Baritone/6 String Bass?

[smilinjack]

Same thing
The solo on Dave Dudley's "Six Days on the Road" and the intro to Aretha Franklin's "Chain of fools". Is that one?
One what?; Baritone or 6 String.
Please Advise!

Jack :?

[GopherTele]

Yes, they are the same thing.

You'll also hear them called Tic Tac bass.

Fender currently makes a baritone tele.

A lot of guys have the Danelectro ones that came out a few years ago and tune them to A or B.

Works well for slide too with those big strings.

[JohnnyAtomic]

the terms are used somewhat interchangably. but technically a bass six or six string bass (old type) is tuned E thru E w/ the lowest string the same as a standard electric bass four string. these are also usually a 30 inch scale. the most notable examples of this instrument are the fender Bass VI and the danelectro although Gibson, and Hagstrom, and numerous other made this type as well. To muddy the water even more recently companies are making true baritones which are generally 27 or 28 inch scale and tuned A-thru-A or B-thru-B w/ the low B the same as the B on a 7 string guitar, not the low B on a 5-string bass (it's one octave higher than the Low be on a 5-string bass).


And yes both are UNBELIEVABLY cool sounding. In my opinion the best vintage tic-tac style tone is obtained w/ a bass 6 played thru a fender reverb amp with the reverb up, and the bass knob on the amp turned down all the way. and played with a pick very near the bridge.

I generally prefer the vintage bass six over the baritone simply because you do not have to transpose keys in your head. although the useful range of tones in both is very similar.

johnny atomic

[smilinjack]

Thanks Friends!
Yeah, I'm considering getting one but no way with an alternate tuning.
Does the DanElctro tune standard?
Are those 5th. down tunings essential for that sound?

Best,
Jack

[Jean-Baptiste]

Fender's got a new MIJ baritone Jaguar. I really want one but I've already got a great copperburst Dano. Those lipstick p-ups are noisy, but real twangy. They're meant to be tuned B to B (standard but 5 notes lower) and the stock strings are .68, .56, .44, .26, .18, .14.

D'Addario makes a heavier gauge of bari strings that work well tuned down to A, or even a full octave down to E, but you would have to adjust the Dano's truss rod to compensate for the extra tension from the thicker strings.

[Andy R]

I think both those records were made with 6 string basses, E to E. My understanding is that the B to B or A to A baritone set up is a recent phenonem. Here in Nashville, the Dano was always the king.

BTW, the "Chain of Fools" part was played by Tony Joe White!

[smilinjack]

So you figure thowe new Dano's are set up for standard 'E to E"???

Thanks,
Jack

[WickedGTR]

I have owned a number of 6 string basses- I saw Duane Eddy live in the early 80's and he played his old Dan-o on a few numbers and it knocked me out- I had to have one. Listen to "Because They're Young" sometime... his first 6 string bass hit.

As they were hard to come by at the time, I actually converted an unused (standard scale) telecaster to 6 string bass- with fairly good results- My guitar tech at the time (Gary Brawer in SF -He's great) found some bass string gauges that got to the correct pitch without putting too much tension on the neck. He unwound some of the outer wrappings on the strings where they connected to the tuners and soldered them so they wouldn't unravel, and they fit into a standard kluson slotted tuner. It had a cool sound but the strings were a bit loose- you had to be careful not to bend strings ....I used it on several recordings and live.

Since then I have owned a few different models- including a vintage Fender Bass VI, but to me the Dan-o sounds the best. I currently own a re-issue Danelectro from about 5 years ago, - the single cutaway two pickup model, with concentric volume and tone controls- just like Duane Eddy's. It KILLS! They're out oof production now but can be found- Jerry Jones makes a nice one (for the price).

Also- as I understand it, tic- tac bass refers to a Nashville technique whre the 6 string bass bass player (using a pick) would double note for note with the standup bass. This gives the sharp attacks and higs from the electric, with the deep thud of the acoustic bass. Listen to Pasty Cline records and other 'Nashville Sound" era recordings of the late 50's thru the 60's and you will hear it...

[JohnnyAtomic]

Originally Posted by smilinjack

So you figure thowe new Dano's are set up for standard 'E to E"???

Thanks,
Jack

dano recently made both a six string bass E to E and a baritone B to B, jerry jones are usually A to A. the bass is 30 scale, the bari is 28(i think,or maybe 27).

johnny atomic

[WickedGTR]

The Danelectro's shipped with Baritone strings, but if you switched them over to a 6 string bass set of strings it was a 6 string bass... same scale length etc. The 6 string bass set is all wound strings- the baritone set has a plain B and E string.

Danelectro also used to make a really nice 6 sting bass string set- wish I could still get 'em.

A 6 string bass set for a regular P bass type instrument would be heavier gauge.

Also- I've found that reverb and tremolo help get the charicteristic 6 string bass tone- a twin reverb works great.

Another great 6 string bass sound is the early James Bond soundtracks- I always wondered how they got that guitar sound til I realized it was a bass.

Also check out "the Lonely Surfer" by Jack Nitszcshke- 6 string bass with an orchestra is an awsome sound....

[GopherTele]

I got the hankering after hearing Pete Anderson play a barry in A on the old Dwight Yoakam records, so I picked up a Dano and tune it to A.

It's a snap to transpose keys in your head since it is tuned to the same intervals as a guitar, it's not an open tuning or anything.

Plus, it allows you to play some cool licks in keys you've never considered: try Buckaroo (G), or Folsum Prison in A--it's fun.

