Cheap new guitars

[Andy R]

We've been comparing the merits of old versus new, and I just wanted to comment that cheap guitars are where the greatest change has come. I remember my Teisco made Knox guitar back in 1964 for $75, which is about $500 in 2004 dollars. It was virtually unplayable, sounded awful, you remember them...For $50 or 100 bucks today, you can get a Squier or whatever that is 100 times better guitar- virtually any new guitar could be used professionally today--it wasn't always the case!

[rb.jr]

Andy, You are right.I played a Squire Tele last week and it played great,the finish was great and all for $230.

[Jasonc]

I bought my first Tele a few months ago. It is a CIC Squire and it cost me around $200. It plays and sounds great and it got me so enthousiastic about Tele's that I bought a '94 American Standard. This was a good guitar too, but it was 4 times as expensive and by far not 4 times as good. I ended up selling the US Tele and keeping the Chinese one.

I must admit that the Squire is a little neglected lately because I bought a CIJ '62 Custom Tele reissue, which plays like a dream.

Still, I will never part from my first Tele.

Jason

[timgreene]

I am barely a member of this here board, only owning the squire affinity butterscotch Tele. I sure do like it, even if it gets mixed reviews from others.

The squier has me seriously thinking about selling my stratocasters, and getting another Tele.

[lenny]

do it!
i almost bought a mim 50's classic in white blonde, the other day at gc, really nice, and not cheap but not a ton of cash either
the finish was really what surprised me most i think..
you can get a good guitar lately for not a ton of dough that's for sure

[jjh37854]

I am looking for a good second tele, but due to the fact I tend to mod them so much (and Im broke) I dont want to spend a ton, so I went to guitar center and compared 3 relatively cheap teles and this is what I came up with (obviously bear in mind that teles vary a lot and I only played one of each model so this is less than scientific) btw all guitars had maple fretboards and I tested them all on a deluxe RI.

To me these 3 guitars were all a lot more different from each other than I expected

#1) mexican 50's style about $700

laquered neck, little frets, larger radius neck, 3 saddle bridge.

my opinion, a nice guitar for 6-7 hundy, but I have to be honest I am not a fan of vintage necks(like on the 52 reissue) maybe I have been ruined by Am stds but I like the thinner matte finish necks. good tone though.

#2) mexican deluxe nashville under $500

modern neck, 3 pu's, 6 saddle vintage style bridge.

I thought the bridge tone on this guitar was a bit weak, not lively, not a lot of snap, what I did like was the bridge middle combo, very usable strat tone. I think if the tone of the bridge position could be kicked up this could be a very cool versatile guitar.


#3) highway 1 tele $600

vintage 3 saddle bridge, light guitar, has a nice thin matte finish that makes it look and feel a bit older.

to me this was the best twanger in the group, great tele snap, really had a nice tone and played great, this one has a more modern style neck, but the rest in vintage style, and it felt great to my hands.

so if I was buying today I would go with the highway 1 for a pure retro tele sound, but I would consider the deluxe and swap out the bridge with a fralin. but this is not to slight the 50's MIM, it was way cool too,
and if you like the feel of those vintage laqured necks like on the 52 RI, you'll dig it, basically what I am saying is that is pretty damn cool that you can get such a nice tele for so little money. life is good.

[blind radish]

OK here's mine -- 2003



Mods are: 4-way switch, and texas tele PUs in bridge and neck. Bought it from a guy on eBay $225 (figured the mods were a strong upgrade)

It really sings ( and I have a MIJ 52 ri, 72 MIM custom, MIM Muddy, MIM Thinline SB) and while this is clearly not an equal to any, I can treat it like the neighbor's dog and not worry.

NOW, my question. Some of you tele monsters were talking about using shoe polish to tint the neck.

DETAILS please ... as much info as you can stand to type.

For those considering this model -- the neck is MUCH lighter than the pix and the body is slightly more brown.

Oh, btw, it has a Fender Broadcaster replacement logo.

thanks in advance, buddies!

[PraiseCaster]

I bought the Squier Affinity Special Telecaster (the 52RI wannabe, in blonde finish) about two months ago. Out the door, just under $200.00 US Dollars.

