changing a nut

[papoon]

hi I'm not the most technical guy and i just got a 2012 American standard tele i think i may need to change the nut as there is a real bad buzzing on the low(thickest) E and A strings there is a tiny bit of buzzing on the wrest of the strings but you can hardly notice and it can't be heard through the amp but the E and A are really bad and you can really here it through an amp, the neck seems to be ok and i tried to raise the strings at the bridge it did not help, the buzz is everywhere on the fret board top to bottom fretted and open string as well, the E being really bad anyway my question is can i just buy a new nut for it and just put it on or is this something i have to find a luthier to do, thanks in advance

[cleanman]

i would take it to a luthier the first time out just in case there are other issues adding to the buzz problem. the raising the strings and getting no difference sounds like an issue.

[bullfrogblues]

That doesn't sound like a nut slot issue, a low nut slot would not affect fretted notes, only the open string. Hold down the string/strings at the 3rd fret and see how much clearance you have between the string and the first fret. There should be around a business card thickness between the string and the first fret, or a little less.

[papoon]

hi thanks for the quick replies it is very appreciated, i held down the strings at the third fret and checked with a business card at the first fret and there is a little less then the card maybe half the card thickness, the fretted notes are effected as well as open string so if not the nut could it be the relief on the neck and if so is there a easy way to check i don't have a straight edge or feeler gauges, taking it to a luthier is not impossible but it is a challenge for me at the moment, so would love to check and try to resolve as much as i can first, any help is really appreciated, also just to ease my mind can this be something really major. by the way i'm using 9's-42's strings

[bullfrogblues]

The easiest way to check relief, other than visually sighting down the guitar neck, from either end, is to depress one of the strings at the first and 20th fret and see how much deflection you have at say the 10th fret. Once again, I like about a business card or less relief between the frets and the string while doing that process. If you have one or more high frets, you may need more relief than that. I like my necks pretty flat.
good luck. Your final option might be a fret level, crown and polish and a good setup.

[papoon]

thanks so much for this help, i did exactly what you said to check the relief on the neck , holding down the first and 20th frets i inserted a standard business card at the 9th and then the 10th fret and i had to use a little bit of force to slide it in between the fret and the thick E string on both positions , it did not just slide in and out easily or with no resistance, i do play a little heavily at times and just wanted to mention as well that the guitar is literally brand new (about 3 weeks) am. stnd tele so does it seem i may need a little more relief on the neck, i think I'd have to turn counter clockwise, wondering what you advice at this point before i proceed, and thanks again this means a lot to me

[dsutton24]

You probably do need a little more relief, but that's only going to improve the buzz from about the seventh through the first fret. In general I have better results when I set up Telecasters with very little relief, and really I only leave a 'little' relief in it because it's hard to tell when you go from flat to back bowed.

Anyhew...

To me it sounds more like you've got a high fret somewhere. Find something with an absolutely straight edge around three inches long, many people use the edge of a credit card. Go up and down the neck between each pair of strings, and lay your straight edge on the frets so that it straddles three frets at a time. If you find a spot where the straight edge will rock like a teeter-totter, then you know the middle fret is high.

[mg426]

Do you have plenty of adjustment at the bridge ???? Might need a shim at the neck pocket..??

[ScottieHotrod]

There will always be a little buzz, if you are playing really hard then it is unavoidable.

Don't take offense but are you a new player confusing twang with buzz? I only ask because raising the saddles should have cured any fret buzz. Unless you didn't go high enough.

[Rob DiStefano]

firstly, check the nut relief - fret each string between the 2nd and 3rd frets and observe the space between the bottom of each string and the top of the first fret. no space? this could mean an issue with the nut slot depth.

check neck relief fretting the first fret of the low 'e' string and at the same time fret that same string at the 19th fret (or so) - observe the space between the botton of that low 'e' string and the 8th fret (or so). no space means no neck relief and that can mean string buzzing. adjust the truss rod to suit.

also, there is string rattle and string buzz - rattle is string/fret noise that doesn't come through to the amp, whilst buzz is not so good and an indication of worn or unleveled frets.

[papoon]

hi, thanks for the replies, it is for sure a buzzing, you can clearly hear it through an amp,i have played a Tele for 5 years so i am fairly used to them though this guitar is brand new, i fretted each string between fret 2 and 3 and checked fret 1 there was a bit of space between the string and the fret, i checked the relief using a standard business card (in detail in earlier post) though not a lot there is some relief, it's only the "E" and the next string down the "A" though the "E" is worse, if i play very very lightly there is no buzz but the minute i play like a barre chord from light to moderate you hear the distinct buzz even with some overdrive, as well as just playing the string open you can here the buzz, i was wondering is it unusual that only 2 of the strings side by side are buzzing, i did raise the saddles so they are higher than spec for sure (only a couple of threads on the screw above the saddle left) so they are turned in quite a bit, i will try to get some feeler gauges and post some actual measurements tomorrow,should the saddles be level or can they angle at all or should the screw on either side be both at the same height , the only good thing about all this is the help I'm getting from everyone here, i am learning lots so a very big thank you.

[bullfrogblues]

According to specs, your guitar has a 9 1/2" radius, so you should be able to get the action down fairly low, approximately 1/16" from the top of the 21st fret to the bottom of the string. As flat as the neck is by your description, you may want to adjust the truss rod 1/4 turn counter clockwise. And you may have to raise the action of the low E and A strings just a little. Some fret buzz is almost inevitable.
good luck.

[BackNtheSaddle]

Try adding a little bit of relief... to where that business card can just slide under, yet still barely touch, the low-E string around the 8th fret, with both the 1st fret and any fret above 19-20 held down. This should require only a 1/16th to an 1/8th of a turn on the truss rod nut.

