Help! What is "medium jumbo"?

Hucklebilly · April 9th, 2008, 08:09 PM

After searching the forum, I'm no closer to an answer. My Am Std came with "medium jumbo," but what exactly is that? 6105 or 6150?

What is the standard Fender fret wire for modern 9.5 necks?

Dave W · April 9th, 2008, 09:19 PM

I don't know exactly what Fender uses, but medium jumbo means width of .100 or more and medium height (typically between .040 and .049). Dunlop 6150 (.102x.042) is a medium jumbo, but Fender's medium jumbo may be a shade higher. Dunlop 6105 (.090x.055) is tall but normal width, like what most newer Gibsons use.

oscar100 · April 10th, 2008, 05:14 AM

6105 i assume

Hafner · April 10th, 2008, 05:50 AM

This is the Warmoth information, "Medium Jumbo" is 6130 here:

http://www.warmoth.com/supplies/supp...ction=fretwire

Casternuts · April 10th, 2008, 09:15 AM

I knew a girl once that was "Medium Jumbo". Now that i think of it she might have been "Jumbo" I don't know i'm confused.

Hucklebilly · April 10th, 2008, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hafner

This is the Warmoth information, "Medium Jumbo" is 6130 here:

http://www.warmoth.com/supplies/supp...ction=fretwire

And the plot thickens!

Apparently "medium jumbo" can mean a lot of things. Does anyone know what Fender uses on Am Std teles?

woodman · April 10th, 2008, 10:58 AM

as i've understood it over the years, "medium jumbo" refers to the kind of frets you used to find on 335's and other vintage Gibson models ... now there seems to be no official dimension, just wider and a little lower than vintage Fender. not to diss Leo or anything, but i prefer medium jumbo to Fender vintage. (YMMV!)

straightface · April 10th, 2008, 11:04 AM

From what I've found, there seems to be a difference in the sizes depending on the vendor. I have a USACG neck with 6150 that is wider than I expected, but I've also been told that Fender MJ is 6150. My Fender with MJ is certainly not the same as my USACG neck with 6150. I recently got a neck from Rich and Chris Rice that has 6105 wire and it feels closer to my Fender MJ wire. USACG has 6125 fret size that actually is closer to what is normally 6105 I think, and their 6105 is taller than most, IIRC. Confused? I guess the answer is, it depends on where you buy it.

Telemarkman · April 10th, 2008, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woodman

just wider and a little lower than vintage Fender.

The medium jumbos on my American Series Tele certainly were wider than the vintage frets on my other Teles, but there's no way they were lower ..... actually I would say they were taller.

PJ · April 10th, 2008, 09:33 PM

I have both Fender 9.5" radius and a Warmoth neck with 6105s. They're very similar in height and width. The 6105s might be a tad narrower, but very close. I prefer either of these over the traditional
Fender vintage frets, which I find a little small. The action has to be quite low, at least for me, to get a good feel with the vintage frets.
That being said, I do have a few guitars with them - I just find in comparison, I gravitate to the 6105 (or Fender Medium Jumbo) size,
as a preference. I do think, that the 9.5" board, with those Fender MJumbos, is a terrific combination.

boris bubbanov · April 11th, 2008, 12:19 PM

Like I been saying, the whole system needs to be junked. Nobody really knows what the size of anything is, you just use what you got.

FWIW, I bought 4 6150 fretted and 6 6105 fretted necks from Warmoth; I think the 6150 feels more familiar to my Fenders with their 'medium jumbo'; whereas the 6105 seems more slender and thus seems tall next to Fender 'vintage reissue' wire.

As they say in New Oyuns: "throw me something, Mister!"

woodman · April 11th, 2008, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telemarkman

The medium jumbos on my American Series Tele certainly were wider than the vintage frets on my other Teles, but there's no way they were lower ..... actually I would say they were taller.

that goes to illustrate how muddled the fret-size jargon is ... Warmoth gives their medium jumbo specs as .106" wide X .036" high, while the Fender vintage frets are .080" wide X .043" high. they call their medium jumbos 6130, while Fender's 6105 "medium jumbos" are a bit taller at .047". go figure! USAGC avoids the whole terminology confusion by simply giving the dimensions and description.

