Engineers, get in here (small electric motor question)...

City Sirens · December 10th, 2009, 12:27 AM

If I wanted to use a small electric motor to pull on a string, what should I look for?

I'm not trying to make a self-tuning guitar. I'm curious rather to find out if an electric b-bender might be workable...

nanobug · December 10th, 2009, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by City Sirens

If I wanted to use a small electric motor to pull on a string, what should I look for?

I'm not trying to make a self-tuning guitar. I'm curious rather to find out if an electric b-bender might be workable...

You could probably rig something up with a stepper motor and a microcontroller. A small enough stepper motor could possibly be salvaged from a desktop scanner.

nanobug · December 10th, 2009, 12:33 AM

quick google search brought this up:
http://www.imagesco.com/articles/picstepper/01.html

Marc Rutters · December 10th, 2009, 01:16 AM

That's a tall question. For electric motors you have to consider the application and work backwards. Things like how fast is the string to be pulled? Is the speed to be variable and reversible? What kind of switch and where's it gonna go? Honestly I think this is nuts a conventional B Bender would be expensive to duplicate with any motor and still not come close.

Clutch442 · December 10th, 2009, 01:36 AM

Won't the guitar most likely pick-up the motor noise and amplify it as well?

nanobug · December 10th, 2009, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clutch442

Won't the guitar most likely pick-up the motor noise and amplify it as well?

rubber or other vibration isolating grommets used for mounting inside of a faraday cage would theoretically isolate the noise from the pickups. a stepper motor of the size needed wouldn't make much of a racket.

just a disclaimer, i'm not an engineer (yet), and i'm just exploring the possibilities of it based on my own knowledge and diy experience. so take everything I say with a heavy dose of 'in theory'

nanobug · December 10th, 2009, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edgemarc

That's a tall question. For electric motors you have to consider the application and work backwards. Things like how fast is the string to be pulled? Is the speed to be variable and reversible? What kind of switch and where's it gonna go? Honestly I think this is nuts a conventional B Bender would be expensive to duplicate with any motor and still not come close.

a conventional b bender would make more sense from a practical standpoint, but ignoring that in the interest of science isn't necessarily a bad thing. making the speed variable and reversible wouldn't be impossible. a self centering single axis analog controller could be used to control the amount and speed of the pitch bend, and would provide control similar to that achieved with a trem. the range of the bend could be programmed into the microcontroller. however, there would need to be some method of calibrating the controller on a semi-regular basis i think.

Nick JD · December 10th, 2009, 02:05 AM

Couldn't you bend the strings with your fingers? That's what I do.

P Thought · December 10th, 2009, 07:12 AM

When you're done with this project, could you design me an electric fretting hand?

jkingma · December 10th, 2009, 07:24 AM

Shouldn't threads like this be in the Tele Tech area?

Just sayin'.

barkley · December 10th, 2009, 07:52 AM

double post

barkley · December 10th, 2009, 07:54 AM

Im sick of playing guitar. I wish i could build a robot to do it for me instead

Actually i think your idea is cool

TeleTim911 · December 10th, 2009, 10:08 PM

You might want to look here also for small steppers?

http://www.allelectronics.com/

Guitarnut · December 10th, 2009, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nanobug

rubber or other vibration isolating grommets used for mounting inside of a faraday cage would theoretically isolate the noise from the pickups. a stepper motor of the size needed wouldn't make much of a racket.

Pickups being a magnetic transducer, I would think the bigger issues would be the magnetic field from the motor windings and the DC pulses from the controller. Just a guess, though.

Quote:

just a disclaimer, i'm not an engineer.

Ditto for me...

Peace,
Mark

Buckocaster51 · December 10th, 2009, 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guitarnut

Pickups being a magnetic transducer, I would think the bigger issues would be the magnetic field from the motor windings...

He'll just have to spec out one of those new-fangled magnetless motors...

City Sirens · December 10th, 2009, 11:29 PM

Transperformance guitars already have motors for each string. Apparently, they have solved that problem.

Guitarnut · December 10th, 2009, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by City Sirens

Transperformance guitars already have motors for each string. Apparently, they have solved that problem.

I believe the motors you're referring to are only used during tuning...not while playing....if I read the specs correctly.

Peace,
Mark

City Sirens · December 11th, 2009, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guitarnut

I believe the motors you're referring to are only used during tuning...not while playing....if I read the specs correctly.

Peace,
Mark

Jimmy Page retunes while playing. Listen to the "Kashmir" intro in "No Quarter" or "Absolution blues" in "Coverdale/Page"

Meekster · December 11th, 2009, 11:54 AM

I don't really know how a B bender works other than adjusting the B to a sharp C right?
Wouldn't a solenoid work better since it's sole purpose is to pull and release?
idk, just wondering

City Sirens · December 11th, 2009, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meekster

I don't really know how a B bender works other than adjusting the B to a sharp C right?
Wouldn't a solenoid work better since it's sole purpose is to pull and release?
idk, just wondering

Maybe a good idea but what about speed control and distance travelled. Is that possible with a solenoid?

