Sources for nitrocellulose lacquer

BeeTL · January 14th, 2009, 08:43 PM

Here are a few sources for nitrocellulose lacquer I’ve identified. The nitro is sold in clear by the gallon unless noted:

Lawrence McFadden (LMF) L-3651 is what is in the StewMac cans and the ReRanch clear and Fender/Gibson color-matched products. LMF L-3651 is available by the quart from StewMac or in spray cans from ReRanch. Fender uses a different formula than L-3651 that you can order directly from LMF. However, shipping and hazmat fees are cost prohibitive.

LMF L3651 IS available by the gallon at Grizzly.

Deft is sold in spray cans at some home centers.

Sherwin Williams has locations nationwide and has been used with success by some builders, but I’m not sure of which formulation. I linked what I believe is the most likely formula.

Trinity LC290 or LC382 have also been used with success and are recommended by some smaller builders. I was able to buy LC-382 for just over $15.00/gallon locally. I linked the dealer locator.

H. Behlen musical instrument lacquer can be bought by the quart at StewMac or by the gallon from a few furniture-centric suppliers as linked. I can’t find a manufacturer’s page with a dealer locator.

Mohawk also sells a musical instrument lacquer available by mail order.

Here’s the StewMac finishes page, by the way.

Are there any I missed?

Tuxedo · January 14th, 2009, 08:52 PM

Thanks! I guess Deft is the one I'd get, and ReRanch for colors.

Ironwolf · January 14th, 2009, 08:54 PM

Deft and Behelen are available in pints, quarts and spray cans from Wood Crafters.

Shepherd · January 14th, 2009, 09:18 PM

I use this. Cheap too.http://www.mohawk-finishing.com/cata...asp?ictNbr=223

eryque · January 14th, 2009, 09:19 PM

McFadden is available by the gallon from Grizzly. Actually, last time I ordered a gallon they sent me 4 quart cans, which was fine because it's easier to work with that way.

Nick JD · January 14th, 2009, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shepherd

I use this. Cheap too.http://www.mohawk-finishing.com/cata...asp?ictNbr=223

If you check out page two in the MSDS for this product, there seems to be nothing but cellulose nitrate and solvents in its composition.

However, it does contain a fair bit of diisononyl phthalate which is put in plastics to make them more rubbery. It's being phased out in many countries in kids toys - so don't lick your guitars.

If you breathe it in ... you won't need a vasectomy.

BeeTL · January 14th, 2009, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shepherd

I use this. Cheap too.http://www.mohawk-finishing.com/cata...asp?ictNbr=223

Quote:

Originally Posted by eryque

McFadden is available by the gallon from Grizzly. Actually, last time I ordered a gallon they sent me 4 quart cans, which was fine because it's easier to work with that way.

I'll update the OP with this info...good stuff!

boris bubbanov · January 15th, 2009, 12:08 AM

The Deft rattle cans seem to be available in satin, semi-gloss and gloss (I use gloss) at lots of "Lowe's" home monkey-stores for $ 4.84 a can. That's a nice price.

Shepherd · January 15th, 2009, 12:35 AM

Quote:

If you breathe it in ... you won't need a vasectomy.

I might be worried if I was gettin' some but....

So this is'nt a good product? What should it contain? Not up on my chemistry.

Douglas Ingram · January 15th, 2009, 12:37 AM

You could add Chemcraft to the list.
http://www.chemcraft.com/system3.htm

Nick JD · January 15th, 2009, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shepherd

I might be worried if I was gettin' some but....

So this is'nt a good product? What should it contain? Not up on my chemistry.

Not all Nitrocellulose lacquers are created equal. Paints are like promiscuous women ... it's best to use adequate protection.

That stuff that in the Mohawk Nitro is Phthalate. It's been banned from use with children's toys. In large doses it screws with hormone levels because it's an anti-androgen.

The restriction states that the amount of phthalates may not be greater than 0.1% mass percent of the plasticized part of the toy. That Mohawk nitro has 100 times this amount - just don't lick your guitar!