Ronkirn · April 11th, 2008, 12:51 PM

"Medium Jumbo" is as specific as "Swamp Ash" or Nitrocellulose Lacquer" today.

Specificity is rapidly becoming something that will be found only in Museums dealing with our language.

Wouldn't it be interesting if all descriptions had to be in Latin.

Ron Kirn

GuitarJonz · April 11th, 2008, 02:24 PM

My best neck has 6150. When I play 6105, they are OK, but just don't feel as "right" to me as the 6150 that I'm used to. A while back, I bought a used Warmoth neck advertised with medium jumbo. Stupid me didn't ask, expecting 6150 or 6105, it ended up being the much shorter 6130, what Warmoth calls medium jumbo. I need some height for string bending, so it had to go, although it wasn't terrible when paired with their compound radius neck.

Had a KBR tele neck a while back with big dog 6100's, they were big, but surprisingly I adjusted easily. Still like the 6150 best. Don't fret about it

Dave W · April 11th, 2008, 05:12 PM

The numbers were originally Jim Dunlop product codes, and Dunlop still uses them. But Dunlop doesn't have names like "medium jumbo" or "vintage," those terms just came to be associated with certain sizes.

IMO the cause of the confusion is that Warmoth's descriptions don't match the descriptions most everyone else used. Warmoth uses the same numbers for sizes that are close to or identical to Dunlop, but they use descriptions that don't match the descriptions people used for Dunlops. e.g. Warmoth calls their 6150 a "true jumbo", but that was what most everybody else called medium jumbo. It's not tall enoughto be a true jumbo. And Warmoth calls their 6130 a medium jumbo even though it's not high enough to be a medium.

Ed Bickert · April 11th, 2008, 07:36 PM

Jeez, I didn't know the answer was so complicated. Google the question and you get as fair an answer as needed. Along with pictures.

Lastly, as most will tell you, get out and play the things, find what you like, and then find out what it is.

Rob DiStefano · April 11th, 2008, 08:22 PM

Since there are many makers of fret wire, using word labels to define fret size is useless and plain dumb.

To know precisely what wire you require or are dealing with, get the crown width and height. And, in this case, YMMV will never apply.

PJ · April 12th, 2008, 01:46 AM

All the nomenclature really does is get you close. Just think of it as
S, M & L. Small being vintage, medium & jumbo being large. There is some confusion in that there's medium, medium jumbo and jumbo.
So, really, it's S, M, L, with two sizes of M. Whenever I've had a neck refretted, I ask to see the fret wire before it's installed. So, at least I know what I'm getting. I always try to go with "one size up" from vintage. Whatever that is.

Rob DiStefano · April 12th, 2008, 07:16 AM

Fender "vintage frets" - there's a much wider spectrum of crown sizes happening here than you'd expect, but for the very most part yer looking at .078" to .080" for the crown width and between .041" and .043" for the crown height. But there WERE variances and some of the really older frets were lots smaller, in the banjo fret size range. And SOME of the older 50's necks I've worked on had near "jumbo fret" sized original frets.

With fret sizes, there are no rules, but there are guidelines. Drop the fret label speak and let's all talk the actual numbers ... but in reality, that ain't gonna happen, oh well ......

Rich Rice · April 22nd, 2008, 05:33 AM

I'd have to agree that the numbers are the only surefire way to specify what you want. With the help of the internet and low cost stores like Harbor Freight, it is pretty reasonable to purchase digital calipers, which would put most of us on the same page, and avoid confusion.

alanfc · June 3rd, 2008, 05:30 AM

Instead of a re-fret on my used MIM,,, is there a way I can bring them down to more like the Gibson/6130 feel? (based on the Warmoth pic above)
They're pretty high now. Definitely "speed bumps". Hurts my fingers. I don't know if I'm supposed to get used to them or to do something about it.
Is there a DIY way I can flatten these down a bit?

