Stay-In-Tune Bridge

[Verne Bunsen]

I can't argue that some people like it, and that's great. All I know is that I have 2 Telecasters with 3-saddle bridges and Bigsbys, and if I can make that setup intonate and hold tuning then surely you can understand why I scratch my head at this contraption. Like I said, it takes a lot of time and work and patience to work out all the bugs and get things right; maybe the strength of the Evertune is that it will compensate for all those little setup issues so you don't have to work them out. "Expensive and unsightly band-aid" is about as generous as I can be.

[Frenster]

Originally Posted by KevinB

Maybe you should read what AJ posted just yesterday (at 5:23am)?

First, what does that post have to do with what he did or didn't like about the product?

And second, big deal. I've over a thousand posts on the gear page and very few of them are about Evertune. I just spend more time over there.

I am, foremost, a fan of all things guitar and am blown away by this product, and when someone tells me people are bashing it I feel obliged to inform them about it, being that I have a lot of experience with it. I don't have a vested interest in the company, other than being an authorized installer. If you buy one from them I don't make a dime. I simply like the product. A lot.

Now AJ, what didn't you like about the Evertune?

[AJBaker]

Ok, I'll go into a bit more detail, just bear in mind that it was a while ago, I didn't spend a huge amount of time with it, and the shop probably hadn't set it up as well as it could be.

First, the idea seems to be that your tech 'permanently' tunes your guitar and it's then stable as it is (unless of course you change string gauge...). I sometimes tune down my E-string to D, or go a half step down for a certain band, or open G for Romeo and Juliet. From what I understand, the Evertune can't accommodate that and still work right without a new set up.
Second, subtle vibrato and bends seem to get absorbed by the springs. This makes sense, since I'm trying to make it go slightly out of tune and it's not letting me. So, it seems to me at least to allow less expression. On a similar vein (but here I'm speculating), I prefer the sound of a non floating, solid bridge to one balanced on springs. Some of the string vibration seems to get absorbed by the springs.
Third, the whole installation is very large and requires routing a pretty large chamber. If it were drop in/reversible, it might be more interesting.
Finally, the necessity of it all. I usually fiddle around at home without tuning up first. When I take it off the stand or out of its case, it's usually in tune, or only slightly out. Recording or playing live, I tune up before starting, and only need occasional, minor retuning. Except for some of the cheaper ones that need some work, the only instruments I have trouble with (sometimes) are my strat with tremolo and my 12-string acoustic, and as far as I know Evertune doesn't even have a bridge for those models.

So, to summarise:
- Do I have a problem that needs a solution? Maybe. Not ever having to retune does seem like a good idea in principle.
- Is this problem serious enough that I must have a solution no matter how expensive or elaborate? No.
-Assuming I did need this problem solved, is it worth the compromises I mentioned above? No.

If anything thing I said about the bridge is incorrect, I'm more than happy to proven wrong! I'm not opposed to it 'because Leo didn't do it' or something like that; it just seems to be a very inelegant solution, and the scale of the solution doesn't match the scale of the problem.

[glen smith]

I don't have a vested interest in the company, other than being an authorized installer. If you buy one from them I don't make a dime.

The website states that installation costs $200.00 to $300.00 so if you are not making a dime I think you had better negotiate something with them.

[Frenster]

Originally Posted by AJBaker

Ok, I'll go into a bit more detail, just bear in mind that it was a while ago, I didn't spend a huge amount of time with it, and the shop probably hadn't set it up as well as it could be.

