Pinecaster with a Bigsby

[RotelliCaster]

The pickups came today and they look nice, Chrome and String.
I have not read one bad thing about these pickups so I have high hopes for them they are supposed to be clear yet twangy with some extra bite when turn all the way up. I guess you have to roll back on the throttle a bit to get the Classic Tele sound.



I also decide to try a tru-oil finish. There is another thread on the Tru-oil subject where "Popthree", "RomanS" and "dcn3" all shared awesome pics of some Tru-Oil finished Tele's.
http://www.tdpri.com/forum/bad-dog-c...cs-please.html

[RomanS]

If you want to get a shiny, lacquer-like finish with Tru Oil, like on the rosewood Tele I posted in the other thread you mentioned, I have to warn you that this will take LOTS of time & work...

That rosewood Tele of mine has about 20 to 25 coats of Tru Oil on it, and it is still far from perfect on close inspection; oh, and inbetween coats you have to wait at least half a day, so don't expect to be finished soon!

Some more tips: when you start finishing the body with tru oil, get some wet sanding paper, not the finest kind for final polishing, not to coarse, either - something in the 180 to 320 range; apply the Tru Oil liberally for the first coat, and while it is still wet, start sanding - you want to work up a slush of wood particles and Tru Oil, and you have to try to work that stuff into the open pores & grain of the wood; let it dry for at least a day, then start sanding back the ugly result wit some 250 to 400 grit paper; you'll have to do that two or three times, and it's not going to look pretty at first, but after a couple of times, most of the grain will have been sealed, and you'll have a flat surface.
Now you need to start applying the Tru Oil in the thinnest cots imaginable; some people recommend using your bare fingers - that did absolutely not work for me, I got very uneven, blotchy results with lots of runs; after some experimentation with brushes (-> uneven, streaky results), and various kinds of cloth, paper towels, etc. (-> made me find out that the concept of "lint-free" is pure fiction), I found that it worked best if I applied the Tru Oil with a sponge; I used regular kitchen sponges, like you use for cleaning dishes; you'll need lots, since they'll harden up once the Tru Oil inside them hardens, and they have to be soft so as not to leave any streaks; I also found that it helped if I thinned the Tru Oil a bit with boiled linseed oil (about 2 or 3 parts of Tru Oil per part of boiled linseed oil) - this helped me with applying thinner coats, because uncut Tru Oil is a bit thick andgets sticky very fast - and applying the coats as thin as posiible is the key to a great result here!
The wet finish tends to really attract airborne dust particles, so you'd better hang the body in the cleanest part of your house (eg. bathroom - run the shower really hot for a few minutes, the steam will get rid of some of the airborne dust); don't be tempted to remove any dust particles with your fingers while the Tru Oil is still wet - the resulting fingerprints and blotches will be hard to remove.
I did some sanding with 400 to 600 grit paper after every 3 or 4 coats, to get rid of said dust particles; but make sure you let the last coat dry at least 2 or 3 days before you do any sanding!
For the final coat I thinned the Tru Oil even more with boiled linseed oil, and applied the thinnest coat I could achieve, then let it dry fo about a week before I rubbed it down by hand (no more sanding of the final coat).

[RotelliCaster]

Thank you Roman! That is some great information, very detailed in the How-To.

I may take a simpler approach and do light coats, sand, buff... and see how it comes out. this pine is so white I don't think I'll see all of the things that you did on the rosewood, which BTW look incredible!

I drilled the pickup plate a few minutes ago and before I did I decided to fit the new Tonerider in an see how things felt.

Well I'll be darned!!!! The pickup I first used, an old MIM form the parts box, had a bigger base then the Tonerider and any other quality Tele pup, I'm sure.

This allowed me to close about half of the gap between the Plate and the PG.



Now when I stagger the cups for the bridge I should be able to intonate precisely.

Measure more than twice then drill!!!!

[RotelliCaster]

The EZ-Lok wood inserts came in today. I ordered four of them with an 8-32 internal screw thread and for with a 6-32 thread. I wasn't sure which screw head would seat in the counter sink of the Bigsby, best. When I saw that the 8-32 would fit well, the fella at the store was cool enough to tell me I didn't have to take both sets of inserts, of course I did. all 8 of these, cost less than 5 bucks! Both the 8-32 and the 6-32 have the same outside dimensions they are just tapped different and the 6-32 will work great on the next tremolo I install.