There are reasons the EPA doesn't like some things!

BeeTL · January 15th, 2009, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Douglas Ingram

You could add Chemcraft to the list.
http://www.chemcraft.com/system3.htm

Chemcraft looks very progressive, but they don't seem to offer a traditional, old school nitro lacquer unless this qualifies.

Tuxedo · January 15th, 2009, 05:21 PM

Is ReRanch the most authentic for colors?

BeeTL · January 15th, 2009, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuxedo

Is ReRanch the most authentic for colors?

As near as I can determine, ReRanch may be the ONLY source for authentic Fender and Gibson colors in nitro spray cans.

Since guitar colors were based on the auto paints of the day, auto paint suppliers can match colors with enough information, but it won't be nitro.

If you are really interested, there's a LOT to read here:

http://www.provide.net/~cfh/feature.html

BeeTL · January 15th, 2009, 11:18 PM

Nick JD,

It looks like the Trinity is pure, old school nitro as well.

http://www.insl-x.com/viewProd.asp?prodID=400

I can't find a link to the Lawrence McFadden specs for comparison, but everything i read tells me that Trinity is the "real deal".

Tuxedo · January 15th, 2009, 11:28 PM

BeeTL, what's your thoughts on Deft?

RodeoTex · January 15th, 2009, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeTL

Here are a few sources for nitrocellulose lacquer I’ve identified. The nitro is sold in clear by the gallon unless noted:

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeTL

Lawrence McFadden (LMF) L-3651 is what is in the StewMac cans and the ReRanch clear and Fender/Gibson color-matched products. LMF L-3651 is available by the quart from StewMac or in spray cans from ReRanch. Fender uses a different formula than L-3651 that you can order directly from LMF. However, shipping and hazmat fees are cost prohibitive.

Trinity LC290 or LC382 have also been used with success and are recommended by some smaller builders. I was able to buy LC-382 for just over $15.00/gallon locally. I linked the dealer locator.

The Trinity product is made by Sherwinn-Williams. It was posted here about a year ago. I printed out the page and took it to my local S-W store. The guy first said there was no such thing but after much badgering from me he made some calls and found out that it is a S-W product but no longer available in quantities less then 25 gallons (IIRC).

The Lawrence McFadden lacquer is excellent. I called and ordered directly from them. The shipping cost was high so I ordered 2 gallons of clear. Good stuff.
JMO

John Scott · January 15th, 2009, 11:34 PM

the mohawk is MUCH easier to buff out fine scratcheds than the sherwin williams stuff

at least that is what we discovered at southbound custom whe I was there.

it seemed to dry faster and buff quicker with less burn throughs

BeeTL · January 15th, 2009, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuxedo

BeeTL, what's your thoughts on Deft?

I'm new to guitar finishing, but diligent in doing my research.

I've never used Deft, and have only shot one quart of LMF nitro so far.

That did one Tele body and neck, and it's NOT thick at all.

I have two gallons of Trinity LC-382, so I expect that will go on my next 8 guitars.

Deft gets mixed reviews here and elsewhere because it seems to be highly variable in its cure properties.

Some people get a rock hard finish (good) and some people get a gummy finish that never quite hardens (not good).

Quote:

Originally Posted by RodeoTex

The Trinity product is made by Sherwinn-Williams. It was posted here about a year ago. I printed out the page and took it to my local S-W store. The guy first said there was no such thing but after much badgering from me he made some calls and found out that it is a S-W product but no longer available in quantities less then 25 gallons (IIRC).

The Lawrence McFadden lacquer is excellent. I called and ordered directly from them. The shipping cost was high so I ordered 2 gallons of clear. Good stuff.
JMO

Trinity's parent company is Insl-X.