First, the idea seems to be that your tech 'permanently' tunes your guitar and it's then stable as it is (unless of course you change string gauge...). I sometimes tune down my E-string to D, or go a half step down for a certain band, or open G for Romeo and Juliet. From what I understand, the Evertune can't accommodate that and still work right without a new set up.
Second, subtle vibrato and bends seem to get absorbed by the springs. This makes sense, since I'm trying to make it go slightly out of tune and it's not letting me. So, it seems to me at least to allow less expression. On a similar vein (but here I'm speculating), I prefer the sound of a non floating, solid bridge to one balanced on springs. Some of the string vibration seems to get absorbed by the springs.
Third, the whole installation is very large and requires routing a pretty large chamber. If it were drop in/reversible, it might be more interesting.
Finally, the necessity of it all. I usually fiddle around at home without tuning up first. When I take it off the stand or out of its case, it's usually in tune, or only slightly out. Recording or playing live, I tune up before starting, and only need occasional, minor retuning. Except for some of the cheaper ones that need some work, the only instruments I have trouble with (sometimes) are my strat with tremolo and my 12-string acoustic, and as far as I know Evertune doesn't even have a bridge for those models.

So, to summarise:
- Do I have a problem that needs a solution? Maybe. Not ever having to retune does seem like a good idea in principle.
- Is this problem serious enough that I must have a solution no matter how expensive or elaborate? No.
-Assuming I did need this problem solved, is it worth the compromises I mentioned above? No.

If anything thing I said about the bridge is incorrect, I'm more than happy to proven wrong! I'm not opposed to it 'because Leo didn't do it' or something like that; it just seems to be a very inelegant solution, and the scale of the solution doesn't match the scale of the problem.

You are right about a number of things. Yes, the guitar needs to be set up for a particular tuning, but will stay in tune from the cold green room to the blazing lights of the stage. You can easily detune the low E down to a D, but that string will act conventionally at that point and be subject to going out of tune, but the other strings won't. And yes, it needs a new setup to detune a half step.

If it's set up right at the edge of the sweet spot, it should be pretty transparent feeling as far as vibrato and bending are concerned. If it's not set up to the edge of the sweet spot it will be less expressive, so, just keep it at the edge of the sweet spot. Not hard to do.

And yes, there may be slightly less sustain because of the springs. And yes, you have to dedicate a guitar to it.

So, it may not be for everyone, but if you're playing 3 sets a nite and don't want to constantly tune, or you're in the studio and don't want to constantly tune, or you want to jump on stage and jam with people without having to fiddle with tuning, it may be for you.

I'm a cork sniffer, so I can hear the differences between the Evertune and a 3 barrel Tele bridge. I prefer the 3 barrel bridge for tone, but when I go to jam with people, I'll bring my Evertune'd guitar because I won't have to fiddle with tuning and the people in the audience won't hear the .5% difference in tone.

It is elaborate and expensive, but I believe an elegant solution to a problem that has plagued guitar players since the beginning. Staying in tune.

I guess it's not for you, but out of all the installs I've done, and I've done a lot, I've only had one person not like it because of tone. Everything else they were happy with.

[Frenster]

Originally Posted by glen smith

The website states that installation costs $200.00 to $300.00 so if you are not making a dime I think you had better negotiate something with them.

I'll make money on an installation, but not on the unit if you buy it from them. Of course, I'm not the only installer.

[AJBaker]

Now if I understand correctly, when you're set up with the string on the sweet spot, the bridge will allow you to go sharp (to hear vibrato and bends), but not go flat? This means the guitar can go out of tune, and I know just the situation that could cause it.
Last winter I played at the place in my avatar at -17°C, and the cold made certain strings ring up to a whole tone sharp. The evertune set up on the sweet spot would also go sharp and I'd have to retune before playing, defeating the purpose of having an expensive bridge that never needs tuning.

[Frenster]

Originally Posted by AJBaker

Now if I understand correctly, when you're set up with the string on the sweet spot, the bridge will allow you to go sharp (to hear vibrato and bends), but not go flat? This means the guitar can go out of tune, and I know just the situation that could cause it.
Last winter I played at the place in my avatar at -17°C, and the cold made certain strings ring up to a whole tone sharp. The evertune set up on the sweet spot would also go sharp and I'd have to retune before playing, defeating the purpose of having an expensive bridge that never needs tuning.

