1959 Les Paul Build

[koolaide]

Originally Posted by edgemarc

I grew up next to Davis Monthan AFB Tucson and the F4 is seriously loud but the loudest of all is the B52, they used to fly over so high you couldn't see em but you couldn't hear someone talking next to ya.

Now I know why you are the way you are, from being around all those moth balled planes and JP-4 Kinda gets in the blood don't it.

[preeb]

Originally Posted by edgemarc

Just passing time waiting on the mail man, hope he didn't get shot down.

LOL.... Marc.... you really make me laugh recently

[preeb]

Originally Posted by Pellwell

Hi again Gil. I'm so hungry for updates on this thread, i usually check in once every 4 hours or so, just so I won't miss anything!

Anyways, I was just thinking.
How much money would you save by building your own '59 LP, instead of buying the real deal?
If you would count all factors, such as the actual working hours you put into this project, Compare that with how much money a Gibson employee in 1959 would make for the same amount of hours? And the of course the material costs, etc, etc.

Anybody out here good at math?

I'd say... about $444000 (-;

[preeb]

Originally Posted by schrammguitars

Gil, Are you saying the 12 fret is not the middle of the basic scale length? (Not to be confused with total string length.)

For a fretted string instrument there is the basic scale length (BSL) and the total string length (TSL). These are two different things, but both are present. The TSL is slightly longer than the scale length on the 1st string and in most cases gradually longer on each consecutive string with the 6th having the longest TSL. When you get the TSL right that is what is called compensation. The BSL is the same, but TSL varies due to desired action and string gauge.

Usually when specs are given for guitars you give the BSL and not the TSL. So, if my guitar has a 650mm BSL and 2mm compensation added it now has a TSL of 652mm. The playing scale is the same as the BSL so the guitar would be described as having a scale of 650mm.

Please don't take this post as being confrontational, I'm not, I'm just trying to see if we are talking the same luthier language.

So, with that said are LP ABR-1 placement determined by placing the basic scale length at the forward position of the first string saddle piece? This way you can adjust for TSL/Compensation? Or, angle the ABR-1 so the 6th string saddle piece isn't set so far back. Does this make sense? It's a lot easier to show someone than trying to describe.

-Dave

WOW... you made my head spin Dave... but I hear you (as in "I see you" in Avatar).
There are so many methods to measure scales and calculate fret position with so many names and mathematical methods that it's hard to clearly communicate on the subject (-;
I tell you how I see it and you tell me if it calculates.

What I call scale-length is from the center of the nut line to the middle of the ABR's center line. I just checked on the blue print and it's exactly 628.6mm (almost exactly 24.75")
The fret locations are based on that measurement and if I use 24.75" with the old rule of 18 calculation it gives me the exact fret locations on the 59 burst which I posted earlier on this thread.
Bottom line is that Gibson must have done the very same thing as I see no other way to get the numbers 100% correct to any other method or scale.

The only thing that can affect that is the free hand located ABR-1 on the old ones... but I'm sure the saddles are in about the same locations for a given string set.

[preeb]

Originally Posted by rstevenson

Okay, enough testosterone already!
Back to the guitar.
Rob

Originally Posted by Pellwell

Hi again Gil. I'm so hungry for updates on this thread, i usually check in once every 4 hours or so, just so I won't miss anything!
...

As you know, this is not a standard build... it's a prototype, and I need to verify everything including correct wood, binding material, inlays, color, lacquer plsticizer.... etc...
The list is pretty long on a LP and I would like to do this only once if possible.
I'm currently evaluating different bindings before I'll decide on the correct set and keep using it in the future. Some prototypes take a few months... and let me remind you that there's a lot ahead too... the color mix with the right Aniline dyes and UV fading tests for a few types of anilines... the PAF design is next and I'll probably need to wind many pu's and test them before I'm totally happy... Still need to make the plastics... hardware...
But I promise you I will not round any corners, and down the road, I hope this complete thread will be a joy to read from start to finish (-;
No rush on my end...

[Scott Auld]

Originally Posted by Jahmbie

This is a 1958, and one of the best sounding LPs ever:
Anyone care to guess who it belongs to?

Greg Martin

[dan1952]

Originally Posted by Scott Auld

Greg Martin

I was in a band that opened for the Headhunters in the early nineties, and that '58 was Greg's stage guitar. Great guy, great player, great sounding guitar!

