Played 50s Reissues at GC this afternoon and...

[TomK]

And I was left with mixed feelings. First off, let's not go down the GC-bashing path (yes, the staff was incapable of helping me, yes the place was wall-to-wall slack-toned noise, but I expected nothing less).

Anyway, they had two white blonde MIM 50s reissues that I wanted to try and compare to my white blonde CS. Well, tone-wise, I really liked these guitars. They sounded just right and quite balanced for their $629 price. No complaints here.

Now workmanship was another thing. I've read so many posts here praising these Teles, which is what motivated my trip to GC, but these two Teles were dogs. I know it could have been just these two---but when BOTH of them suffered from the same flaws it makes me wonder.

Both had horrible fret-sprout. I had to play carefully to keep from nicking my hand. Some sprout is common this time of year, but this was every fret, both sides, both guitars.

Both also had poorly fit nuts that were wider than the neck.

Both had a "murky" vintage white finish which was a bit splotchy and uneven (though my CS isn't as clear as I'd like at 3x the cost---the MIJ white blondes I've seen look the best of the three).

Both had missing parts (tone knob on one, switch tip on the other)---but that's a GC thing (I also saw a Blues Deville with the grille cloth kicked in, a Twin with no jewel, a Cyber Twin with no big control knob, etc.) :(

Both had poor neck pockets--and I don't mean the bass side of the pocket that most notice. I mean the large flat bottom of the pocket was not level. You could see large uneven gaps.

Now they also had two Highway 1 Teles for $549 (burst and a vintage white) which didn't suffer from these problems.

Please tell me I saw the two exceptions to the MIM reissues' quality. I want to like these.

[Bob Arbogast]

My experiences with MIM 50's Teles is better. As far as the fret sprout and the overwide nut, I wouldn't blame those in Fender. To me, they both point to the same problem: the air in the store lacks necessary humdiity, leading to fretborad shrinkage. I see that same problem in store after store with one guitar after another.

Bob Arbogast

[GilmourD]

Originally Posted by Bob Arbogast

My experiences with MIM 50's Teles is better. As far as the fret sprout and the overwide nut, I wouldn't blame those in Fender. To me, they both point to the same problem: the air in the store lacks necessary humdiity, leading to fretborad shrinkage. I see that same problem in store after store with one guitar after another.

Bob Arbogast

Having worked at GC, I must agree... The place is a warehouse. The only room that gets proper treatment is the acoustic room. I've walked into work early in the morning FREEEEEEEEEEEEZING my butt off inside. It's a wonder we didn't get more returns due to warped necks. That's a big part of the reason I never really used my employee discount. LOL

[TomK]

You are right about the humidity---but the sprout just seemed so extreme that I had a hard time attributing it solely to GCs climate control problems. You would think they would be more concerned about...wait a minute...nevermind... :?

[lenny]

i was at a sam ash
and the mim's had exactlly the same problem. it was more than the humidity. the nut had a full eighth inch xtra. frets looked like they had been clipped and that was it. little things were horribly half assed. controls had slop..yea a tiny bit, but my deluxe has none.
it sounded and played great, and if you took it to a luthier or tech or rob distefano i am sure he could make it a gem in no time..
but i second that post
i got a made in korea gold top hh.... there were several posts here about em. the fret edges are smooth, nut is fitted just right... it has binding on the neck too, and body. all perfectly smooth.
i hope someone in the mim factory reads this board maybe they are resting on their laurels a little bit. labor is cheap in mexico but apprently they have some competition
:P

[Colo Springs E]

not a Fender MIM only thing. PRS, Tom Andersons, G&Ls, Gibsons, Hamers.... I've seen it on all guitars. That's simply a humidity thing. The best thing is, it's EASILY cured! Simply take a file and be careful.

Neck pocket gap? I can't deal with it. Again, I've seen it on CS Fenders, Anderson, Grosh, and G&Ls too, and I think there's simply no excuse. My sub-$300 MIM Tele--and most of the Korean G&L Tributes I looked at Saturday--had nice snug pockets. No excuse in year 2004.

Can't comment on the finish. All the 50s I've seen I dug, but maybe I just like a cloudy finish! :)

[JohnK24]

Tom,

I'd given up hope in finding any "unique" teles at that place (I live in Natrona Hgts, about 15 miles NE of the city). All I ever saw was MIM, Squires, a few American Series and the 52 RI that was there since they openned. I last went to the GC in early May to buy my daughter an Olympia parlor sized acoustic.

I'll have to stop by and try those Highway teles.

Ok, the only cool tele I saw there was on clearance last May, and dang I should have seriously considered it. It was one of those special Silver Sparkle Designer Teles (with Tx Specials), it actually felt nice (expect for the grunged up strings).