There is no mention on their corporate web page of a relationship with Sherwin Williams.

http://www.insl-x.com/default.asp

Quote:

Originally Posted by JOHN SCOTT

the mohawk is MUCH easier to buff out fine scratcheds than the sherwin williams stuff at least that is what we discovered at southbound custom whe I was there. it seemed to dry faster and buff quicker with less burn throughs

Good to know.

wharfrat · January 16th, 2009, 03:08 AM

www.meritindustries.com
has a pretty good selection of Behlen's in quarts, gallons and spray cans

Shepherd · January 16th, 2009, 03:55 AM

Holy crap, that Trinity lacquer has seven pages of just safety warnings in the msds

. Never mind a vasectomy, it might just fall off after using that stuff.

BeeTL · January 16th, 2009, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shepherd

Holy crap, that Trinity lacquer has seven pages of just safety warnings in the msds

. Never mind a vasectomy, it might just fall off after using that stuff.

I think most (if not all) of that is the solvent, and would be present in EVERY nitro lacquer.

Lacquer thinner is nasty stuff.

jkingma · January 16th, 2009, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuxedo

Is ReRanch the most authentic for colors?

I don't like the looks of their Butterscotch Blonde. It's way too yellowy. More like Country Crock than Butterscotch.

I've only used it once and I call that guitar I Can't Believe It's Not Tele.

JasonRobert · January 16th, 2009, 02:09 PM

For the guys in the UK... behlen have cellulose clear gloss lacquer which is only £6.80... which is alot cheaper than the average of £15.

http://www.behlen.co.uk/Merchant2/me...ory_Code=MAAER

Behlen also have a stringed instrument lacquer which is £9.80... but I have never tried it http://www.behlen.co.uk/Merchant2/me..._Code=MUSICFIN

oh and they also have the lacquer for spray guns so you can mix in pigments and things.

BeeTL · January 16th, 2009, 03:00 PM

I'm curious...could an auto body shop tint a quart or gallon of clear nitro to a historic color if given the proper paint codes?

That could be an interesting solution for the "home brew" guys.

Tuxedo · January 16th, 2009, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkingma

I don't like the looks of their Butterscotch Blonde. It's way too yellowy. More like Country Crock than Butterscotch.

I've only used it once and I call that guitar I Can't Believe It's Not Tele.

I wish they wouldn't try faking the aging process.

Shoved BassVIII · January 16th, 2009, 06:19 PM

What about Farwest paints in Tacoma WA?

BAW4742 · January 16th, 2009, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeTL

Deft is sold in spray cans at some home centers.

I have been getting Deft Sand & Seal and Gloss lacquer at Lowe's. It's available in quarts and gallons here.

BeeTL · November 22nd, 2009, 11:50 PM

Also, just to be clear, LMF L3651 IS available at Grizzly by the gallon (H5752) and by the quart (H5751). Confirmed as L-3651 by Grizzly customer service.

Thanks!

PixMix · November 23rd, 2009, 12:49 AM

Any of you use this?

http://yhst-13811118617756.stores.ya...hannelid=FROOG

edgemarc · November 23rd, 2009, 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PixMix

Any of you use this?

http://yhst-13811118617756.stores.ya...hannelid=FROOG

Yep, Doctor Smoothie, that right there is the secret weapon but be careful if you spray say 3 coats 1 hour apart only use it on the last coat or it will do the reverse effect and look like the surface of the moon. Used right it makes your lacquer lay down nice and smooth not perfect but close.

toploader · December 23rd, 2009, 05:03 PM

Up here in MN, the one and only source for Trinity LC 382 is playing dumb and trying to get me to buy M.L.Campbell Nitro lacquer #C12818. M.L. Campbell was bought by Sherwin Williams, but apparently their lacquer is still made separately from Sherwin Williams. I've been ordering Mcfaddens from Grizzly, and like their stuff, but would love to able to get something locally.
Any M.L. Campbell users?

keithcc · January 6th, 2010, 12:46 AM

Can you get the necessary colors to do the automotive colors with nitro anymore through auto vendors?

FatKnife · January 8th, 2010, 06:44 PM

Is there an acceptable-looking, non-nitro, spray can substitute tint for the nitro look?

Jerry J · January 8th, 2010, 07:46 PM

Here's one that I used with great results. It sprays well, cures quickly and sands nicely.

http://store.gemini-coatings.com/c-9...-aerosols.aspx

The distributor used to bring my order to the local Lumber Liquidators.

