I just tried 8's

[Joe-Bob]

Originally Posted by gls500

...10's now for Fender scale necks, and 11's for Gibson scale necks. Works great for me.

That's what i use, and it works nicely.

Colorado Springs E,
2/100 of an inch is not much, that is true, but your conclusion is spurious indeed. The actual measurement is very slight in difference, yes, but the crucial difference is that .008 is 20% less than .010, and that is a very significant difference.

The simple fact is, that there is a difference between guage sets. Whether the "tone" is "better" or "worse" is also not quantifiable. I find that .009s on my strat are "sproingier" and that makes for some classic Quack sounds, but I liked the sound of heavier .011s for my style of playing. I compromised at .010, because of that, and because my Muddy sounded so good with .010s. The idea that there is NO TONE with skinny strings simply has no basis in fact. There is tone, you may just not like it.

[JoeyV]

I only use .056 strings, for all six of the strings and instead of tuning down,,,I tune up 6 whole steps...you need to try this because its the ultimate in guitar tele tone

[Bill Hullett]

I've heard of that...but when SRV did it I think he actually used .58's

Merry Christmas!!!!

Bill Hullett

[Marshall Thinline]

My fingers and arms would love to use a set of 9s, but my ears won't let them. I have two similar sounding 69 thinline RI guitars. I recently strung one of them with my regular gauge 12-52 and the others with a set of 10s. The difference in sound was huge.

Now if you play with a lot of distortion the difference is very hard to hear. But, the cleaner you go the more apparent it becomes. There is a lot more sustain and just an overall bigger sound. The highs are just as high only fuller. The bottom is way bigger sounding but not muddy.

Doing finger gymnastics with 12s is not a real joy, but worth the pain.

[Vihar]

Why, that's easy to play 12's on an acoustic, and steel/nickel has less tension than bronze.

[mmahoney]

but 9's are great and have more twang IMHO ... 10's are often too stiff especially after a long night and you're not in the mood for the fight.

My son uses 8's on an SG and the tone is fat and full.

Subtle micro bends are easier with 9's as well.

10's are good on a Gibby scale though.

I've played as high as 11's but tuned down a half step.

Most of the players we admire play 9's or 10's, but a buddy of mine uses 12's ... to each his own.

Mike

[shakedancer]

Your right!! With distortion the difference is probably not a big deal. I play blues and I play clean. 11's were great for tone, a little rough on the fingers. I'm now using 10's with a heavier bottom for chords. I guess if you don't play chords and all leads with distortion you can get by with the lighter strings.

[Vihar]

Okay, I made some calculations. A plain .013 pulls 27.4 lbs when tuned to E, and 24.4 lbs for Eb. That's still bigger than a plain .012 tuned to the standard E (23.3 lbs), so SRV hasn't got any slinkyness even with that 1/2 step downtuning (and that high action).

[tdowns]

Well it looks like me and vihar did the calculation at the same time, and he is right on with the tension.

Key E
0.009 - 13.1lbs
0.013 - 27.4lbs

D#
0.009 - 11.7lbs
0.013 - 24.4lbs

The frequency of a vibrating string is

So rearranging to solve for tension yields:

T= 4f^2ml

So it has a squared frequency relationship. To double the tension, the frequency must quadruple.

I wrote an article on custom string gauge design a while back. It has an Excel spreadsheet for doing the calculations if you are interested in solving for your own needs.

Custom String Calculations

[racehorse]

I Have mostly used 10`s for 35 years, but do to work related repetitive motion , a few years back , I played lighter strings .

It was good for me , it takes more control with both hands , to play 8`s , or different techniques , to play in tune , to sound big or fat with 8`s .

[Colo Springs E]

[quote="Joe-Bob"]

Originally Posted by gls500

Colorado Springs E,
2/100 of an inch is not much, that is true, but your conclusion is spurious indeed. The actual measurement is very slight in difference, yes, but the crucial difference is that .008 is 20% less than .010, and that is a very significant difference.

.....however, just shows what you can do with statistics. If unemployment was 5% last year, and it's now 2.5%, the Presidential administration would take credit for "slashing unemployment by 50%!" Not likely they'd say it increased by 50% if it went up to 7.5% though!

Bottom line is, as you pointed out, gauges have different tones, but one isn't necessarily "better" than the other. If it was, we should all avoid playing the high E string, and only play the low E, as it is 4 times (or so) thicker, and thus, 4 times "more toneful."

I think a lot of these things (maple is brighter, mahogany is warmer, ceramic is hot, AlNiCo is warm, thicker gauges are more toneful, higher action sounds better, solid state is crap) are a bunch of I.U.L.'s in my opinion (I.U.L. = "Internet Urban Legends").

If it sounds good, it sounds good. The most good anyone can EVER do for their tone is learn to play, instead of obsessing about what year their tubes were manufactured.

-Eric

[IsThereLoveInSpace]

I had 8.5's on for a while...

[hippietim]

Terry - great article - thanks!

[0le FUZZY]

[*]I don't know or care watt famous player did watt alst I know iss when I went tew 8s and/or 9s inna early 70s my profit fer a nites werk wassa liddo less.

I'd break 2 and sumtimes 3 liddo E strings a nite and mebby won B.

I hadda change strings erry weekend and sumtimes twice a weekend.

With 10s I could make it threw three weekends once inna while.

Never could git full chord sound production with the lite guage ones neither.

Course I ain't famous sew its jes MHO and I don't know noe famous folks tew say "cee they did" .