I thought I had grabbed an actual 52RI: it was hanging with the Fender 52RI's, and as I grabbed at a guitar, I was also looking over my shoulder looking at wich amp to plug into. I always wanted to try a 52RI (never did, cause to tell the truth, I cant afford one, so I figured, why try it if I cant buy it)

I thought at first the neck was a lil slimmer than what I had thought, but it wasnt bad at all. Just enough beefiness. I'd probably like a beefier 50's neck, but it wernt bad at all. Action was set up just spot on, no buzzing, and no fretting out. It had 9gauge strings on it (I prefer 10Ga.). The tone was great! balance on the pups could be better, but I figured that would just be a matter of playing with the pup height (I was right).

I played that guitar for a solid 10 minutes just amazed at it's tone and playability.

Then I started looking at it a lil closer. I thought that the neck sure did look pale. I glanced over at the other 52RI's hangin on the wall, with nice darker tinted necks. Hmmmm, I thought. I turned the guitar to face me, and I just about fell off of my chair: Right their on the headstock it said "Squier" by Fender. I then saw the price. I then discovered it was the last one, so I went straight to the cashier, and walked out with my new #1 Guitar.

I love her! She plays great, and sounds great! Best bang for the buck that I've ever spent for a guitar!

[blind radish]

Originally Posted by PraiseCaster

Best bang for the buck that I've ever spent for a guitar!

I think I'd agree, GREAT guitar for not much money.

[ye olde fretmonkey]

My first electric was a Les Paul copy (no name bolt on neck) that had completely fallen apart about 2 years later. The lineup of sub-$300 guitars is soooo much better than it was 20 or even 15 years ago, and not just Fenders...there are decent Ibanez, Samick, Yamaha and other makes out there (they're probably all Samick anyway) that are fine guitars for a starter model or even for a 2nd guitar for the more experienced player. It's a matter of competition, cheaper labor and lower production costs.

A buddy has a made in USA Melody Maker that he snagged from GC for $399 brand new...single P-90, matte finish, single cutaway, decent neck and hardware, and it just sings. A fantastic American guitar for not much $$ at all.

[Billy Lee]

I think a couple of the above posts got a bit off topic, unless I'm misunderstanding the ORIGINAL post. If I was reading and correctly understanding the original post on this thread, it was the fact that the "cheap" guitars (ie; Tiesco, Hondo II, Crestline, Aspen, etc., etc.) had really come a LONG way in the last 25 or so years.....and, I totally agree. And, it's funny because I was just in a discussion over the weekend about this VERY same topic.

I remember as a kid, getting a Hondo II Mustang copy out of a catalog (partly because I thought it looked cool), and I REALLY remember how cheap the quality of that guitar was, how hard it was to fret, the awful fret buzz, the terrible fret work, how hard it was to keep in tune....just for starters. Before that, I had a few acoustics...a "Chris" brand 3/4 size guitar, and then a "Crestline" acoustic....both were MISERABLE for a young teen to try to play. While I would SURE love to get ahold of another of each of the guitars for sentamental reasons, and to hang on my office wall, since they were my firsts (the originals were long since gone....the "Chris" guitar accidently got left out in the rain), I sure don't miss having to fight to play them. That was back in the early to mid seventies, and I didn't know what a good playing guitar was!

Fast forward several years, and you can see such a HUGE difference in the quality and "playability" of even the cheapest of guitars. As was pointed out in an above post, perhaps it's the fact that alot of the various brands of low end guitars are now built in just a couple of BIG factories, I think you have to go back even before that to the introduction of the new and improved automated, computerized equipment back in the eighties. As also posted above, I think you can find almost any cheap guitar (in the $150.00-$250.00 range), give it a good setup, etc., etc., and push your way through a gig, or even have it as a second guitar or backup guitar.

I have had students that have bought Strat and Tele copy guitars, and was totally blown away by how well constructed some of these guitars are now. I had a kid not too long ago bring in a "J. Reynolds" Strat copy guitar, and had me do a setup on it. Granted the pickups and hardware were not up to "pro player" standards, the action and fretwork were impressive....considering he paid $149.00 for the guitar. The finish, although I'm sure there was probably almost as much glue as there was wood in the body, actually had a great "see through" grain finish. And, a good share of the Squiers, with a bit of work, are very "playable"....are they as nice as their high end Fender couterparts??? NO WAY....but they are atleast playable.

I think when it comes to an "entry-level" guitar, buyers in general are getting the best bang for the buck that they EVER have.

