
Fuzzyhead Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Bonn (Yer-up) Age: 25 Posts: 1,350 23 Photos	Also: Don't the American Standard guitars have a 22 fret neck? Would the neck pickup still be at this imaginary 24th fret position there? __________________ about me: blog, photos & musical preferences

October 2nd, 2005, 08:48 AM	#20 (permalink)
TG Friend of Leo's Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Beside a bog in the west of Ireland Age: 47 Posts: 4,504 7 Photos	Much of the 'Esquire effect' is noticable when you are playing leads higher up the neck where, as people have said, the '24th fret' open harmonic would have nothing to do with it anyway. (It's no longer there as soon as you fret.) When you play higher up the neck you are pressing the strings closer to the neck pickup and its magnets, so with an Esquire that is when any tonal difference due to NOT having magnets damping the strings' vibrations would be most noticable.

October 3rd, 2005, 01:41 PM	#25 (permalink)
tjalla Tele-Afflicted