What champ lapsteel pups can be used in a tele bridge?

opdev1 · June 25th, 2008, 01:14 PM

I was interested in maybe getting a pup from a champ lapsteel for a 52 relic.

Maybe an early flat pole to get the broadcaster sound.

One of the ones I saw was an early 50's that the dealer said it was not quite a tele shaped pup?

What are the steels to get that have the right pup? Are there any other caveats to using them?

mellecaster · June 25th, 2008, 02:12 PM

None I've ever seen have the same Baseplate as a Tele ?....some Modification is required...Mark Davis did one awhile back...maybe he can share what was involved.

Mark Davis · June 25th, 2008, 03:21 PM

The pickup from the Champion is the one you wanna use its shaped like a Tele except it doesnt have a baseplate you have to add a baseplate just as a base so you can install it to a Tele bridge. The other ones from the Champ are more like a Strat pickup and a lower output.

The earilest Champion lap steel pickups from 49-51 are usually wound just like the Broadcaster cause thats the pickup Leo based the Broadcasters on usually 8.5-10k ohms the Champion pickups from 52-54 are a little lower in ohms 5.9-6.2k and they sound alot like Jeff Becks Esquire he used with the Yardbirds.

These are some grteat pickups that sound just like Vintage Tele pickups.

For many many years you could find these Champion steels in pawn shops for $25-75 now they are around $600-1000 so its not as easy as the old days when you could buy one cheap and rob all the parts. The knobs are also the high domed heavy kurnled knobs from the early 50's the heavy ones.

jwells393 · June 25th, 2008, 04:26 PM

Here's what those Champion pickups look like.

......

......

opdev1 · June 25th, 2008, 04:30 PM

Thanks for the help!

Can I just adapt this to a standard tele bridge baseplate (I have one)

The lapsteel is expensive $900 but the 50's tele pups on ebay seem to be more than that I assume I can still get a few hundred back on the steel.

mellecaster · June 25th, 2008, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by opdev1

Thanks for the help!

Can I just adapt this to a standard tele bridge baseplate (I have one)

The lapsteel is expensive $900 but the 50's tele pups on ebay seem to be more than that I assume I can still get a few hundred back on the steel.

I just Sold (2) Early 50s Champion Lapsteels...one thru Gruhns in Nashville...and $900.00 is Way over Market Price...about $650.00 is current for a working all Original.

jwells393 · June 25th, 2008, 05:14 PM

With all the pickup choices available in this day and age, destroying a vintage lap steel to get the pickup seems like such a waste. What's a Champion without a pickup worth ......... not much.

ljslider · July 3rd, 2008, 07:17 PM

I love teles, but I also have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel, and I think it would be absolute sacrilege to wreck such a wonderful instrument. I don't know if its the pick up in mine but with a set of 13s flat wound strings on it and the amp wound up it makes the hairs on the back of your neck stand on end, its like a chorus of angels (or cursing demons!). The pick up is so powerful that I have to "tame" it with an equaliser. I can understand why people want these pups but it seems such a shame to consign a fine vintage instrument to the scap heap.

RandyMcC · September 17th, 2008, 12:11 PM

I too have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel and I lost the case in a watery basement a few years ago. I am wondering if anybody out there knows where I can find a case for this cherished instrument? The one I lost was the original tweed with leather end bindings.

tonewoods · September 17th, 2008, 01:09 PM

"I too have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel and I lost the case in a watery basement a few years ago. I am wondering if anybody out there knows where I can find a case for this cherished instrument?"

I had a "Champion lap steel" search saved on e%$y for quite awhile, and those cases came up quite regularly....

"I love teles, but I also have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel, and I think it would be absolute sacrilege to wreck such a wonderful instrument."

I agree...

but....

I really want to build just one Broadcaster for my own personal use, with the Champion parts I acquired from a pretty trashed (but still functioning) lap steel...

Seymour Duncan now makes a replacement pickup for the Champion, so I'll put the guitar back into shape with new tuners, pots, etc.

And I'll have a Broadcaster for the rest of my life with early 50's guts...

Maybe I'm rationalizing...

tadeo · September 17th, 2008, 01:20 PM

I have one. Already ready to drop in a tele. For sale, if you want to pm me

Tony

soundhound6 · September 17th, 2008, 01:50 PM

Uh...You folks are talkin' about 2 different Fender lap-steels here.
There's a "Champ' model, which is an entry level student model and there's a "Champion" model, which is the next model up.
Then of course, you get into the "studio deluxe" models and such.+$$
I have a '59 Champ with the original electronics,and tweed case w/o handle.
( It was $699 Canadian, on ebay.)