Where you you typically shop for gear ? I always go to Pianos-n-Stuff...they know their gear and take care of it too.

John

[stantheman]

I've NEVER heard of an NC Machine screwin' up.....
HAVE YOU ??????? Of course SELDOM is an actual
MUSICIAN in the employ of G.C. I've been in
the warehouse section of one of their stores. I bought
some stuff and needed 'cessories and yes you could hang
MEAT in the backroom. There's another chain of stores
in New England that I won't say by name because they
are friends and when you walk into one of their stores
the humidity is just right and the temperature is never
EXTREME not even in heat waves ('cause they ALL
play and they KNOW the HAVOC that fluctuating Temps
can cause.) Marching orders are 70 degrees 24/7,
and that means the backrooms and setup areas as well.
I'll bet those guitars were FINE when they came in and
probably spent a "just a few nights in the outback".
I haven't seen a bad fret job on EVEN A SQUIRE in the last 20 years. Fender's got way to much pride in their
guitars to let crap out into the marketplace, it almost killed the company 30 years ago, they're not gonna get bit by the same dog twice.

[Mike Rice]

I've yet to visit a GC and obviously I'm in no rush to do so. But Bill Hullett was talking about a MIM 50s Classic that he had played and was rather impressed. Actually I think he was OK with one and impressed by another, but he didn't note the problems you found. I've played a few in stores, Joe Bonner's, and Inertian's, and all have felt just fine. I can't say I inspected the nuts, but there was definitely no fret sprout when I played them.

Hey stantheman, would that be Daddy's that you're talking about? If not please give up the name of the chain you're talking about. I'm in upstate NY and would make a trip to such a store.

[holndav]

and was very unimpressed...as compared to my MIJ and homebrew MIj (little j on purpose for the homebrew...hee hee).

I played a Thinline RI in Mahogany and a 50s RI in White Blond. Pickups were fine. Necks were ok (plenty of humidity here).

But...the hardware was not as solid feeling, IMHO.

I can't really explain more. They just didn't feel as solid (???). I would still consider one because, for the money, they are still a cool guitar...just think you can do better.

please, don't hit me. I'm being honest...

FWIW, the white blonde had the obligatory GASH courtesy of some clod. Was it marked down???...I doubt they even knew it was damaged.

In fact, I put it away pretty quick when I noticed for fear of...well.

[Mike Rice]

I'm not trying to make a sweeping generalization and I know others feel differently, but my experiences continue to lead me to conclude that the MIM Fenders are not yet up to the quality of the MIJs. Don't get me wrong, the MIMs I've played (particulary the Nashvilles) are quite good. But the MIJ/CIJ guitars were downright great! I've owned about 5 or 6 Japanese Fenders and the fit and finish on each and every one of them was first rate.

Currently I own a CIJ '72 Thinline RI. While I like the ceramic humbucker in the neck OK, the bridge bucker is just a tad too harsh for me. I liked the US made Alnico humbuckers that are now being used in the MIM '72 Thinlines. I brought my CIJ to the music store and played it against 2 MIMs. Either would've been fine in its own right, but not when played against my CIJ. Nicer neck, lighter weight, virtually invisible top seam, etc. What I ended up doing was ordering the new PUs for my CIJ. Being the slug I am, however, I've yet to make the change!!

I'm keeping my eye out now for a used 50s Classic and I want an MIM model as I'd like a 2-tone sunburst and the look and sound of the ash body. If I find a winner on the 'net I probably will buy it but, I must admit, not with the confidence I would a MIJ guitar. I find the MIMs need to be sorted through a bit more while the MIJs were insanely consistent.

Just my humble observations and opinions.

[Mark Davis]

There is my 50's Classic the 1st one I got the second one I got MN8 serial also is the same tight neck pocket.

[Mike Rice]

Inertian and I always talk about the magic MN8 guitars, particularly the 50s Classics. Wasn't there even some speculation that when Fender moved production of the Classsic series from Japan to Mexico in '98, there were some start-up problems and some of the guitars were actually either made in American and/or made with US parts?

[Blaster]

Order one last year through Sam Ash and I thought it was put together real nice. I ended up returning it because I didn't care for the pickups and the guitar was a log...felt like a Les Paul. If the guitar was a good weight I would have probably kept it.

[Scotland]

Including my own one, are exceptionally well built. Like Mark Davis' one, the neck pocket is really tight on mine. I have no issues with it in any way.
Every time I go to a music shop, I try out the MIM 50's and have found consistent quality in every area. Most are heavier than mine but still very acceptable.
I have also tried some of the CIJ guitars and did not find the quality to be any better or worse than the MIM examples.
The only common Fender "fault" if any, is the way the nut has been cut and I have to say, the worst one I have come across was a C.S, model.

