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Old January 24th, 2013, 04:09 PM   #1 (permalink)
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cabronita build

I received my warmoth cabronita body today and did the final touch ups on my neck. I still have not decided upon a color for the finish. I am debating between reranch crown royal purple and Mazda's Copper Red Mica. Either way this is how it is shaping up.

Specs:

Birdseye maple neck from MM (amber shellac with Tru oil)
Warmoth Cabronita body
Fender american tuners
fender hardtail bridge
cts 500 volume pot
cts 250 tone pot
Tv jones Filtertron bridge pup
switchcraft switch
electrosocket jack
alice in wonderland neckplate



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Old January 24th, 2013, 04:30 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Sweeeet!
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Old January 24th, 2013, 04:47 PM   #3 (permalink)
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+1 on the sweet!!!!
I really want one!!!
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Old January 24th, 2013, 05:18 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Nice! Get to work!
I'm thinking I might assemble a 1 pickup BSB Cabronita from Warmoth as well...
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Old January 24th, 2013, 05:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
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question is which color? what do you guys think?
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Old January 25th, 2013, 04:11 PM   #6 (permalink)
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i really like the Mazda copper color (i think it'd look great with a white guard!) it kinda reminds me of the Candy Cola color Fender does, at least based on your pic. i like it because it looks kind of "classic", but still different. even though purple is one of my favorite colors, i've always thought the RR Crown Royal Purple was just...too purple for my liking. of course that's just my personal opinion.

not sure if it makes a difference, but you can probably find that Mazda color in Duplicolor acrylic lacquer from an auto place. it'd be cheaper and would save a lot of money on shipping.
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Old January 25th, 2013, 05:11 PM   #7 (permalink)
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That was exactly the route I was going to go. The paint itself is about 8 dollars. I was wondering if I needed to use a primer under it? If so which duplicolor primer should I use? I plan on using minwax lacquer over it as the clear coat. I really dig the mazda color. we have a car that color and when the light hits it just right you can see some of the orange come thru.
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Old January 26th, 2013, 07:22 AM   #8 (permalink)
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yes, you should use a primer. the Duplicolor Filler Primer, Sandable Primer or Primer Sealer will all work just fine. because you're using it on wood (and not an auto body), they'll all work about the same. i think the Filler Primer is a little more high-build, which means it'll fill in surface scratches that you might have missed during sanding a little faster, but any of the three will work. just make sure you follow the directions on the can, and spray enough coats that the grain of the wood isn't telegraphing through the primer (you'll see it if you hold the body at an angle and look across the top or back.) if you did a good job sanding, you probably shouldn't need more than 2 or 3 coats of primer, max. use either white or gray colored primer.

based on my limited experience, as well as most articles regarding finishing, i'd highly recommend a couple 'sand and sealer' coats before you even start priming. this will help build up a smooth, flat finish much faster, which can also decrease the drying time of your color and clear coats (because you'll need less of them.) you can use shellac for this (either brush-on or spray). i think most people do around 4 sand-and-sealer coats, block-sanding between each one. when the surface is uniformly matte after sanding (you don't see many, if any, shiny spots), you're ready for primer.

between the sand and seal and primer, you'll be able to catch and fix any sanding errors before the color and clear go on. primer is also an adhesion promoter and not something you should skip! it's cheap insurance, but i can almost guarantee you'll regret it if you don't use it.

one more thing: after sanding, but before you start applying any finish, wipe down the wood a couple times with naptha on a clean rag (available at Home Depot, Lowe's and pretty much every other hardware store.) this will clean off any oils from your hands, which could theoretically cause the finish to not adhere well. naptha (which is the exact same thing as Zippo lighter fluid), is a relatively mild solvent but it's safe to use on cured lacquers, so it's good to keep around for cleaning stuff off guitars. it's also only a few dollars for a good-sized can at Home Depot, and you can always use any leftovers for degreasing things around the garage (bike chains, tools, nuts and bolts, etc.)

hopefully this helps a little. i'm not a finishing expert and hopefully some of the finishing masters will chime in here. i think you're on the right track. i know there are plenty of people that successfully use Minwax nitro over acrylic Duplicolor, but i don't know if there are any special considerations to keep in mind (since one is acrylic and one is nitro.) if i were you, i'd go buy a piece of alder (Lowe's usually carries it), and some of your finishing supplies and do some practice runs. that way you'll get an idea of how the varies components work, as well as get a feel for how your color coats come out of the can (which is important especially with metallics.) i'd definitely go with that combo though, since Duplicolor's clear acrylic lacquers have a pretty bad reputation for not drying properly (if at all) and being incredibly soft.