The PUP in mine is a Strat standard vintage bridge. Nothing made especially for a lapsteel, they just used what they had.

Why not just buy a vintage Strat pup and throw that in?
Or are you going for the antique original thing?

If the lap-steel was truly garbage I wouldn't hesitate to scavenge the pup.
If fully functional and complete,I don't think I would.Your call though.

Jan

Alamo · September 17th, 2008, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Davis

The pickup from the Champion is the one you wanna use its shaped like a Tele except it doesnt have a baseplate you have to add a baseplate just as a base so you can install it to a Tele bridge. ...

I don't know if a baseplate is mandatory, but Keith's Micawber sports a lapsteel pickup held with 2 screws for many years & gigs.

pict, courtesty of BlackguardBob

Mark Davis · September 17th, 2008, 03:29 PM

The Champions were made from 49-54 and the Champ was made from 54-72.

The Champ pickup is basiucly a Strat pickup and doesnt sound like the Champion at all.

Here are 2 Champions a rare blue one and the Yellow standard one and the champ

tonewoods · September 17th, 2008, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alamo

I don't know if a baseplate is mandatory, but Keith's Micawber sports a lapsteel pickup held with 2 screws for many years & gigs.

pict, courtesty of BlackguardBob

Anybody recognize the make of that bridgeplate, or is it a custom job??

It's got 3 holes for the normal Tele pup install, so maybe it's off the shelf??

soundhound6 · September 17th, 2008, 03:59 PM

Hey Mark...thanks for the info.That's interesting.
I thought that they were issued at the same time. Live and learn,eh?LOL
Or should I say Live and keep learning,better yet.

That MOT is something else and it looks to be in pretty good shape too. Nice stuff!
What year is your Champ,btw?

The finish on my Champ looks more yellowish and has normal wear and tear on the body.
(the case interior is the gold)

How different are the respective sounds on these puppies.Now I'm curious.LOL

Jan

Alamo · September 17th, 2008, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonewoods

Anybody recognize the make of that bridgeplate, or is it a custom job??

It's got 3 holes for the normal Tele pup install, so maybe it's off the shelf??

It's supposedly a Schecter bridge.
also Schaller used to make these brass bridges with slightly different, more roundish saddles.

so yes, off the shelf - back then.
some person posted a link to a company who make them again.
a good keyword for the search gizmo would be "brassbridge" I guess.

...and sorry for the off topic excursion.

Mark Davis · September 17th, 2008, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soundhound6

Hey Mark...thanks for the info.That's interesting.
I thought that they were issued at the same time. Live and learn,eh?LOL
Or should I say Live and keep learning,better yet.

That MOT is something else and it looks to be in pretty good shape too. Nice stuff!
What year is your Champ,btw?

The finish on my Champ looks more yellowish and has normal wear and tear on the body.
(the case interior is the gold)

How different are the respective sounds on these puppies.Now I'm curious.LOL

Jan

My Champion which is the yellow one in that pic was a 53. I never owned a Champ.

The Champion pickup sounds like an old Tele the Champ doesnt huge difference in sounds.

I dont know anyone thats used a Champ pickup in a Tele they sound really thin and weak.

noisemaker · September 17th, 2008, 06:36 PM

looks kinda "gold-ish".. but i dont get your point?

timmer · September 17th, 2008, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alamo

some person posted a link to a company who make them again.

Are you thinking about the "Andy Summer's" bridge?

Alamo · September 17th, 2008, 08:52 PM

Yeah, that's the one.
thanks for helping out, Timmer.

soundhound6 · September 17th, 2008, 11:01 PM

Your statement that "it sounds thin and weak" is spot on, Mark.

I actually gutted the electronics (stored for safe keeping/future sale.)and replaced the whole works with good quality pots, pickup and that.
I replaced the pup with a SD Coolrails,which I like a lot more.I never liked that
"vintage pup" from the get go.

Jan

spicolli · September 17th, 2008, 11:29 PM

definately dont rape a vintage working condition lap steel, just get a early customshop nocaster bridge pup or another custom wound pup if you really want the broadcaster.

Brass Saddles · November 19th, 2008, 12:43 PM

Folks: I just bought a pick up off of EBAY from a guy in Nashville for reasonable money. I need to add the faceplate and I'm off. I have done this in the past.
Thanks for the good input!! This is why I enjoy The TDPRI !! Thanks Mark Davis, I always enjoy your information.