[holndav]

A cheap guitar that is, Danelectro U-1 in Black. David Hidalgo played one at a show I saw last year.

It sounded awesome...I have been thinking of a Dano Baritone or U-2...if I hadn't spent all my money on Teles since then, I'd have one.

Totally agree! "cheap=ok" provided it gets a setup.

David

[Colo Springs E]

Originally Posted by holndav

A cheap guitar that is, Danelectro U-1 in Black. David Hidalgo played one at a show I saw last year.

Art Alexakis (Everclear) used a pretty much bone stock MIM standard Tele for about 1/4 of his show when I saw them live in Salt Lake City. He did an interview in a local paper, and the interviewer was apparently a gear-head and asked him about playing live with such inexpensive guitars. (He also regularly used Classic/Deluxe series Teles in addition to G&L ASATs and Les Pauls at the time)

Art said he abused the sh1t out of his guitars anyway, and this one "stays in tune and plays great--what the hell else is there?" or some words to that effect! I thought that was cool as heck.

-Eric

Originally Posted by Andy R

I just wanted to comment that cheap guitars are where the greatest change has come. I remember my Teisco made Knox guitar back in 1964 ... virtually unplayable, sounded awful, you remember them...

Some of 'em had FOUR pickups! I mean, it's gotta be cool if it's got 4 pickups, right? (Nigel: "See, but this goes to 11...") ;-)



Boy, do I remember the imports. The action was awful, strings waaayyy up off the fingerboard, you couldn't get 'em in tune to save your life. Forget intonation. And then if you did manage to play anything, they sounded like do-do ca-ca. Yipes.

But hey... FOUR pickups! Hehe. ;-) CS

[TheBenLow]

You gotta love those old crazy cheapos though. I saw Link Ray once and I don't even know what he was playing, some insane 4-pup 70s *** git, but he had tone out the ass.

My first guitar was a brand new mid-80s Squier Tele and though the workmanship was pretty shoddy(the nut and bridge both feell apart within months) it played and sounded great.

That said, I'm curtrently on a Tele hunt and tried out about 15 Teles the other day(I work near 48th St. in NYC). I did find the MIM 72 RI seemed a lot lighter and cheaper than the American models though I didn't think the pricier USA 52 RI and Custom Shop 52 were any better than the more affordable American Series. Another thing: all the Teles with vintage style bridges, including the $1,200 52 RI, had noticable gaps where the bridge pup routing peeked through the side of the bridge. I thought that was pretty wack.

[bo]

Those two could do no wrong in getting great tone out of cheap guitars. I dare say that the sound of the cheesy two pickup microphonic Kingston I started on was pretty cool. But if I had to start all over again on it I'd probably give up pretty quickly. I'm not as hard headed as I was at 14. Those starting out today get to choose from generally great playing instruments.

[johnnelles]

Originally Posted by ye olde fretmonkey

A buddy has a made in USA Melody Maker that he snagged from GC for $399 brand new...single P-90, matte finish, single cutaway, decent neck and hardware, and it just sings. A fantastic American guitar for not much $$ at all.

I bought one of those! It's a great player (I'd say the neck is way more than 'decent'), though a bit on the plain side: flat finish, no binding.
So I slapped a custum pickguard on it and added a Bigsby.

[sintones]

Does the Affinity have a thinner body than the standards? And if so how do they balance on a strap?

thanks,
Michael

[weelie]

Yes it has a thinner body, but that doesn't make it ultra light. And the neck is thin and not wide at all, so the balance is ok.

THE KIWI POLISH LINK: http://www.nymphusa.com/tele/usersrepe.asp

[Billy Lee]

While I've not played a bunch, I've played a few Affinity Strats and Teles both. I never saw a big issue with the "balance" of one, due to the thinner bodies. On two different occasions, I played two different Affinity Teles that were both really nice guitars. Granted, one had the pups replaced with Duncans, new tuners, and a few other minor mods, I thought they were both nice guitars. I played an Affinity Strat that I thought had a nice feel and balance too.

Of all of the "low end" guitars out there, and I seen several different Strat and Tele "knock-offs" that people and studends bring to me when I'm home and have the time, the Affinity stuff, while not at the TOP of the list would rate highly in terms of "best bang for the LEAST bucks."

[sintones]

Thanks for the info!