Telemarkman · June 3rd, 2008, 06:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanfc

Is there a DIY way I can flatten these down a bit?

I did it to my Gibson Les Paul Deluxe (1970), and it was very successful.

I used a real long flat file (without the handle) and made a "fretless wonder" out of it. Of course you have to be very accurate, and I'm sure some will advise against it, but it worked for me

...

postjob62 · June 3rd, 2008, 09:16 AM

"Medium Jumbo" doesn't even mean the same thing within the same company, if you consider Fender and Squier to be the same.

The MJ's on my Squier '51's aren't close to the size of the MJ's on my recent MIM Std.

alanfc · June 3rd, 2008, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Telemarkman

I did it to my Gibson Les Paul Deluxe (1970), and it was very successful.

I used a real long flat file (without the handle) and made a "fretless wonder" out of it. Of course you have to be very accurate, and I'm sure some will advise against it, but it worked for me

...

OK thanks! I'll be reading more on it

e-merlin · June 3rd, 2008, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanfc

Instead of a re-fret on my used MIM,,, is there a way I can bring them down to more like the Gibson/6130 feel? (based on the Warmoth pic above)
They're pretty high now. Definitely "speed bumps". Hurts my fingers. I don't know if I'm supposed to get used to them or to do something about it.
Is there a DIY way I can flatten these down a bit?

There are several websites that have a tutorial on fret leveling. You'd just have to use that method to grind 'em down where you want 'em.

April 9th, 2008, 08:09 PM	#1 (permalink)
Hucklebilly Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 800 2 Photos	Help! What is "medium jumbo"? After searching the forum, I'm no closer to an answer. My Am Std came with "medium jumbo," but what exactly is that? 6105 or 6150? What is the standard Fender fret wire for modern 9.5 necks?

April 10th, 2008, 05:14 AM	#3 (permalink)
oscar100 TDPRI Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: UK Posts: 68	6105 i assume __________________ swedish interior design mora clocks gustavian furniture

April 10th, 2008, 05:50 AM	#4 (permalink)
Hafner Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Switzerland Age: 60 Posts: 1,552 18 Photos	This is the Warmoth information, "Medium Jumbo" is 6130 here: http://www.warmoth.com/supplies/supp...ction=fretwire __________________ Manfred

April 10th, 2008, 10:58 AM	#7 (permalink)
woodman Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Mint Hill, NC Age: 62 Posts: 5,965	as i've understood it over the years, "medium jumbo" refers to the kind of frets you used to find on 335's and other vintage Gibson models ... now there seems to be no official dimension, just wider and a little lower than vintage Fender. not to diss Leo or anything, but i prefer medium jumbo to Fender vintage. (YMMV!) __________________ Truth is stranger than fact ... www.myspace.com/woodymitchellmusic BAND PAGES: www.myspace.com/stragglerswing (Stragglers - Western Swing) www.myspace.com/loafersgloryband (Loafers Glory - '70s country-rock)

April 10th, 2008, 11:04 AM	#8 (permalink)
straightface Tele-Holic Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: MA Posts: 886	From what I've found, there seems to be a difference in the sizes depending on the vendor. I have a USACG neck with 6150 that is wider than I expected, but I've also been told that Fender MJ is 6150. My Fender with MJ is certainly not the same as my USACG neck with 6150. I recently got a neck from Rich and Chris Rice that has 6105 wire and it feels closer to my Fender MJ wire. USACG has 6125 fret size that actually is closer to what is normally 6105 I think, and their 6105 is taller than most, IIRC. Confused? I guess the answer is, it depends on where you buy it. __________________ At the end of time, all that will remain is Keith Richards, a Fender Telecaster, a bunch of cockroaches, and roots rock music. With nobody left to categorize it for, I bet Keef’ll just call it rock and roll… -Brian Henneman of The Bottle Rockets