Brass Saddles
Boston, MA.

Mark Davis · November 19th, 2008, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brass Saddles

June 25th, 2008, 01:14 PM	#1 (permalink)
opdev1 Tele-Meister Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Boston Age: 41 Posts: 294	What champ lapsteel pups can be used in a tele bridge? I was interested in maybe getting a pup from a champ lapsteel for a 52 relic. Maybe an early flat pole to get the broadcaster sound. One of the ones I saw was an early 50's that the dealer said it was not quite a tele shaped pup? What are the steels to get that have the right pup? Are there any other caveats to using them?

June 25th, 2008, 02:12 PM	#2 (permalink)
mellecaster Friend of Leo's Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Maryland Posts: 4,766 17 Photos	None I've ever seen have the same Baseplate as a Tele ?....some Modification is required...Mark Davis did one awhile back...maybe he can share what was involved. __________________ I have never owned an Ipod or Blackberry..and doubt that I ever will......

June 25th, 2008, 03:21 PM	#3 (permalink)
Mark Davis Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bakersfield Ca. Age: 58 Posts: 12,846	The pickup from the Champion is the one you wanna use its shaped like a Tele except it doesnt have a baseplate you have to add a baseplate just as a base so you can install it to a Tele bridge. The other ones from the Champ are more like a Strat pickup and a lower output. The earilest Champion lap steel pickups from 49-51 are usually wound just like the Broadcaster cause thats the pickup Leo based the Broadcasters on usually 8.5-10k ohms the Champion pickups from 52-54 are a little lower in ohms 5.9-6.2k and they sound alot like Jeff Becks Esquire he used with the Yardbirds. These are some grteat pickups that sound just like Vintage Tele pickups. For many many years you could find these Champion steels in pawn shops for $25-75 now they are around $600-1000 so its not as easy as the old days when you could buy one cheap and rob all the parts. The knobs are also the high domed heavy kurnled knobs from the early 50's the heavy ones. __________________ I'm so blind my seeing eye dog needs glasses.

June 25th, 2008, 04:26 PM	#4 (permalink)
jwells393 Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Albuquerque, USA Age: 64 Posts: 12,242 101 Photos	Here's what those Champion pickups look like. ...... ...... __________________ Jack's Disclaimer: When I say something.... always ask yourself ..... "What the hell does he know?" _ Guys - learn to disable the flash on your digital cameras.

June 25th, 2008, 05:14 PM	#7 (permalink)
jwells393 Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Albuquerque, USA Age: 64 Posts: 12,242 101 Photos	With all the pickup choices available in this day and age, destroying a vintage lap steel to get the pickup seems like such a waste. What's a Champion without a pickup worth ......... not much. __________________ Jack's Disclaimer: When I say something.... always ask yourself ..... "What the hell does he know?" _ Guys - learn to disable the flash on your digital cameras.

June 25th, 2008, 04:30 PM	#5 (permalink)
opdev1 Tele-Meister Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Boston Age: 41 Posts: 294	Thanks for the help! Can I just adapt this to a standard tele bridge baseplate (I have one) The lapsteel is expensive $900 but the 50's tele pups on ebay seem to be more than that I assume I can still get a few hundred back on the steel.

July 3rd, 2008, 07:17 PM	#8 (permalink)
ljslider NEW MEMBER! Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Manchester UK Age: 59 Posts: 4	I love teles, but I also have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel, and I think it would be absolute sacrilege to wreck such a wonderful instrument. I don't know if its the pick up in mine but with a set of 13s flat wound strings on it and the amp wound up it makes the hairs on the back of your neck stand on end, its like a chorus of angels (or cursing demons!). The pick up is so powerful that I have to "tame" it with an equaliser. I can understand why people want these pups but it seems such a shame to consign a fine vintage instrument to the scap heap.

September 17th, 2008, 12:11 PM	#9 (permalink)
RandyMcC NEW MEMBER! Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Iowa Age: 50 Posts: 3	I too have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel and I lost the case in a watery basement a few years ago. I am wondering if anybody out there knows where I can find a case for this cherished instrument? The one I lost was the original tweed with leather end bindings.

