How do I get consistent tone at all volumes? Pots? Caps?

[don]

I''ve read all the posts about the treble bleed cap but I'm now more confused than before. The guitar is electronically a stock MIM Standard tele with a Warmoth ash body. The guitar sounds nice with the volume all the way up but turn it down 1//8 of a turn and the treble is all gone. I don't like an ice pick treble laden sound but I want a consistent sound with the same amount of treble all the way down the volume range. Any advice here - assume I am electronically ignorant and use laymans terms please.

[Kevin]

If you don't like treble loss as you turn your guitar down (I don't; some do), you probably want a bypass (bleed) cap....

Now, the value to use is the hard part. A .001mf (microfarad) cap is the "standard," but people use a variety of values. I have a .001 in one of my strats, and used to use it in one tele, but when I swapped the body on that tele to an ash body, it was too ice-picky with that cap.

Another popular cap-only value is a 680pf (picofarad) cap. I have one of those in my poplar-bodied, steel-saddled tele. That particular cap was "too dead" in my ash-bodied tele I mentioned above, though...

A lot of people use a cap -- either in series or parallel -- with a resistor. The resistor allows some mids to bleed through, too, so it's not too ice-picky. The resistor value is variable, too. What I finally decided on -- after trying numerous cap-only and cap/resistor values for my ash tele was a .001mf cap in series with an 82K resistor. It worked well on that guitar and the treble response seems pretty consistent throughout the volume taper. However, on my poplar tele, that combination was still a bit too bright for my tastes, hence the use of the 680pf cap.

The best advice that I could give you is to go to Radio Shack, buy a bunch of caps and resistors, and try out various combinations. Use alligator clips to connect them to the volume pot while you're trying them out.

It really depends on your guitar, your playing style, and your amp as to which values will work best. I'd probably start, though, with the .001mf cap.

BTW, there are several posts on this topic on the board. Do a search for "treble bleed" to read them.

Good luck

[Scotland]

You put in a 001mf cap in series with an 82K resistor. I would like to do that on my ash one, question is...how do you wire in the resistor? I know where and how to do the cap but how do I get the resistor in there?

[Kevin]

If you do it in series, you just twist one end of the cap lead to one end of the resistor lead and solder them together... You'll have to clip some of the leads.

Then you solder the free end of the cap to the "in" (pickup) lug of the pot, and the free end of the resistor to the "out" (jack) lug of the pot.

For parallel, you simply connect the two ends to each other; I'm not sure what the sound difference between series and parallel is.....

Here's a pic from the Kinman site. I converted it from a PDF file to a JPEG, so the quality isn't that great; if it's not clear, I can scan a cap and resistor, and post that.

I asked Chris Kinman where to find the values that he uses and he was nice enough to send me a couple of kits (caps and resistors) free of charge. I tried them, but found that the treble response was a bit dead -- to my ears, anyway -- with these values. They probably work really well, though, with his pups. The .001 cap and 82K resistor just might work for you, since our guitars are very similar: ash body, maple neck, 3 brass saddles, Duncan B'caster, & 52RI neck pup....

Let me know. Anyway, here's the pic:

[Jim Collins]

The only reason one might consider .001uF a standard value for a bleed cap is because that is what Fender used in the late 60s/early 70s. PRS uses a 180pF bleed cap. I believe Joe Barden recommends (or recommended) somewhere around 120pF or 150pF (don't recall exactly). Personally, I think .001uF is much too large a value for this function, because I hear an increase in highs as I back off on the volume. When I was experimenting with values for this function, I settled on 180pF for humbuckers, and about 120pF for single coils. (I thought 180pF was too large even for P90 pickups.)

It is all up to the player. These caps are cheap. By several values between 100pF and .001uF, and experiment. (Remember that .001uF = 1000pF.) Get a couple of wires with alligator clips, and make it easier to swap cap values without wielding a soldering iron each time.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by Jim Collins

The only reason one might consider .001uF a standard value for a bleed cap is because that is what Fender used in the late 60s/early 70s...

Well, considering that thousands of them went out the door that way -- and we are talking teles, here -- that seems reason enough to call it "standard." Plus, of course, I had it in quotes above.

That's still the starting point for most people. You don't often hear someone say, "I started with a 180pf cap, but it was too dark." No; people say, "I found the .001mf cap to bright, so...."

[Jim Collins]

My comment was not meant as a slam. I was only trying to suggest that the original poster go beyond what Fender did, with that cap, and try several values, to see which he liked best. It is a cheap way to fine tune one's guitar.