Then, adjust your string height, at the saddles, to where the bottom of each string is ABOUT 4/64", above the 15th fret. Worst case would be a tad more... not a lot more... a tad more :) Err on a bit higher, than lower than 4/64".

If you still get buzzing, with your relief set ABOUT right and your string action ABOUT right, then as someone else said here... you most likely have a high fret (or several frets). The solutions for this are: 1. perform a level/crown. 2. Raise your action high enough to compensate (not the right answer, by the way).

With level frets and properly adjusted relief, you should not have any buzz. And, your action can be set a tad BELOW 4/64", if desired (and your technique allows).

[papoon]

OK so i took some actual measurements,holding down the first and last fret the relief on the neck at the 8th or 9th fret is .010in or .254mm which is now to speck as i understand (i added a little, 1/4 turn), the height of the stings at the 17th fret from top of fret to bottom of string is just above 4/64in probably about 5/64in this is the same at fret 15 so for sure above spec, i used feeler gauges and a good metal ruler, i have also taken into account and after the adjustments played the "E" and "A" lightly and still the buzz is there, meaning i took my playing style out of the equation and just strummed them individually and very regularly, so at this point my question is should i bother with any more adjustments or just take it in, after all it's brand new and under warranty i assume, i just would love to solve this on my own so i am still open to suggestions like would adding more relief be any answer, i don't want to go too much higher with the strings but if it's just a matter of adjustment i now have the tools and could do it myself, any thoughts are appreciated....edit , played for a while unplugged and could swear the rattle/buzz almost seems to be coming from the bridge is this possible ? not used to this new bridge style, also is there anything that could be causing buzz there ?

[Rob DiStefano]

some of the causes of string/fret buzzing (in no particular order) ...

• one or more frets is not level to its neighbor fret
• one or more nut slots are cut too low and there is too little or no nut relief for one or more strings
• there is too little neck relief
• your string gauge size is too small for that neck and/or your choice of tuning and/or the currently set string action
• your string attack is too aggressive for the string gauge, and/or tuning, and/or string action you've chosen
• you have one or more worn flat fret crown tops

in the following, use yer eyes and ears when setting up a guitar. do NOT use rulers, measures and gauges!

using new or relatively fresh strings, tune up to concert pitch and check the nut and neck relief. ask if you don't know how to make these relief checks. if there is reasonable relief, set the action height with the bridge/saddles - if not, fix either of those reliefs. intonate each open string with its octave that fretted at the twelfth fret - do NOT use harmonics or any other intonation method.

with some nut and neck relief, intonated strings, and a decent action, check every note on the fretboard. any fretted string that buzzes could mean that fret is too low and obviously not level with the fret in front of it. time for a level and crown, or just raise up the action.

the above is very simplified setup info - there is much more info, enuf to fill up a small book.

[BackNtheSaddle]

Good info Rob!

Based on all that I read here, it sure sounds like one or more high frets. My money is on it needing a L & C.

Most every new guitar could use one!

Sent from my iPhone using TDPRI

[BackNtheSaddle]

Originally Posted by papoon

OK so i took some actual measurements,holding down the first and last fret the relief on the neck at the 8th or 9th fret is .010in or .254mm which is now to speck as i understand (i added a little, 1/4 turn), the height of the stings at the 17th fret from top of fret to bottom of string is just above 4/64in probably about 5/64in this is the same at fret 15 so for sure above spec, i used feeler gauges and a good metal ruler, i have also taken into account and after the adjustments played the "E" and "A" lightly and still the buzz is there, meaning i took my playing style out of the equation and just strummed them individually and very regularly, so at this point my question is should i bother with any more adjustments or just take it in, after all it's brand new and under warranty i assume, i just would love to solve this on my own so i am still open to suggestions like would adding more relief be any answer, i don't want to go too much higher with the strings but if it's just a matter of adjustment i now have the tools and could do it myself, any thoughts are appreciated....edit , played for a while unplugged and could swear the rattle/buzz almost seems to be coming from the bridge is this possible ? not used to this new bridge style, also is there anything that could be causing buzz there ?

Sounds like your relief and action are now fine.

Yes! It also could be a loose saddle screw. Make sure that they are all putting some pressure on the bridge, not just resting, slightly, on the base.

Sent from my iPhone using TDPRI

[papoon]

hi again thanks for everyone's help, i am pretty sure i have everything set up as per spec, the buzz is still there, i made sure all the saddles are even and putting on the same pressure but nothing seems to really help i tried raising the strings some more and adding some more relief but it seems to make none to little difference, i have everything back to factory specs, nice thing is thanks to everyone here ...HUGE thanks to everyone here i understand much of the process and i think i will have to take my guitar in to were i got it and have them look at it, I'm terrified it's a warped neck, it's brand new so it's not fret wear or anything like that, i am using 9-42 strings so maybe going to 10's might help but I'm thinking it may be the frets themselves like rob and backNthesaddle has said, i do have one last question though,the buzz is there with the string plucked open as well as at all the frets down the neck though it gets better after the 8th and is almost if not totally gone after the 12th could it still be the nut, i put a capo on the first fret and the buzz remained :( gosh i wish i could solve this myself......

[Bartholomew3]

If it's brand new and you never changed the strings it's also possible you got a few bad ones - or they're all not so good.

Rare but has happened to me with a couple of brand new sets that were unused in a guitar case for a few years - did you ever change the factory strings ?

If everything else looks ok I would try that first - .10 might be better.

[Wayne Alexander]

It sounds like you have some high frets. If that's the case nothing else is going to fix it other than fret leveling/crowning, or having the action set very high.