September 17th, 2008, 01:09 PM	#10 (permalink)
tonewoods Tele-Holic Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Orcas Island, Washington Age: 57 Posts: 676 18 Photos	"I too have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel and I lost the case in a watery basement a few years ago. I am wondering if anybody out there knows where I can find a case for this cherished instrument?" I had a "Champion lap steel" search saved on e%$y for quite awhile, and those cases came up quite regularly.... "I love teles, but I also have a late 40s early 50s Fender Champion lap steel, and I think it would be absolute sacrilege to wreck such a wonderful instrument." I agree... but.... I really want to build just one Broadcaster for my own personal use, with the Champion parts I acquired from a pretty trashed (but still functioning) lap steel... Seymour Duncan now makes a replacement pickup for the Champion, so I'll put the guitar back into shape with new tuners, pots, etc. And I'll have a Broadcaster for the rest of my life with early 50's guts... Maybe I'm rationalizing...

September 17th, 2008, 01:20 PM	#11 (permalink)
tadeo Tele-Meister Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: tennessee Posts: 141	I have one. Already ready to drop in a tele. For sale, if you want to pm me Tony

September 17th, 2008, 01:50 PM	#12 (permalink)
soundhound6 Tele-Meister Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Winnipeg, Mb. Age: 55 Posts: 124	Uh...You folks are talkin' about 2 different Fender lap-steels here. There's a "Champ' model, which is an entry level student model and there's a "Champion" model, which is the next model up. Then of course, you get into the "studio deluxe" models and such.+$$ I have a '59 Champ with the original electronics,and tweed case w/o handle. ( It was $699 Canadian, on ebay.) The PUP in mine is a Strat standard vintage bridge. Nothing made especially for a lapsteel, they just used what they had. Why not just buy a vintage Strat pup and throw that in? Or are you going for the antique original thing? If the lap-steel was truly garbage I wouldn't hesitate to scavenge the pup. If fully functional and complete,I don't think I would.Your call though. Jan __________________ " Don't overthink it, just do it!"

September 17th, 2008, 03:29 PM	#14 (permalink)
Mark Davis Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bakersfield Ca. Age: 58 Posts: 12,846	The Champions were made from 49-54 and the Champ was made from 54-72. The Champ pickup is basiucly a Strat pickup and doesnt sound like the Champion at all. Here are 2 Champions a rare blue one and the Yellow standard one and the champ __________________ I'm so blind my seeing eye dog needs glasses.

September 17th, 2008, 03:59 PM	#16 (permalink)
soundhound6 Tele-Meister Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Winnipeg, Mb. Age: 55 Posts: 124	Hey Mark...thanks for the info.That's interesting. I thought that they were issued at the same time. Live and learn,eh?LOL Or should I say Live and keep learning,better yet. That MOT is something else and it looks to be in pretty good shape too. Nice stuff! What year is your Champ,btw? The finish on my Champ looks more yellowish and has normal wear and tear on the body. (the case interior is the gold) How different are the respective sounds on these puppies.Now I'm curious.LOL Jan __________________ " Don't overthink it, just do it!"

September 17th, 2008, 06:36 PM	#19 (permalink)
noisemaker TDPRI Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: reykjavík Age: 13 Posts: 44	looks kinda "gold-ish".. but i dont get your point?

September 17th, 2008, 08:52 PM	#21 (permalink)
Alamo Tele-Holic Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Berlin, Germany Age: 51 Posts: 742	Yeah, that's the one. thanks for helping out, Timmer.

September 17th, 2008, 11:01 PM	#22 (permalink)
soundhound6 Tele-Meister Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Winnipeg, Mb. Age: 55 Posts: 124	Your statement that "it sounds thin and weak" is spot on, Mark. I actually gutted the electronics (stored for safe keeping/future sale.)and replaced the whole works with good quality pots, pickup and that. I replaced the pup with a SD Coolrails,which I like a lot more.I never liked that "vintage pup" from the get go. Jan __________________ " Don't overthink it, just do it!"

September 17th, 2008, 11:29 PM	#23 (permalink)
spicolli Tele-Meister Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: 315 Age: 32 Posts: 418	definately dont rape a vintage working condition lap steel, just get a early customshop nocaster bridge pup or another custom wound pup if you really want the broadcaster. __________________ Rock and roll around my head Fifty watts happening

November 19th, 2008, 12:43 PM	#24 (permalink)
Brass Saddles Tele-Meister Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 432	Great Stuff Folks: I just bought a pick up off of EBAY from a guy in Nashville for reasonable money. I need to add the faceplate and I'm off. I have done this in the past. Thanks for the good input!! This is why I enjoy The TDPRI !! Thanks Mark Davis, I always enjoy your information. Brass Saddles Boston, MA.