just remember that finishing isn't difficult per say, it's just time consuming and requires attention to detail. and like everyone will tell you, it's all about the prep work: the more attention you pay to your sanding and on your sealer and primer coats, the better the final product will be. take your time and just be aware that once you start the finish process that it's probably going to be two months from start to final assembly. as long as you're not tempted to rush it, it'll be worth it.
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Old January 26th, 2013, 10:35 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Im in no hurry. I have not used automotive paints yet for a body but I am loving the idea of the copper red mica cabronita. Its not one you will see many of. Thank you for the tips as Ill be sure to follow them. this will be my second finish on a guitar. I finished one body before using shellac and minwax lacquer. It took well over two months. It came out half way decent for my first time trying. I like using zinsser's sand and sealer in particular. its very easy to work with and to sand. here's a picture of the body after the sand and sealer coats.
Here is a pic of the body once the final clear coat was on.
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Old January 27th, 2013, 07:47 AM   #10 (permalink)
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that body looks great! i forgot to mention that any shellac you use should be de-waxed, and the Zinnser Bullseye SealCoat (this stuff) definitely is. i'm assuming that's what you used on the flame-top body, so you're good to go. some people like the Zinnser B-I-N primer-sealers too, and in fact i think that's what ReRanch suggests on their Finishing 101 page. the B-I-N primer-sealers are usually colored white, but obviously that doesn't matter under an opaque color. the bonus to the B-I-N stuff is that it's a sealer and primer all in one, so it'll save you a little bit of work.

note that mixed shellac has a shelf life: the regular canned shellac is usually only about a year at the very longest, but i think the SealCoat and BIN stuff both have 3-year shelf lives. still, it's a good rule of thumb to use the newest, freshest stuff you can. most cans have a date on the bottom, so double-check that just to make sure you're not getting something really old. of course, if you mix up your own shellac, you can keep dry shellac flakes pretty much indefinitely as long as they're stored properly.
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Old January 27th, 2013, 07:52 AM   #11 (permalink)
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oh, and BTW...Carvin was doing a "Copperhead Metallic" color a couple years ago. it looks like they've stopped offering the color but if you Google "carvin copperhead metallic" it'll put up a bunch of images. i'm not sure how close it is to the Mazda color, but it might give you a better idea of how it'll look on a guitar. i personally liked the color, although it seemed to lean a little too orange sometimes.
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Old January 27th, 2013, 09:47 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Thanks for the input. Yeah that copperhead metallic is a bit too orange for me. I did indeed use unwaxed shellac but it was the aerosol version of the link you provided. reranch 101 suggests brushing on the Bin. I may try that this route. My original plan was to just use the aerosol shellac again, sand, then primer,sand, color, clear.wait thirty days and then wet sand. however someone mentioned tru oil as a final clear but I was always under the impression that worked best as a natural finish and not so much over colors. Idk...any input?
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Old January 28th, 2013, 05:00 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I was able to get the sealer coats on today. I have to say I really love the grain on this guitar. It makes me think I should go with a trans finish of some kind.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 06:17 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I was able to get the sealer coats on today. I have to say I really love the grain on this guitar. It makes me think I should go with a trans finish of some kind.
That was my thought also. Maybe a Mary Kay blonde?
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Old January 28th, 2013, 06:28 PM   #15 (permalink)
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question is which color? what do you guys think?
The purple's cool, it's like my Gretsch.
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Old January 28th, 2013, 07:16 PM   #16 (permalink)
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That was my thought also. Maybe a Mary Kay blonde?
I was thinking mary kay might be good. I was also loving this autumn burst cabronita that I saw but Im not sure I could get the burst right. The purple is indeed nice I just feel its wrong to cover over such a nice grain. Thats one super nice Gretsch.
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Old January 29th, 2013, 01:17 AM   #17 (permalink)
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TruOil works great over dyes and stains, but i don't know how it would work over lacquer. i don't think it would be a good idea, because you could run into some finish compatibility problems and ruin a lot of hard work. Tru Oil is actually a varnish, and aside from linseed oil, tung oil and various plasticizers, it's got a bunch of other stuff in it too (at least as far as i can tell from the MSDS.) it would be great for the neck, but i wouldn't recommend it over lacquer...i just don't know what would happen.

i think a Mary Kaye blonde finish would look really nice (and it's one i'm considering for my Tele build.) just keep in mind that it's usually done over ash so you can see some grain, and doing it over alder hides virtually all of the grain. while your body's grain pops right now, a white blonde will hide most of it. it'll still look good, but the grain is subdued so much that it almost looks like an opaque white.

here's a few pictures of the Eric Johnson signature Strat in white blonde, with an alder body:
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/StratEJWhBl
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Old January 29th, 2013, 04:21 AM   #18 (permalink)
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I really like the Mazda copper red! It's different!
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Old January 29th, 2013, 09:09 AM   #19 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=Cat MacKinnon;4771013]TruOil works great over dyes and stains, but i don't know how it would work over lacquer. i don't think it would be a good idea, because you could run into some finish compatibility problems and ruin a lot of hard work. Tru Oil is actually a varnish, and aside from linseed oil, tung oil and various plasticizers, it's got a bunch of other stuff in it too (at least as far as i can tell from the MSDS.) it would be great for the neck, but i wouldn't recommend it over lacquer...i just don't know what would happen.


?? the tru oil is only on the neck and its not over lacquer its over shellac. If I were to use it as a final finish it wouldnt have been over lacquer just over the color paint. But even with that I dont know how it would turn out. Most tru oil is done straight to the wood.

its more than likely going to end up the mazda copper red mica or i may try my hand at an autumn burst.
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Old January 29th, 2013, 05:10 PM   #20 (permalink)
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You can coat over Tru-Oil on the body. Just make sure the Tru-Oil has had a chance to harden, I would wait several weeks before doing so.
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