Taipan, thanks for the heads up on these!!! They are gonna work like a charm and you'll never know their in there.


Here it is next to the Common Hardware store piece.
The EZ-Lok has more threads, that are knife sharp,a tighter pattern more mass. A+

[RotelliCaster]

I decided to do a test with the Tru-Oil. I took a block of wood that I drill holes in and use for holding my Leather tools. This piece of wood must have been a 2x4 form an attic of an old house, as it is the driest piece of wood I have ever held in my hand. Sanded it with 220 real quick just to clean it up a bit. It looks to be a piece of cedar.




I did a wash coat of 2 parts Tru-Oil and 1 part Naphtha. Then I rubbed on one coat each morning before work and one coat in the evening when I got home. This is the result of 1 wash coat and five full coats.




I started on the body yesterday. I drilled the 1/4 holes for the inserts, sanded the body to 600, did a wash coat and a standard coat.

I'll post more later, mothers day now!

[robt57]

OK, I want some of the paisley material!!!!!

[RotelliCaster]

Originally Posted by robt57

OK, I want some of the paisley material!!!!!

It sure makes a cool work bench!

[robt57]

Originally Posted by RotelliCaster

It sure makes a cool work bench!

Make a cooler top for one of my Teles glued and edge bursted with lots of Nitro clear over it. ;)

[RotelliCaster]

Here are some pictures after 1 thinned wash coat and 4 regular coats






The method I am using is pretty simple.

I put a little bit of oil in a small cup (Oriental tea cup) and then I'm using T-Shirt material to wipe the oil on. I put it on as quick and smooth as I can with out getting any runs. It gets sticky pretty quick, so I have to work fast.
Just before the next coat, I lightly rub the whole thing down with a gray Scotch Brite pad, I think it's the finest there is.
If I find a run, hair, dust spec or any of the billion things that seem to be attracted to the body with fresh oil, I sand that out with 600 grit and blend it with the scotch brite.

I hope to do two coats per day, skipping a day here and there for the next couple of weeks, until I have 20-30 coats. Once that's done I'll let it cure for a few days and then polish it real well.

[RotelliCaster]

I plan on using a four way switch in this guitar, just for the fun of it. I also have a Bill Lawrence Q-filter that didn't work out for me on an Esquire build last year. The Q-filter has been the toughest thing to get any usable information on. I have posted here asking for info, searched the web as well as talking to Bill on the phone (bill talks way over my head )
I have found enough information to make me want to try this unit, but it has always left me with more questions. So............

I tested the Q-filter this weekend with some Tonerider vintage plus pickups (I've been told it works better with hot pickups). I used a few different resistors and found a combo that sounded real cool.

The tone pot became a very usable component, the slightest turn made significant changes to the tone. The Q-filter doesn't just roll off the highs, it is more like and EQ system. I am trying to keep for saying it's more musical, but now I have It is hard to describe a tone but I thought I would give an update. I am going to wire this into my current Pinecaster build, with a push Pull tone pot and Tonerider Hot Classic pickups and a 4 way switch, this should be a cool rig.

Here is the schematic I have come up with. I'm no expert so please tell me if there is anything that needs to be changed.

[mobman924]

Beautiful guitar. May I ask where the source is for the wood?

[RotelliCaster]

Originally Posted by mobman924

Beautiful guitar. May I ask where the source is for the wood?

Thank you, it is a 1 piece body made of northern white pine. We don't get this kind of pine where we live, ours id Yellow and knotty. The body comes from a TDPRI member by the name of Marty (Guitarbuilder). You will find threads here that refer to Pine Mart, that would be Marty as well. He has/had a couple of bodies for #2 bodies for sale in the classified section yesterday.

also...

Welcome to The TDPRI! glad to see another fellow Okie in the forum.

[RotelliCaster]

I figured it was time to install the wood inserts, in case they caused any finish cracking or bulging of the wood. These things are great! The have a pilot tip, so they help to square themselves in the hole. The knife threads slice as they drill and you get no bulging as they go down.