April 9th, 2008, 09:19 PM	#2 (permalink)
Dave W Tele-Afflicted Join Date: May 2003 Location: Guadalupe County, TX Age: 61 Posts: 1,773	I don't know exactly what Fender uses, but medium jumbo means width of .100 or more and medium height (typically between .040 and .049). Dunlop 6150 (.102x.042) is a medium jumbo, but Fender's medium jumbo may be a shade higher. Dunlop 6105 (.090x.055) is tall but normal width, like what most newer Gibsons use.

April 10th, 2008, 09:15 AM	#5 (permalink)
Casternuts TDPRI Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: CT Age: 52 Posts: 89	I knew a girl once that was "Medium Jumbo". Now that i think of it she might have been "Jumbo" I don't know i'm confused.

April 10th, 2008, 09:33 PM	#10 (permalink)
PJ Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 2,077 4 Photos	I have both Fender 9.5" radius and a Warmoth neck with 6105s. They're very similar in height and width. The 6105s might be a tad narrower, but very close. I prefer either of these over the traditional Fender vintage frets, which I find a little small. The action has to be quite low, at least for me, to get a good feel with the vintage frets. That being said, I do have a few guitars with them - I just find in comparison, I gravitate to the 6105 (or Fender Medium Jumbo) size, as a preference. I do think, that the 9.5" board, with those Fender MJumbos, is a terrific combination. __________________ PJ "I don't know if it's art, but I like it."

April 11th, 2008, 12:19 PM	#11 (permalink)
boris bubbanov Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: New Orleans, LA + in the past Posts: 8,540	Like I been saying, the whole system needs to be junked. Nobody really knows what the size of anything is, you just use what you got. FWIW, I bought 4 6150 fretted and 6 6105 fretted necks from Warmoth; I think the 6150 feels more familiar to my Fenders with their 'medium jumbo'; whereas the 6105 seems more slender and thus seems tall next to Fender 'vintage reissue' wire. As they say in New Oyuns: "throw me something, Mister!" __________________ Bubban0v

April 11th, 2008, 12:51 PM	#13 (permalink)
Ronkirn Friend of Leo's Join Date: May 2003 Location: Jacksonville, FL Age: 62 Posts: 2,745	"Medium Jumbo" is as specific as "Swamp Ash" or Nitrocellulose Lacquer" today. Specificity is rapidly becoming something that will be found only in Museums dealing with our language. Wouldn't it be interesting if all descriptions had to be in Latin. Ron Kirn __________________ A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have. – Thomas Jefferson Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you! -Pericles (430 B.C.)

April 11th, 2008, 02:24 PM	#14 (permalink)
GuitarJonz Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Central Mass. Posts: 2,774 7 Photos	My best neck has 6150. When I play 6105, they are OK, but just don't feel as "right" to me as the 6150 that I'm used to. A while back, I bought a used Warmoth neck advertised with medium jumbo. Stupid me didn't ask, expecting 6150 or 6105, it ended up being the much shorter 6130, what Warmoth calls medium jumbo. I need some height for string bending, so it had to go, although it wasn't terrible when paired with their compound radius neck. Had a KBR tele neck a while back with big dog 6100's, they were big, but surprisingly I adjusted easily. Still like the 6150 best. Don't fret about it

April 11th, 2008, 05:12 PM	#15 (permalink)
Dave W Tele-Afflicted Join Date: May 2003 Location: Guadalupe County, TX Age: 61 Posts: 1,773	The numbers were originally Jim Dunlop product codes, and Dunlop still uses them. But Dunlop doesn't have names like "medium jumbo" or "vintage," those terms just came to be associated with certain sizes. IMO the cause of the confusion is that Warmoth's descriptions don't match the descriptions most everyone else used. Warmoth uses the same numbers for sizes that are close to or identical to Dunlop, but they use descriptions that don't match the descriptions people used for Dunlops. e.g. Warmoth calls their 6150 a "true jumbo", but that was what most everybody else called medium jumbo. It's not tall enoughto be a true jumbo. And Warmoth calls their 6130 a medium jumbo even though it's not high enough to be a medium.