January 14th, 2009, 08:43 PM	#1 (permalink)
BeeTL Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Palm Harbor, FL Age: 44 Posts: 227	Sources for nitrocellulose lacquer Here are a few sources for nitrocellulose lacquer I’ve identified. The nitro is sold in clear by the gallon unless noted: Lawrence McFadden (LMF) L-3651 is what is in the StewMac cans and the ReRanch clear and Fender/Gibson color-matched products. LMF L-3651 is available by the quart from StewMac or in spray cans from ReRanch. Fender uses a different formula than L-3651 that you can order directly from LMF. However, shipping and hazmat fees are cost prohibitive. LMF L3651 IS available by the gallon at Grizzly. Deft is sold in spray cans at some home centers. Sherwin Williams has locations nationwide and has been used with success by some builders, but I’m not sure of which formulation. I linked what I believe is the most likely formula. Trinity LC290 or LC382 have also been used with success and are recommended by some smaller builders. I was able to buy LC-382 for just over $15.00/gallon locally. I linked the dealer locator. H. Behlen musical instrument lacquer can be bought by the quart at StewMac or by the gallon from a few furniture-centric suppliers as linked. I can’t find a manufacturer’s page with a dealer locator. Mohawk also sells a musical instrument lacquer available by mail order. Here’s the StewMac finishes page, by the way. Are there any I missed? Last edited by BeeTL; January 14th, 2009 at 11:19 PM..

January 14th, 2009, 08:54 PM	#3 (permalink)
Ironwolf Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Boise, Idaho Age: 53 Posts: 1,509	Deft and Behelen are available in pints, quarts and spray cans from Wood Crafters. __________________ Oderint Dum Metuant - Nero Caesar

January 14th, 2009, 09:19 PM	#5 (permalink)
eryque Poster Extraordinaire Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: albany, ny [not chicago] Posts: 7,407 44 Photos	McFadden is available by the gallon from Grizzly. Actually, last time I ordered a gallon they sent me 4 quart cans, which was fine because it's easier to work with that way. __________________ my blog: eryque.blogspot.com Updated 9.17.08! Subscribe_____________________

January 15th, 2009, 12:37 AM	#10 (permalink)
Douglas Ingram Tele-Meister Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lorette, Manitoba, Canada Posts: 143	You could add Chemcraft to the list. http://www.chemcraft.com/system3.htm __________________ Happily analog. http://www.redrivercanoe.ca/ http://woodbecreative.blogspot.com/

January 15th, 2009, 11:34 PM	#18 (permalink)
John Scott TDPRI Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Nashville via JOHNSON CITY TN Age: 28 Posts: 53	the mohawk is MUCH easier to buff out fine scratcheds than the sherwin williams stuff at least that is what we discovered at southbound custom whe I was there. it seemed to dry faster and buff quicker with less burn throughs __________________ "Can I get alot more of ME in everyone else's monitor?

January 14th, 2009, 08:52 PM	#2 (permalink)
Tuxedo Tele-Holic Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 524	Thanks! I guess Deft is the one I'd get, and ReRanch for colors.

January 14th, 2009, 09:18 PM	#4 (permalink)
Shepherd Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Maple Ridge, Canada Posts: 1,124	I use this. Cheap too.http://www.mohawk-finishing.com/cata...asp?ictNbr=223

January 15th, 2009, 12:08 AM	#8 (permalink)
boris bubbanov Doctor of Teleocity Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: New Orleans, LA + in the past Posts: 16,326	The Deft rattle cans seem to be available in satin, semi-gloss and gloss (I use gloss) at lots of "Lowe's" home monkey-stores for $ 4.84 a can. That's a nice price.

January 15th, 2009, 05:21 PM	#13 (permalink)
Tuxedo Tele-Holic Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 524	Is ReRanch the most authentic for colors?

