Southern maple for neck ?

[mrothacker]

I need some advice from you experienced guitar builders/woodworkers . Do you think that southern maple would be strong enough to make a neck out of without causing warpage problems down the road ? I recently started thinking it could work because Gibson uses Honduran mahogany for thier necks so why not maple that grows in the mountains in North Carolina . A friend of mine owns a cabinet door manufacturing business , and when I went to visit his shop he had a large stack of flamed and figured maple .They set it aside because it doesn't match the good looking maple they make thier doors out of . So I am thinking necks and tops oh boy !

[mrothacker]

If there was a question as the stability of the maple I thought maybe I could install some of these from Stew Mac

[IMG][/IMG]
Want a stiff neck?Carbon Fiber Neck Rods
Stronger than an equivalent weight of steel, carbon fiber rods can be used to supplement an adjustable truss rod, and short sections can be installed to reinforce the base of a peghead. Formed with heat and pressure in an epoxy base, carbon fiber adds little extra weight to a neck, but adds significant stiffness.

They can be found at;
http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Truss_ro...Neck_Rods.html

[robt57]

a laminating of several pieces with opposing grain orientation perhaps ?

[tonewoods]

Well, hard maple does grow in North Carolina, though only in the western part of the state....

See it's range here...

Is is for sure soft??

If you want to make sure it's soft maple (Acer rubens), you can apply a saturated water solution of ferrous sulfate and see if a deep blue-black color develops.

When the same solution is applied to sugar maple (hard), a greenish color results.

Soft maple is fine for necks, although it doesn't match the vibe of hard maple like you see in Fender necks...

For tops?
No problem...

[mrothacker]

robt57 - I thought about that a little , I was thinking I would make a chery neck that way , but the maple would be especially pretty as a 1 piece .

tonewoods - That is some great info , Thanks . That map that is shown draws the line pretty close to where I live here in western North Carolina . We do have fairly cold winters here for the south due to the elevation .

[guitarbuilder]

I'm guessing if the wood is used for windows and cabinets that it is probably kiln dried. That will help in the stability dept. I would rough saw the wood oversize but close to its final shape and let it acclimate before you proceed to square it up. Many times there are stresses from the drying process that get released during processing. It would be good to see it move before it is a neck.:-). Use a good finish when you are all done to slow down that summer humidity.
Just think of all those Appalachian (sp?) instruments that have been built and lasted over the years.

['56Teleman]

I would contact an experienced builder such as Ron Kirn before going through the work of building a neck only to find it isn't stable enough.

There has to be a reason builders use only northern maple. Cabinets and windows aren't under the stress a guitar neck is.

Good luck with your project.

[tonewoods]

Originally Posted by '56Teleman

There has to be a reason builders use only northern maple.

Well, it's now traditional...

And it's highly available (even on the Left Coast in places like Fullerton in the 50's) and cheap (costs less than Bigleaf Maple on the Left Coast)....

And it works for necks...

Hard to compete with that....

[guitarbuilder]

I've made necks out of mahogany, cherry, zebrawood, basswood, poplar, walnut, and maple. The only one that warped was the zebrawood one. They all had truss rods installed in them.
Marty

[guitarbuilder]

Cabinets and windows aren't under the stress a guitar neck is.

True, but they won't open or the joints will separate if not dried properly.
Marty

[mrothacker]

Thank you for all of the comments thus far !

guitarbuilder - He dries all of his boards , I dont know if I would call it Kiln drying per se , he has a large walk-in cooler , really a drive-in cooler ( for a forklift ) and he will drive in a couple of pallets of wood , close the thing up and then run it ( I am not exactly sure what he is doing ) but it is backwards where he is heating the inside , and monitoring the moisture draw from the wood . I believe he said it takes about 1 week to complete . Hygrometer testing shows consistent percentages of I think 9% . I figured it would be possible to build stable necks out of something besides the "traditional" woods , what surprises me is that you have had luck with basswood and poplar , if so surely there is hope for southern maple !

tonewoods - Surely availabilty and price are significant factors in materials selection for production guitars , in my case though I wanted to use wood that I either own already or in this case with the maple is available locally and relatively cheap .

56 teleman - Yes I was hoping a few of the really experienced builders would drop in and comment !

[Jack Wells]

I would contact an experienced builder such as Ron Kirn before going through the work of building a neck only to find it isn't stable enough.

I may be wrong but I don't think Ron Kirn builds necks.

If Marty has had success with basswood, it seems you could use almost any wood if properly dried and supported with a truss rod.

With a softer wood, it seems you might initially have some stabilization problems caused by the compression of the wood by the truss rod. Seems like you'd reach a point where the wood would no longer compress and the neck would be stable after that point.

[guitarbuilder]

You may want to read this brief:

http://pods.dasnr.okstate.edu/docush...EM-5009web.pdf

[Jack Wells]

Good information there Marty.

Originally Posted by From the brief

Tangential dimensional change has the highest rate of change

Since most neck blanks are flat sawn, the tangential change is in the width. This is the reason you see fret sprout in guitars that go from a humid enviroment to a dry enviroment.

[mrothacker]

Thanks again for the comments , and that pdf ! I think unless someone can come up with a real good reason why I should not , I am going to go for it and build some necks out of that maple . I appreciate everyones input , and if anyone else would like to comment , please do so !

[guitarbuilder]

Most hardwoods are kiln dried to 6-8% moisture content. I would bring it indoors and let it acclimate especially this time of year. Give it a couple weeks inside. You'll probably see a bit of movement

[Ronkirn]

Yeah, I make 'em when there is no alternative. When I do one out of "marginal" lumber, I will rout out a channel and glue a laminated support which will be completely concealed. If it's really soft, I'll fill it with a few graphite rods..

I made this one from chestnut using the above method. It's from 200 year old wormy chestnut.... The idea was a very rustic guitar made from a very unique lumber, chestnut is so soft and brittle, it required considerable thought throught the whole process.




http://www.ronkirn.com/gallery2/index.php?album=Donnie

Ron Kirn

[jkingma]

The biggest issue with neck wood is that it is properly and thoroughly seasoned. CF rods will certainly help if you want to use them but that won't be an absolute guarantee of a stable neck.

[Superc_1]

I just finished about five necks out of soft flamed maple and I havn't seen any problem. I put a truss rod in. The woods was kiln dried and has been lying around the shop about two years. I like the wood and its cheap around here. I'm in the same position your in. Theres a guy who lives behind me that dries wood and they put the flamed maple to the side because the cabinet makers don't want it because it doesn't match the regular maple for the cabinets. Go figure!

[telex]

I made these three necks from curly soft maple. So far so good.
I left them all "chunky", so that helps I bet.