April 11th, 2008, 07:36 PM	#16 (permalink)
Ed Bickert Tele-Holic Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Cape Cod, MA Age: 40 Posts: 946	Jeez, I didn't know the answer was so complicated. Google the question and you get as fair an answer as needed. Along with pictures. Lastly, as most will tell you, get out and play the things, find what you like, and then find out what it is. __________________ Sorry, not the real Ed Bickert. Just a fan.

April 11th, 2008, 08:22 PM	#17 (permalink)
Rob DiStefano Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Park Ridge, NJ Age: 62 Posts: 4,788	Since there are many makers of fret wire, using word labels to define fret size is useless and plain dumb. To know precisely what wire you require or are dealing with, get the crown width and height. And, in this case, YMMV will never apply.

April 12th, 2008, 01:46 AM	#18 (permalink)
PJ Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 2,077 4 Photos	All the nomenclature really does is get you close. Just think of it as S, M & L. Small being vintage, medium & jumbo being large. There is some confusion in that there's medium, medium jumbo and jumbo. So, really, it's S, M, L, with two sizes of M. Whenever I've had a neck refretted, I ask to see the fret wire before it's installed. So, at least I know what I'm getting. I always try to go with "one size up" from vintage. Whatever that is. __________________ PJ "I don't know if it's art, but I like it."

April 12th, 2008, 07:16 AM	#19 (permalink)
Rob DiStefano Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Park Ridge, NJ Age: 62 Posts: 4,788	Fender "vintage frets" - there's a much wider spectrum of crown sizes happening here than you'd expect, but for the very most part yer looking at .078" to .080" for the crown width and between .041" and .043" for the crown height. But there WERE variances and some of the really older frets were lots smaller, in the banjo fret size range. And SOME of the older 50's necks I've worked on had near "jumbo fret" sized original frets. With fret sizes, there are no rules, but there are guidelines. Drop the fret label speak and let's all talk the actual numbers ... but in reality, that ain't gonna happen, oh well ......

April 22nd, 2008, 05:33 AM	#20 (permalink)
Rich Rice Friend of Leo's Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In a dream world.. Just ask my wife. Age: 53 Posts: 2,598 11 Photos	I'd have to agree that the numbers are the only surefire way to specify what you want. With the help of the internet and low cost stores like Harbor Freight, it is pretty reasonable to purchase digital calipers, which would put most of us on the same page, and avoid confusion. __________________ Please visit my website! If you are driven to play, you will find a way.

June 3rd, 2008, 05:30 AM	#21 (permalink)
alanfc Tele-Meister Join Date: May 2004 Location: Paradise Posts: 346	Instead of a re-fret on my used MIM,,, is there a way I can bring them down to more like the Gibson/6130 feel? (based on the Warmoth pic above) They're pretty high now. Definitely "speed bumps". Hurts my fingers. I don't know if I'm supposed to get used to them or to do something about it. Is there a DIY way I can flatten these down a bit? __________________ Strats/Teles/LesPaul/Rivera/Engl Band: http://www.myspace.com/rocketchirac

June 3rd, 2008, 09:16 AM	#23 (permalink)
postjob62 Tele-Meister Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Georgia Age: 59 Posts: 495	"Medium Jumbo" doesn't even mean the same thing within the same company, if you consider Fender and Squier to be the same. The MJ's on my Squier '51's aren't close to the size of the MJ's on my recent MIM Std. __________________ You wore a diamond watch, claimed it was from Uncle Joe; Well, I looked at the inscription, it said "Love from Daddy-O"