Originally Posted by lenny

the nut had a full eighth inch xtra.

I don't think any manufacturer would be in business longer than five minutes if that was the case !!

[Nick Fanis]

Most of the MIM guitars I've seen (at least in Greece) had also VERY POOR NECK POCKETS.
Personally I can't stand a neck gap (I know it does not affect tone but there is no excuse for one in year 2004).
All of the MIJ and MIK teles I've seen ,even the Squires had perfect neck pockets,I don't know why the Americans and Mexicans can't constantly get it!(I've even had CS guitars with bad neck pockets....)

[nocasterbert]

c`m on boys don`t be too critical. i don`t have a 50s
classic but the ones i`ve seen were good some of them
great especially for the price.
regard the 50`s classic as a instrument that might need some set up work and don`t worry too much about some neck gap. it doesn`t affect tone and i`ve seen it
on real vintage teles as i`ve seen it on custom shop instruments.
one of the the good things about this guitar is that many dealers got a number of them to choose one out.
gap

[Dacious]

.. Contrast my experience with my '69RI.

http://au.f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/...usoz/my_photos

One of the pictures is of the neck pocket. It is tight - so tight a cigarette paper won't slip in.

Seeing as the necks and bodies are cut in the US on the same machines, it would seem they must be as good or bad as MIA. My CIJ Strat needed a minor fret dress, not so the Thinline. I did a nut cut and basic setup to optimise action. Other than that, it has an 'F'-plate on the neck, and a baseplate on the bridge pickup - that's it.

Check the fret ends which I haven't touched, and the perfectly bookmatched back.

The hardware is Schaller tuners - rock solid, the bridgeplate is exactly the same stamping as the NOS 70's bridge I have minus the patent nos. Pots are fullsize CTS, switch and jack are Switchcraft as per US models. Apart from an instore ding finish is still perfect at 3 years.

It plays for hours at a time without needing retuning and intonates without compensated saddles etc.

[Skully]

Seeing as the necks and bodies are cut in the US on the same machines, it would seem they must be as good or bad as MIA.

For whatever it's worth, someone on FDP (I believe) linked to a photo tour of the Fender Mexico factory, and it seems they cut their own bodies now.

[lenny]

Originally Posted by Scotland

Including my own one, are exceptionally well built. Like Mark Davis' one, the neck pocket is really tight on mine. I have no issues with it in any way.
Every time I go to a music shop, I try out the MIM 50's and have found consistent quality in every area. Most are heavier than mine but still very acceptable.
I have also tried some of the CIJ guitars and did not find the quality to be any better or worse than the MIM examples.
The only common Fender "fault" if any, is the way the nut has been cut and I have to say, the worst one I have come across was a C.S, model.

I don't think any manufacturer would be in business longer than five minutes if that was the case !!

i am serious, and it was on more than one guitar. mebbe less but i am tellin you it was huge overhang

[Flyfender]

Now workmanship was another thing. I've read so many posts here praising these Teles, which is what motivated my trip to GC, but these two Teles were dogs. I know it could have been just these two---but when BOTH of them suffered from the same flaws it makes me wonder.

I don't think it's an exception. BOTH the ones I checked out had really good sound. However, they were dogs as well. (I'm a QA inspector, I can't help it) Neck pockets poorly cut, the murky finish as you mentioned, the neck pocket trim extended BEYOND the neck pocket! Like he slipped with his grinder! Neck alignment was also off, the strings were not evenly spaced on the fretboard, both models. Bottom line: I would pass and buy a Fender Japan model. 2 cents anyway...

[Shnook]

I own a 50's Classic and that particular guitar has probably the nicest fit, finish, and craftsmanship of any of the guitars I currently own. Mostly USA models. However, mine is a '99 or '00 model, so it's possible things have changed over the last few years.

Although, I actually just came back from my local mom and pop dealer where I played some new 50's and 60's Classic Tele's. I was especially impressed with the fret work on the 60's model. No 'sprouts' there. None on the 50's either, but I didn't spend too much time with that guitar, cause I already have one.

I'd almost say it's a humidity thing too. My dealer does use humidifiers in the winter, and I don't ever recall noticing fret sprouts on any of his guitars. Mind you, he stocks a lot of MIM models, and I'm just not seeing the problems mentioned.

[TomK]

Wait a minute...The MIM Teles are made in Baja California, Mexico--right? That's some pretty darned dry country isn't it? I'm no meteorologist, but how would that be so different from dry weather in the northeast? To me it seems like the maple used in the necks was not properly dry before the necks were made.

Granted, this is pure speculation on my part. Someone who can better explain moisture content, shrinkage, etc. please correct my oversimplification of the matter. :)

[Skydog]

Every 50's-mim I've played was fine ..there's a blond at the local GC I can't stop thinking about.