January 15th, 2009, 11:18 PM	#15 (permalink)
BeeTL Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Palm Harbor, FL Age: 44 Posts: 227	Nick JD, It looks like the Trinity is pure, old school nitro as well. http://www.insl-x.com/viewProd.asp?prodID=400 I can't find a link to the Lawrence McFadden specs for comparison, but everything i read tells me that Trinity is the "real deal".

January 15th, 2009, 11:28 PM	#16 (permalink)
Tuxedo Tele-Holic Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 524	BeeTL, what's your thoughts on Deft?

January 16th, 2009, 03:08 AM	#20 (permalink)
wharfrat TDPRI Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 21	www.meritindustries.com has a pretty good selection of Behlen's in quarts, gallons and spray cans

January 16th, 2009, 03:55 AM	#21 (permalink)
Shepherd Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Maple Ridge, Canada Posts: 1,124	Holy crap, that Trinity lacquer has seven pages of just safety warnings in the msds . Never mind a vasectomy, it might just fall off after using that stuff.

January 16th, 2009, 02:09 PM	#24 (permalink)
JasonRobert Tele-Holic Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Paddock Wood, Kent, England Posts: 870	For the guys in the UK... behlen have cellulose clear gloss lacquer which is only £6.80... which is alot cheaper than the average of £15. http://www.behlen.co.uk/Merchant2/me...ory_Code=MAAER Behlen also have a stringed instrument lacquer which is £9.80... but I have never tried it http://www.behlen.co.uk/Merchant2/me..._Code=MUSICFIN oh and they also have the lacquer for spray guns so you can mix in pigments and things.

January 16th, 2009, 03:00 PM	#25 (permalink)
BeeTL Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Palm Harbor, FL Age: 44 Posts: 227	I'm curious...could an auto body shop tint a quart or gallon of clear nitro to a historic color if given the proper paint codes? That could be an interesting solution for the "home brew" guys.

January 16th, 2009, 06:19 PM	#27 (permalink)
Shoved BassVIII Tele-Holic Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lima Ohio Age: 27 Posts: 645	What about Farwest paints in Tacoma WA?

November 22nd, 2009, 11:50 PM	#29 (permalink)
BeeTL Tele-Meister Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Palm Harbor, FL Age: 44 Posts: 227	Also, just to be clear, LMF L3651 IS available at Grizzly by the gallon (H5752) and by the quart (H5751). Confirmed as L-3651 by Grizzly customer service. Thanks!

November 23rd, 2009, 12:49 AM	#30 (permalink)
PixMix TDPRI Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: MI Age: 36 Posts: 74	Any of you use this? http://yhst-13811118617756.stores.ya...hannelid=FROOG __________________

December 23rd, 2009, 05:03 PM	#32 (permalink)
toploader TDPRI Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Pancake Making Capitol of the World Posts: 22	Up here in MN, the one and only source for Trinity LC 382 is playing dumb and trying to get me to buy M.L.Campbell Nitro lacquer #C12818. M.L. Campbell was bought by Sherwin Williams, but apparently their lacquer is still made separately from Sherwin Williams. I've been ordering Mcfaddens from Grizzly, and like their stuff, but would love to able to get something locally. Any M.L. Campbell users? Last edited by toploader; December 23rd, 2009 at 08:15 PM..

January 6th, 2010, 12:46 AM	#33 (permalink)
keithcc Tele-Meister Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Tulsa Age: 43 Posts: 261	Can you get the necessary colors to do the automotive colors with nitro anymore through auto vendors?

January 8th, 2010, 06:44 PM	#34 (permalink)
FatKnife TDPRI Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Nashville TN Posts: 51	Is there an acceptable-looking, non-nitro, spray can substitute tint for the nitro look? __________________ Ends are beginnings, and beginnings are not ends.

January 8th, 2010, 07:46 PM	#35 (permalink)
Jerry J Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NoVa Posts: 911	Here's one that I used with great results. It sprays well, cures quickly and sands nicely. http://store.gemini-coatings.com/c-9...-aerosols.aspx The distributor used to bring my order to the local Lumber Liquidators. __________________ .....and that's why keith richards cannot be killed by conventional weapons.....

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