Dwight's new guy (Gattis) can be heard playing one quite a bit on his new record as well.

[Jef]

I have a gretsch jet baritone (30" - E-E) for bass VI duties and a homebuilt baritone tele tuned A-A. They're both fun. The Gretsch is great especially for the $$$.
300lbs of heavenly twang!

Jef

[Dave Brophy]

I have a Dano baritone,and it's a whole lot of fun.
For live work: If you want to double bass lines and play single note melodies,(in other words,other people are playing chords),and you don't mind the 30" scale,get a 6-string bass.
If want to play low twangy parts,and still be able to go back to chords,even first position chords,and other guitar parts,get a baritone guitar.It's a real nice compromise.It's more like playing a guitar,with extra fat notes at the bottom when you want 'em.
I tune B to B,and transposing is a breeze for any kind of simple chord progression type music.You count up 4.If the song is in G,you play a C chord and think in C.If the song is in E,you play an A chord.Etc.

[John Potter]

It might be hard to find these in the USA, but check out Jet Harris - Besame Mucho, and Jet Harris and Tony Meehan - Diamonds, and Scarlett O'Hara. Also, Tony Meehan - The Man with the Golden Arm. Harris and Meehan were the original bass/drums for The Shadows before leaving around '62. Diamonds was a UK no1 in 1963, but Harris was in a car accident after Scarlett, which effectively ended his frontline career. I don't know the player on 'Arm'. 'Mucho' is a bass, the others I think are baritone?

[GopherTele]

I guess I don't quite understand tuning to B as opposed to A (not that it really matters).

How many times are you playing tunes in B to take advantage of the low open string?

And, the next two strings afford open string licks (E and A) that are readily accessible with a standard guitar.

The barry sounds best with as many open strings possible. Tuning to A gives you everything in that key (and some really low notes) plus then you have low D and G open strings at your disposal. For added affect, tune to drop A (tune the 6th string to G) and play all of the songs you know in standard drop D. Now that is some rumblin'.

Like I said, try Buckaroo in G (D position) and it sounds awesome.

What are the advantages of the B tuning?

[RevMike]

....Hellcat VI. Tuned E-E. I love it. Got mine for about $400. Has 3 mini-humbuckers. I play it through a 1X15 combo with a Rocktron Short-timer slap back delay. Sounds awesome. Here's what it looks like.

http://www.music123.com/Schecter-Hel...source=froogle

[ednew]

Originally Posted by GopherTele

I guess I don't quite understand tuning to B as opposed to A (not that it really matters).

How many times are you playing tunes in B to take advantage of the low open string?

What are the advantages of the B tuning?

My preference for "B" tuning has nothing to do with song keys or any transpositional-related issues. I can't recall doing any material in the key of B--but that's just me.

I've got a Jerry Jones Neptune Bari that intonates beautifully, particularly in B. B tuning is a tighter tuning than "A"--it lets you hyrid-pick chord melodies. I find "A" tuning gets muddy much quicker and is much better suited for playing single note lead and bass lines.

"B" tuning offers a middle ground between bass and guitar that helps avoid sonic conflict. If you've got a rhythm guitar and a bass player up there with you, it's really easy to add a baritone and turn everything to mud, if you're not careful and tasty.

Finally, it's a "feel" kind of thing for me. B tuning, properly amped, has a clarity in both larger (and smaller) venues that is reduced when tuned down to "A". Somewhat like a Tele, it demands a clean playing approach. I put mine through a Rambler and an AC-15 and get a great sound--very tight with solid punch.

Of course, YMMV.

[GopherTele]

I hear what you mean by getting muddy.

I may have to try B.

Thanks for the input.

[Bill Hullett]

I was always under the impression (heard a long time ago so I can't put my finger of the source, but I seem to remember at the time that it was a good one) That Aretha"s CHAIN OF FOOLS guitar was played by TONY JOE WHITE on a Strat that was tuned down to "C" ie: the record is in "C" but you can hear the guitar sounds like its being played out of an open "E".....The radio version that you're all familiar with is actually an edit from the original....in the "real version" Aretha and Tony Joe go at it for nearly a full minute before the band starts .....it really is cooooool.........

Bill Hullett

[Tele295]

Do I recall that Tony Joe played that part tapping the strings with a pencil?

[Dave Brophy]

I tune my Dano baritone to B because it came that way in the mail. :o

[BluesOwl]

Fender has a Subsonic product, it's a long scale Strat, Tele can be special ordered.
Not to be confused with Fender's Bajo Sexto true baritone Tele.

I made a Subsonic. Lighter strings than a true baritone.
11-64 tuned to "C".
Easier to play and bend strings.

[Bill Hullett]

You know ever since I read this thred its been wearing me out wondering cause something didn't seem right....I went and got out the Dave Dudley version of 6 days on the road.....Its a regular Tele!!!!!!!!!! Its played with the pick and the side of your thumb (similar to how you achieve harmonic "whistle notes") Soooooooo I guess niether of the songs that you mentioned had a baritone guitar!!! Also for the record I was always told that the late Jimmy Colvart played guitar on that......

Bill Hullett

[Walter Broes]

Originally Posted by Bill Hullett

Its played with the pick and the side of your thumb (similar to how you achieve harmonic "whistle notes")

I've always wondered about that, it's such a strange and distinct attack, almost as if he's popping his strings against the fretboard funk-bass style. I guess the "whistler" pinch technique explains it, thanks.