Look at the reflection in the finish of picture #1! I'm calling it good on the Tru-Oil finish. I have lost count of the coats but I know it's more than 12. It looks good enough to me and I'm starting to put too much work into it. I have sanded the finish smooth and dull two different times now only to find out that I can't seen to buff it back to the shine it has on an unbroken coat.
I put another shine (Super thin) coat on it this evening after one of these sandings and I may put one more shine coat just before bed. I went with the Tru-Oil to keep this simple so I should stick with that plan. Although it's has it's dips, bubbles, lint.... it still looks darn good.

[RomanS]

Originally Posted by RotelliCaster

Although it's has it's dips, bubbles, lint.... it still looks darn good.

Sounds exactly like my Tru Oil-finished rosewood topped Thinline - looks nice in pictures and from a few feet away, but you'd better not examine it up close...

[RotelliCaster]

Roman, (or anyone else)

I noticed in you photos that you have two different bridge setups on Bigsby equipped Tele's. One is the floating bridge like I have on this rig and the other is a three saddle, ash tray / vintage style bridge, with the back notch out.

Is there a difference in sound, function or any thing else to consider.
Which one do you like best and why?

From what I can tell already, I am going to have some issues with the height adjuster screws one the saddle of the floating bridge. unless I run the string down the center of each saddle (not gonna happen), the screws on the slack side will loosen and rattle. I'm confident that I will overcome this problem, it's the same on any of the six saddle bridges with the barrel type saddles, that I have worked with.

[RomanS]

Absolutely, there's a big difference in sound between these two bridge types - as you have noticed, my solidbody Tele has a Bigsby B50 (which has that extra bar for increasing string pressure) and a notched ashtray bridge, the Thinline has a B16 (no extra bar) with a TOM-style roller bridge - there other differences between these two guitars (solidbody vs. Thinline, alder vs. swamp ash with rosewood top), but here are the main differences:

B50 w/ notched ashtray bridge: sounds & feels like a Tele; twangy, punchy, bright; if you'd hear it blindfolded, you'd never notice the difference to a Bigsby-less traditional Tele. No neck-shimming required, so it feels like a trad. Tele. Stiffer action of the trem bar (but still loser than a non-floating Strat-style trem).

B16 w/ TOM-style roller bridge: doesn't sound like a traditional Tele (and it's not the pickups - I've confirmed this by swapping them between the two guitars); much softer type of twang (kinda like on a Gretsch), less punchy, but more harmonic complexity (maybe a bit like a Jazzmaster) - this is probably not only due to the different bridge type (which doesn't really enforce Tele twang, like the ashtray does), but also to the fact that there's no extra presure bar behind the bridge on the B16, so the strings can ring there with lots of harmonic vibrations (you can hear that when playing it unplugged) - very much like on archtop guitars or Jazzmasters. The neck has to be shimmed A LOT to achieve a sufficient break angle over the saddles - so the strings sit much higher above the top of the guitar, like on Gibson-style guitars with TOM bridges. So, espite the Tele pickups, this guitar is a Tele only in looks/bodyshape, in tone it definitely veers towards a more Gretschy vibe...

[RomanS]

PS: And I wouldn't exactly call the bridge on my second one "floating" - since I had to shim the neck a lot and raise the TOM really far for a sufficient break angle, the bridge was sitting rather insecurely on its studs, swaying a lot when using the tremolo, so I shimmed it with washers - now it's really solid, and doesn't move/float at all...

[RotelliCaster]

Roman, Thanks for the feedback on the bridges, I'm going to use a 3 saddle vintage style bridge on the next one.

Well, here She is.....






I still have to wire it, string it, set it up and play the heck out of it. It sure looks good on the wall with the other 6 Tele's.

I'm still waiting on the push/pull pot but I'll get all of the wiring done up to the point of the tone pot.

Ciao

[RotelliCaster]

I got tired of waiting on the push/pull pot so I wired a standard tone pot, so I could get this setup and playing. I'm not sure what's going on but I'm a little disappointed in the sound. I'm new to the 4 way switch and the Jazz master bridge. The Tonerider Hot Classics are not too hot. I mean they are kinda tame. The Neck pup has more out put than the bridge pup and I'm not sure if that has to do with the switch or the bridge itself. The neck pup has a good bit of bark, it not muddy at all and it's louder than my other neck pups even the Keystone. The lead pickup is warm just a little brighter than the neck pup but not as loud. I have adjusted them up and down and tilt and.... Not sure what it is. Any thoughts?