Meekster · December 11th, 2009, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by City Sirens

Maybe a good idea but what about speed control and distance travelled. Is that possible with a solenoid?

the distance would be tough but I'm sure it could be controlled with resistance and they have variable pull solenoids
it's do-able

So like I said the B Bender is lost on me
Do you activate it or is it like a Whammy Bar for one string

Hope that helps

City Sirens · December 11th, 2009, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meekster

the distance would be tough but I'm sure it could be controlled with resistance and they have variable pull solenoids
it's do-able

So like I said the B Bender is lost on me
Do you activate it or is it like a Whammy Bar for one string

Hope that helps

Consider it a reverse whammy bar for one string that can only bend upwards for one tone only.

buddywayne · December 11th, 2009, 11:41 PM

I would think a worm drive and reversing motor would work.

December 10th, 2009, 12:27 AM	#1 (permalink)
City Sirens TDPRI Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Québec indépendant Posts: 85	Engineers, get in here (small electric motor question)... If I wanted to use a small electric motor to pull on a string, what should I look for? I'm not trying to make a self-tuning guitar. I'm curious rather to find out if an electric b-bender might be workable... __________________ Play. Harmony Central refugee from the December 2009 server intrusion/meltdown. Alternate tuning blog

December 10th, 2009, 01:16 AM	#4 (permalink)
Marc Rutters VENDOR Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Bonsall California Posts: 673	That's a tall question. For electric motors you have to consider the application and work backwards. Things like how fast is the string to be pulled? Is the speed to be variable and reversible? What kind of switch and where's it gonna go? Honestly I think this is nuts a conventional B Bender would be expensive to duplicate with any motor and still not come close. __________________ http://ruttersguitars.com

December 10th, 2009, 02:05 AM	#8 (permalink)
Nick JD Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: May 2007 Location: Queensland, Australia Age: 37 Posts: 5,909	Couldn't you bend the strings with your fingers? That's what I do. __________________ This is no place to stop, halfway between ape and angel.

December 10th, 2009, 07:12 AM	#9 (permalink)
P Thought Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Coos Bay, Oregon Age: 56 Posts: 874	When you're done with this project, could you design me an electric fretting hand? __________________ Mind if I sniff your cork? Ol' Simple, where you at?

December 10th, 2009, 07:24 AM	#10 (permalink)
jkingma Friend of Leo's Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: N44° 11.943 ~ W080° 35.285 Posts: 4,784 18 Photos	Shouldn't threads like this be in the Tele Tech area? Just sayin'. __________________ Creator of Fine Sawdust and Expensive Kindling.

Sponsored Ads	#
Forum Sponsor Sponsored posting Join Date: March, 2003 Location: Forum HQ Posts: N/A	Sponsored by...

December 10th, 2009, 12:33 AM	#3 (permalink)
nanobug NEW MEMBER! Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Lebanon, PA Posts: 5	quick google search brought this up: http://www.imagesco.com/articles/picstepper/01.html

December 10th, 2009, 01:36 AM	#5 (permalink)
Clutch442 Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Ooltewah, Tennessee Age: 34 Posts: 265	Won't the guitar most likely pick-up the motor noise and amplify it as well?

December 10th, 2009, 07:52 AM	#11 (permalink)
barkley Tele-Holic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Canberra Australia Age: 28 Posts: 996	double post

December 10th, 2009, 07:54 AM	#12 (permalink)
barkley Tele-Holic Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Canberra Australia Age: 28 Posts: 996	Im sick of playing guitar. I wish i could build a robot to do it for me instead Actually i think your idea is cool

December 10th, 2009, 10:08 PM	#13 (permalink)
TeleTim911 Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Calera, Alabama Age: 57 Posts: 467	You might want to look here also for small steppers? http://www.allelectronics.com/

December 10th, 2009, 11:29 PM	#16 (permalink)
City Sirens TDPRI Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Québec indépendant Posts: 85	Transperformance guitars already have motors for each string. Apparently, they have solved that problem. __________________ Play. Harmony Central refugee from the December 2009 server intrusion/meltdown. Alternate tuning blog

December 11th, 2009, 11:54 AM	#19 (permalink)
Meekster TDPRI Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Washington State USA Age: 44 Posts: 58	I don't really know how a B bender works other than adjusting the B to a sharp C right? Wouldn't a solenoid work better since it's sole purpose is to pull and release? idk, just wondering

December 11th, 2009, 11:41 PM	#23 (permalink)
buddywayne Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: missouri Age: 64 Posts: 1,373 10 Photos	I would think a worm drive and reversing motor would work.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Small electric shocks from the bridge?	mowcheeba	Tele-Technical	11	February 27th, 2008 07:55 AM
Request for help: electric motor question	sean79	Bad Dog Cafe	21	January 20th, 2008 02:01 PM
Motor cycles and Gretsches...	chickenpicker	Bad Dog Cafe	3	September 10th, 2007 01:58 PM
Motor City Josh	Old Doc Skinner	Telecaster Discussion Forum	1	August 22nd, 2005 12:57 PM
Where can I get a motor for an old drill press?	Tele295	Telecaster Discussion Forum	5	June 10th, 2003 05:41 AM

IMPORTANT:Treat everyone here with respect, no matter how difficult! No sex, drug, political, religion or hate discussion permitted here.