[Marc Rutters]

Originally Posted by koolaide

Now I know why you are the way you are, from being around all those moth balled planes and JP-4 Kinda gets in the blood don't it.

Yea it was cool growing up next to the base. There used to be a surplus scrap yard where you could buy jet parts by the pound, a buck a pound so my VW Baja was outfitted with a thrust lever from an A4 for a shift lever and the seat belts were 5 point harness from an F4, good cheap fun

[Sterling Sound]

Here are some bursts I like :-)

[Sterling Sound]

And more:

[Jahmbie]

Originally Posted by Scott Auld

Greg Martin

Originally Posted by dan1952

I was in a band that opened for the Headhunters in the early nineties, and that '58 was Greg's stage guitar. Great guy, great player, great sounding guitar!

Yep! Greg is a super guitar player and an even better person.

[angus89]

Hi preeb great looking build one quick question you said you changed the neck angle to 4 degrees and had to adjust the pu plane so I was wondering what angle you ended up with on the pu plane.Thanks

[Tallycat]

Hey Gil...here is a good source of pics for a 59 on the bay!
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53...t_34715wt_1167

[jdm61]

Originally Posted by mcomio

This one looks a bit like Peter Green/Gary Moore LP.
But since that guitar is 59er this has to be other one

On the Green '59, the bridge pickup is reversed, it has two later replacement knobs and it is more beat up that Greg Martin's axe. When asked about that guitar recently, Green confessed that he was a bit disappointed with it because it didn't have the sleek, fast neck like Clapton's '60. Funny how things change with time. There are some videos on Youtube of a guy playing it at the Dallas guitar show after Moore sold it, but one of the best closeups of the body is on Gary Moore's CD, 'Blue For Greenie"

[jdm61]

Originally Posted by Tallycat

Hey Gil...here is a good source of pics for a 59 on the bay!
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53...t_34715wt_1167

It is just me or does it look like somebody's dog chewed on the edge of the body? I do wonder a bit about that guitar if for no other reason that it is being sold on Ebay. I would think that if it was a good one or even a REAL one, you could find a private buyer for it or sell it through a real auction house.

[preeb]

Originally Posted by angus89

Hi preeb great looking build one quick question you said you changed the neck angle to 4 degrees and had to adjust the pu plane so I was wondering what angle you ended up with on the pu plane.Thanks

I don't measure it. I just do a flat plane between the end of the board line to the ABR-1 line. It should be around 1° I believe. The final neck angle is 4.05 + 0.X from the board angle = just under 4.1°

[preeb]

Originally Posted by Tallycat

Hey Gil...here is a good source of pics for a 59 on the bay!
http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53...t_34715wt_1167

Thanks for the heads up. Beautiful rare shots indeed!

[preeb]

Originally Posted by jdm61

It is just me or does it look like somebody's dog chewed on the edge of the body? I do wonder a bit about that guitar if for no other reason that it is being sold on Ebay. I would think that if it was a good one or even a REAL one, you could find a private buyer for it or sell it through a real auction house.

Except for the "eBay issue' is there anything else in the photos that might indicate a problem?

[sasparilla]

Hey, ivegot a question about the Top Thickness on original Sunbursts.

Is it true that only the early 50s Les Pauls had the 1/2" thick Maple Top while the 58-60 Burst had a thicker one ( about 9/16")

That wrote me Tom Barlett who sells those CNC-Tops, and he should know it but it seems too thick to me from what i ve seen burstwise.

[preeb]

I got a few candidates for the body bindings by now. The best one is from a sheet of Ivory colored Royalite sheet I found in Tel-Aviv while I was looking for Allstar shoes for my older daughter. I accidentally stumbled into a plastics warehouse in the industrial area in southern Tel-Aviv (this is where I find cheap sports shoes...LOL) and asked to look around... and there it was. The only problem is that it's only 1.75mm thick (0.069").
This is exactly the channel depth after sanding.... so it might be a little edgy...
I'll give it a chance just for it's nice color (-;

Here's the binding example I cut from the sheet. The color is spot on and it fits tightly in the channel... I wish it was a hair thicker but I think it can pass...





Here it is against white background



I now do a mechanical test by doing a dry run around the body