All you would have to do is adjust the tuning peg to the edge of the sweet spot, which takes about a second, and you don't need a tuner, and you're in tune, so it doesn't defeat the bridge in any way, so, I hate to say in such direct terms, but you're wrong.

[Gary in Boston]

Kinda like the cars that park themselves......... I can imagine a pro / famous on stage person wasting time / your money tuning while you pay upwards of $ 100 a ticket. Just non stop playing / entertaining.

Of course I use to like the little chats any given artist would have with their audience while they tunned but that's just me

Gary

[AJBaker]

Originally Posted by Frenster

All you would have to do is adjust the tuning peg to the edge of the sweet spot, which takes about a second, and you don't need a tuner, and you're in tune, so it doesn't defeat the bridge in any way, so, I hate to say in such direct terms, but you're wrong.

Don't worry, I don't mind being wrong :-)! And the example of the evertune in the cold is hypothetical anyway. But my point was that even with the evertune you can't always just pull the guitar out of its case and have it be in tune.

[Frenster]

If you had a car that parked itself you'd have a smile on your face every time it did. And every time I pick up an Evertune'd guitar I get that same smile, and so does everyone else that comes in the shop.

Imagine you're doing a set and at the end of a song is your big solo. You stretch and bend the strings so much they go a little out. The song ends and the band leader, who could care less if you have tuning issues, counts off the next song before you get to tune and it starts with solo guitar. Tough luck.

Imagine you tune up in the nice cold green room and run out onto a hot stage. Tough luck.

Imagine you're in the studio and you tune between every take. Time=Money.

Imagine you break a string. Even on a tele, the rest of the strings go out a bit. Tough luck.

This is a tool that makes making music easier and more enjoyable. The only person here who tried it and didn't like it doesn't know if it was set up properly or what. Everyone who is bashing it hasn't tried it.

Anyone in LA, come down to my shop and try one out and then you can post a real review instead of trying to come up with reasons why it is a waste of time and money.

How can you guys bash something that you haven't tried that gets great reviews?

[Frenster]

Originally Posted by AJBaker

Don't worry, I don't mind being wrong :-)! And the example of the evertune in the cold is hypothetical anyway. But my point was that even with the evertune you can't always just pull the guitar out of its case and have it be in tune.

Well, I'd say 99% of the time you actually CAN just pull it out of the case and it'll be in tune, and I think that's a pretty good percentage. You may have to slightly adjust the tuners once in a while to be at the edge of the sweet spot, but it'll still be in tune when you pull it out of the case.

I recommend you try one again that is set up properly and see what you think. You may not want to get one installed, but I'll bet it'll put a smile on your face and you'll see how useful it is.

I can't tell you how many people come in with a smirk and say how expensive it is and how you have to route your guitar, then after they try it, you can literally see the change in their eyes to, "Which guitar can I install this in?"

Yes, I'm a fan, no it's not for everyone, but it has been proven on stages big and small since it came out a couple of years ago. People use it because it works. That's my observation. I hope you run into one again soon.

[PeterUK]

Originally Posted by Frenster

Let me just ask how much time you spend tuning when recording?

Originally Posted by Frenster

As far as the nonexistent problem goes, I know how much time I've spent tuning when recording. With the Evertune, it's simply always in tune, hence, no more tuning in the studio.

Originally Posted by Frenster

It is elaborate and expensive, but I believe an elegant solution to a problem that has plagued guitar players since the beginning. Staying in tune.

I guess it's not for you, but out of all the installs I've done, and I've done a lot, I've only had one person not like it because of tone. Everything else they were happy with.

You've mentioned the tuning issues in the studio several times and I'd like to understand if this is a real problem for the recording artist. I'd really welcome the input from others that have done extensive studio recording. Because...