0le FUZZY

[tellypicker]

...it doesn't matter one whit what someone else uses. What ever the heck makes you pick up your own guitar and play your own material your own way and makes you happy is the the gauge (or brand, make, model, year, color, weight, on and on and on...) for you. Practice more, listen with your ears and not your eyes, be happy with your gear and Merry Christmas and ho ho ho to all and to all a good night....

[kp8]

Originally Posted by Colo Springs E

I think a lot of these things (maple is brighter, mahogany is warmer, ceramic is hot, AlNiCo is warm, thicker gauges are more toneful, higher action sounds better, solid state is crap) are a bunch of I.U.L.'s in my opinion (I.U.L. = "Internet Urban Legends").

Yeah, the idea that the materials that make your instrument could have an influence on shaping your tone is just crazy. What kind of silly think will they come up with next.

Originally Posted by Colo Springs E

The most good anyone can EVER do for their tone is learn to play, instead of obsessing about what year their tubes were manufactured.

clearly these two things are always, and in all cases, mutually exclusive.




-kp8--

.

[Vihar]

I wrote an article on custom string gauge design a while back. It has an Excel spreadsheet for doing the calculations if you are interested in solving for your own needs.

Terry - your technical notes are awesome! (as well as your playing ), thank you!

[davg]

Try this for tension calculations.

http://www.pacificsites.net/~dog/Str...ionApplet.html

[genelovesjez]

Originally Posted by Marshall Thinline

I have been getting thicker and thicker as my hands can take it. Everytime I use a thicker guage the tone sounds better. The thickest I am using now go from a 12 to 52. I think I have reached the limit.

I've gone up and down on string sizes, finally settling on 10-52s for feel more than anything. The only tone problems I ever encountered was the loss of twang once the low E gets bigger than 52. To me, it starts to sound like a bass string, and doesn't have enough bite.

[mike_levitt]

[quote="Colo Springs E"][quote="Joe-Bob"]

Originally Posted by gls500

I think a lot of these things (maple is brighter, mahogany is warmer, ceramic is hot, AlNiCo is warm, thicker gauges are more toneful, higher action sounds better, solid state is crap) are a bunch of I.U.L.'s in my opinion (I.U.L. = "Internet Urban Legends").

-Eric

Eric, you're correct.

I've got a warehouse full of solid state amps, ready to trade for your fenders and voxes. Boxes of ceramic pickups to trade for your alnicos. Tons of ceramic speakers to trade for your alnico blues. Plenty of Maple Martins, ready to trade for your brazilian rosewood versions.

Any takers???

Mike

[holndav]

Originally Posted by hippietim

Look at it this way, Yngwie plays with 8's on a scalloped board and has amazing intonation.

Yngwie, Yngwie, Yngwie.

Funny seeing him come up so much here recently....

He's a twangin' fool, he is.

I use 9-42s on all the electrics too but have been considering trying 9.5's.

On my acoustics I use medium guage which is 13-56, so I figure it's all relative...

David

[Joel Terry]

But I found I had to go back to .009s because I just kept breaking the .008s. No problems with intonation, though.

To me--and this is just my empirical opinion based on my own personal experience--great tone isn't necessarily predicated on string gauge. I can get the tone(s) I like with any readily available gauge of string, really, along with great intonation. I just happen to use .009s largely due to habit. No use changing a good thing.

Joel

[Joel Terry]

Originally Posted by tdowns

Well it looks like me and vihar did the calculation at the same time, and he is right on with the tension.

Key E
0.009 - 13.1lbs
0.013 - 27.4lbs

D#
0.009 - 11.7lbs
0.013 - 24.4lbs

The frequency of a vibrating string is

So rearranging to solve for tension yields:

T= 4f^2ml

So it has a squared frequency relationship. To double the tension, the frequency must quadruple.

I wrote an article on custom string gauge design a while back. It has an Excel spreadsheet for doing the calculations if you are interested in solving for your own needs.

Custom String Calculations

Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Terry Downs--the Stephen Hawking of the TDPRI.

Thanks for the brilliant post, Terry--you are a one-man library of great information!

Joel

[Joel Terry]

Originally Posted by Bill Hullett

I've played guitar since 1964 and it was a major revelation when I "Discovered" Ernie Ball strings about 1966, Every other guitar player in te world loved them too...and no one ever thought that they were trading tone for playability on electrics,by using 8's or 9's......

then S.R.V. by comes along and claims he uses 13's and the whole guitar world stands on its head to try and copy him, because all of a sudden there was a "macho" thing applied to the gauge that you used ....heres the funny part
A. he tuned down a half step (I would love a math geek to be able to do a relitive tension equasion that tuning down results in)
B. you have to look at his style of playing ...very rythmical and not depending on accurate full step bends etc...now I'm not knocking him ...I'm just stating what he did with his 13's ..... I play 9's on all my electrics wether they be Gibsons or Fenders and like the feel of difference that picking up the Gibsons provide...I also string all my acoustic guitars with Martin SP 13's because they sound killer and I'm not requiring myself to do the whole step bends etc....but I can still fly around and do lead parts....

It all depends on what style of music that you're gonna be required to play on any given guitar ...if it never gets beyond a SRV vibe then string heavy if you like (but I don't think that that will be a direct equation to better tone) If you play James Burton / Roy Nichols style Tele then you're gonna have to string accordingly to get the desired results because its just not gonna happen with big strings...

I USED T