4-Way Switch vs. 3-Way Switch - Does Tone Change in Pos. 1 & 3?

[castpolymer]

I was wondering if the 4-way wiring changes the bridge and neck pickup tone in the First and Third position compared to a normal 3-way switch in the First and Third postion? Theoretically, I would say no, but my ears tell me different. All expert opinions welcome!

[unbridled]

They sound the same to me. Well, at least I can't say it made them sound worse by my ears.

[Wally]

All 3 of the original positions remain the same. The only difference is that the bridge and neck pups are put into series arrangement for that 'new' position. IF one changes something else...pot/s, caps, wire?.... in the process of installation, then everything can change, right? IF the only change that is made is the switch, then it is the MIND that causes the EAR to perceive some change. The mind is a powerful variable, eh?
Side note: the neck and bridge are respectively called 1 and 3. I used to call the bridge alone #1, but I have been informed that this is against the general rule. I have seen it both ways.
So, if one uses the 'generally' accepted numbering with a 4 way switch, #1(forward) is the new and most powerful combination of the bridge and neck, 2 is the neck, 3 is the stock parallel b/n, and 4(back) is the bridge. IF one uses #1 as the bridge, then #2 is the parallel b/n combi, #3 is the neck, and #4 would be the series b/n. Leo should have scratched 1,2 and 3 on those control plates! LOL Gibson solved the issue with Rhythm and Treble on their 3-way toggles and numbers on their more complex switches.

[sjtalon]

Originally Posted by Wally

Side note: the neck and bridge are respectively called 1 and 3. I used to call the bridge alone #1, but I have been informed that this is against the general rule.

Hey Wally, I'm not trying to be a wise guy, I just wonder why this issue always gets fliped around.

If the bridge is not 1, then why are ALL the GENUINE Fender switch control diagrams listing it as 1 (being the rearmost position) ??

http://www.fender.com/support/wiring...arts_lists.php

This as well..........from Fender

http://www.blueguitar.org/new/schem/_gtr/tele4way.jpg


That's my position.........F.W.I.W.

[Wally]

I happen to agree, SJ, with that numbering. Once again, current common usage sometimes butts up against what I and I suppose you and LEo among others consider to be logical. I am not the one that flips this numbering around. I have vowed to never use numbers...only b/m/n or such so that there is no misunderstanding.
I have an idea that back in the day, LEo understood that the bridge would be much used.....amps were darker and less powerful, so the brightness of that bridge pup would be called for to cut through. Therefor....bridge was #1 for him. HEy, his first guitar only had one pickup and it was at the bridge, right? These days, every Strat player seems to pick the neck as their 'number 1 go to position'.....and that maybe where the 'rearrangement' of the numbering started. HEy, I have seen/heard Strat players set up an amp for the bridge pup with such a large dose of treble in the amp that the result is that the bridge position is unusable.
Whatever the case; it is b for bridge, m for middle if applicable, and n for neck with appropriate combinations for me...no numbers.

[sjtalon]

So True Wally.

It's like tomato tomoto this position number deal, but makes a good rag chew.

My apologies to Castpolymer for taking his post off track.

Now to return back to the O.P.

I have taken three guitars from 3 way to 4 way and I can't tell any difference in the standard positions. As far as what the switch does electrically speaking there isn't anything that should change.

[Amby]

I've been using the 4-way for exactly one year now and find that it has been a worthwhile mod. Positions 1 to 3 are the same as standard, but position four bumps up the volume a bit and thickens the sound. I agree with sjtalon, no change of sound in pos. 1 or 3.

[castpolymer]

I guess I was just hearing things ( like the voices ). Maybe it is my playing? Naaah!

[superhand]

I got my 4 way switch in the mail yesterday, now I'm just waiting for my Keystones.

[Deaf Eddie]

Back to the rag-chewing: after careful observation, I have determined that when you "number" the pup postions on a Strat, the majority agree that the neck is throw #1.

However, on Teles, the convention seems to be that throw #1 is the bridge pup.

So, I have trained myself to simply remember which of the two platforms we are talking about, and it's all good...

[thejerk]

There shouldn't be a difference, as others have said.

Originally Posted by Wally

These days, every Strat player seems to pick the neck as their 'number 1 go to position'.....and that maybe where the 'rearrangement' of the numbering started.

We read left to right, and for the player looking down at the switch, left to right (1 to 5 on a strat) goes from neck to bridge. This is my personal theory about why many folks number it that way.

Also, to me "forward" and "back" pickup nomenclature is confusing as hell! I know bridge is "back", but it always takes me a minute to figure that out.