As an amateur musician I have done some recording but I don't recall tuning being something that "plagued" me? All of my guitars are well set up by me - with particular attention to the nut and the intonation - and I didn't come out of the studio shaking my head in frustration saying "Man, I'm glad that's over. Those tuning issues sucked the fun out of it for me".

I've talked about this with my son who is studying Music Production at University and for the last 9-months has spent 60% of his time in studios recording, producing and mastering their work.

When I asked him if the guitarists are "plagued" by tuning issues in the studio he answered, with some surprise, that tuning wasn't a massive issue because the guitarists regularly checked their tuning.

Now, unless it's done differently in your studio, tuning for me involves pressing my tuner pedal and checking my tuning. It takes seconds. If gigging I'll regular check my tuning between songs (often a quick press, check, sometimes an adjustment, and a quick press to switch off the tuning pedal).

In the studio we recorded 10 songs for the latest CD. I tuned up on arrival (a time consuming process involving tuning ALL six strings) taking between 20 - 30-seconds (so much of my life wasted ) and I checked the tuning regularly between tracks (a few seconds each time). I certainly wasn't "plagued" by having to regularly check the tuning.

Now with reference to the bridge in question, it looks well made, I would imagine it does exactly what you describe and it works well. So I'm not poo pooing the technology - I've been an early adopter of all the new fangled bridges and saddles - but I've never come across guitarists plagued by tuning issues.

So I guess I'm lucky and so are the UK TDPRI guys who got together last year and spend several hours in rehearsal studio, all with Teles equipped with the similar traditional bridge and saddles, and not one of us was plagued by tuning issues.

Good luck to you with future installations but it's not for me for the reasons I've explained.

Peter

[Nick JD]

My guitar is in tune. I turn the turny things until it sounds right.

Unless I bang the turny things it stays in tune.

[Rob DiStefano]

i've seen it, i've played it extensively, this system flat out works as advertised.

will it become a must-have item for most guitars?

nope, absolutely not at all.

[kmacaster]

For me, it's in the same vein as the gibby Robot guitar... useless. I know how to tune my guitar. I like tuning my guitar. My mex standard tele gets retuned maybe once every week and a half? And at that time, it's a quarter turn on each peg. All stock, and I play a few hours (or more) every day. It's large, unsightly, and costs (not worth) more than what my guitar cost in the first place.

99% of the time I pull my guitar of its gig bag, it's in tune... Why pay more just to have it be in tune just as it was before?

[Doug 54]

Im sure it really works, as I have read and heard.
But whats about y'all that's gotta have a string-thru?? This toploads it.

ALOT of $$ for a not hateful problem.

.

[Frenster]

For those of you who haven't tried it, try it, then let us know how you liked it. As far as the studio goes, I'm installing them for producers who don't want to spend time tuning and retuning. It also helps intonation because it maintains constant string tension when you fret the guitar.

For those of you with legitimate questions about the bridge, I'll be happy to help. For the others who insist on trying to find a reason for it to be a waste of time and money, try one, then let's talk. Otherwise you simply have no experience with it and don't know what you're talking about. You're guessing.

There are plenty of Nashville studio musicians who are getting them installed. I have a feeling they don't suck, they need great tools, and they don't buy crap. My guess. Ask Joe Glaser, who is, apparently, the luthier they all go to. He's an installer.

I will now go play a guitar that is always in tune. Like a piano.

[Frenster]

Originally Posted by Doug 54

Im sure it really works, as I have read and heard.
But whats about y'all that's gotta have a string-thru?? This toploads it.

ALOT of $$ for a not hateful problem.

.

Dang, you're another one looking for a reason not to like it, and you haven't tried it.

btw, you load it from the back, like a strat.

Dude, the thing stays in tune like a friggin' piano! And you're worried about whether it's rear loaded?

Try one.

[Nick JD]

Originally Posted by Frenster

I will now go play a guitar that is always in tune. Like a piano.

Should make one for the piano. Those things are always needing to be tuned (expensive).