Michael

[PraiseCaster]

..... I purchased a Crown International Custom Les Paul.
I couldnt at the time, afford a Gibson (15 years old, sporatic part time jobs).

It had CI on the headstock (with the I going through the middle of the C), and the Gibson "Diamond", between the tuners.

The neck was a bolt on, but you couldnt tell the difference in feel, till you got to the higher fret's: Just not as smooth as the set heel neck.

The body had a carved top. all balck (as was the neck) and binding on the body and the neck just like a Les Paul.

I got it for $150.00 new, and believe it or not, it was a great guitar! Especially once I 86'd the grim stock pups, and put in SD paf59's in it! I'm still kicking my self for getting rid of it!

Wish I could find another one!

[buglecorps]

Everything is better value than it once was..
I can remember when it was a big deal to get your car paid off before it fell apart, and that when most folks were on a 36 month book! TV and radios needed constant service, and cost a fourtune..I remember the B&W console that my parents had blew after about five years. It took my dad 3-4 months to save up the $$ for a smaller replacement..( I think it cost @ 2-300) now you could get a major color, cable ready what have ya for probaly 1/2 that if you caught a good sale.. I have a 10 year old Magnavox that just keeps humming along. My firt stero was a Panasonic compact that cost @ $200 in the mid '70s..you can by a nice CD Box for @75.00 that would just blow it away..and you could probaly buy it in the supermarket..Guitars are the same..for all our love of the 'oldies, how many of you really had something decent from a major maker when you started??...that's what I thought. and if you did, how many hours did you spend trying to figure out how to put a DiMarzio in it??..
A Champ was serious $ back in the day, and the first thing you wanted was a pedal so you could make it go "RAZZ!!!!" Sure they are cool now that we are all old and mellow, but realy most of you couldn't wait to unload that little tuber, and get a "real rig"...(defined in my 'hood as something that would make a Slant Six Mopar light on the stering). Those guitars were a pain..Leo and Ted wanted you to move up, so you got stop tailpieces, and Super Patened Vibrotos, short scales and strip tuners..yeech. I have a MIM Squire standard Tele from '98($150..about what it took to get my MMB and make it playable back in "77) and a DC LP Special from '99..both will simply bury any stock non professional instrument from any previous time.

OBTW..if you like the MM/JR (and it is a nice guitar)..
Check around for clean used or even NOS JRs and Specials they are often available for not much more$ and are signifigantly more guitar. I got my DC a few months ago NOS for $450, and SG Jrs were being closed out here and there for a little LES..

[chris m.]

With factory machining, computer control, etc., it seems that QA/QC is way up, sometimes better on foreign el cheapos than on domestic high end Gibbies, for example.

It's interesting that there is a debate now about the loss of domestic manufacturing jobs. Guitars are just like everything else- a lot of guitar making jobs went overseas or were replaced by technology, but on the other hand as consumers we're way better off. So what is better for the nation as a whole- protectionism or opening markets? As a consumer, to be honest I guess I have voted with my wallet for opening markets. Besides, American companies can compete if they are smart, do good marketing, and provide good value. There are still plenty of Made in U.S.A. guitars being sold. Trek bicycles makes 2/3 of their bicycles in Wisconsin. Fender U.S.A. has been very smart, keeping many American jobs and opening factories overseas at the same time in order to compete at every price point.

I believe that Americans can compete in a fair, open market and that as American consumers we have the luxury of choices and prices that are astounding. And foreign competition forces American manufacturers to improve their product and pricing-- look at how much better American cars have become due to competition with the Japanese.

But society definitely has to help with the transition-- there is no doubt that jobs are being lost and people need assistance. Every CAD/CAM machine takes away a whole bunch of hand crafting jobs, every router takes away the need for telephone operators, every control panel takes away the need for elevator operators. I like the idea of investing in our nation's infrastructure- roads, bridges, railroads, ports, communications technology, etc.- those jobs cannot be exported!

It's interesting how the pros and cons of a major campaign issue are evident right in your local guitar store! Please acknowledge my disclaimer here- I don't want to start any big political debates!! I can definitely see both sides of the issue and some balance is required for sure!

[LipstickTUBE]

those things are awesome, feel like plastic though..
considering buying one but then i looked at ryan adams new album cover and decided they are not very "durable"
heheh
nolan