Time signature for "Hot, Blue and Righteous"?

[Waynel]

I have been playing ZZ Top's Hot, Blue and Righteous for thirty years. Really an easy song...however...in every band I've played in we have always had this "discussion." What in the heck is the time signature on this song? I've heard everything from 3/4 to 12/8 (which Skynyrd used on "Tuesday's Gone")

I've searched the web and I can't seem to find anyone to agree on the time for this tune. It's the only song I can play in time without actually knowing what the time is. What do you think it is?

[Tim Armstrong]

I'd probably call it 6/8, because I count six beats to a measure, but I'm not exactly an expert!

Tim

[Tim Bowen]

The thing that makes it confusing is that it's possible to chart it different ways in subdivisions of threes. This will sound silly, but it's not 3/4 to me because it's not "waltzy" enough...! To clarify a bit, listen to the way the phrase turns around, and a key factor is to listen to where the snare drum pops - in 12/8 that would be counts four and ten, and in 6/8, count four; typically this signifies a longer phrase than 3/4. Most slow (and often medium) tempo blues are 12/8, and lots of country ballads are as well. If you listen to the way the phrase turns around in Floyd Cramer's "Last Date", that's classic 12/8 to me.

It's possible to think of this as 12/8 or 6/8, but I'm with Tim, this feels like 6/8. But don't listen to me... I've seen "House of the Rising Sun" notated in 3/4, but if you're me, it's 6/8!

[Budda]

Agreed, 6/8 is what it has always sounded like to me as well.

[Joe-Bob]

6/8

Listen carefully; it's two beats sub-divided into three. The definition of 6/8.

[Telesavalis]

You can count it in either 6/8 or a very slow 4/4.

[Joe-Bob]

Originally Posted by Telesavalis

You can count.....a very slow 4/4.

Uhh...No, you can't.

The count is not divided by 3 in 4/4.

[klasaine]

I'd call it 6/8.

*I think what TeleSalivas meant by 'really slow 4/4' was the 12/8 thing - three triplets on each beat. The snare hits on 2 and 4. That can be thought of as a really slow 4.

[Northerntele]

I'm with the six eight crowd. The phrasing doesn't make sense to me any other way.

[boneyguy]

Originally Posted by Joe-Bob

Uhh...No, you can't.

The count is not divided by 3 in 4/4.

Of course you can. Triplets are found in 4/4 all the time and they divide the beat into 3. You can count anything in 4/4. It may not make the best sense to do it but you can do it. Of course the accents (which can be notated) will fall on different beats than is typical for 4/4 but it can be done.

It seems to me that the notion of a time signature is largley a convention for written music where the rule of thumb is to make it as visually uncomplicated as possible.

[ScatMan]

Originally Posted by Tim Bowen

The thing that makes it confusing is that it's possible to chart it different ways in subdivisions of threes. This will sound silly, but it's not 3/4 to me because it's not "waltzy" enough...! To clarify a bit, listen to the way the phrase turns around, and a key factor is to listen to where the snare drum pops..

Not "silly' to me at all. I'm hearing the rhythm of the vocals and instruments in x/8 time (could be 6/8 or 12/8).

The rhythm of the instruments "could be" in 3/4, but I agree that it probably isn't.. because I don't hear the "weight" on the one (agreed: it's not waltzy)..

..For me, the singing and bass drum rhythms determine the time signature here.

[Telesavalis]

Originally Posted by klasaine

I'd call it 6/8.

*I think what TeleSalivas meant by 'really slow 4/4' was the 12/8 thing - three triplets on each beat. The snare hits on 2 and 4. That can be thought of as a really slow 4.

yes.

[Joe-Bob]

Originally Posted by boneyguy

Triplets are found in 4/4 all the time and they divide the beat into 3.

Sure, but not all of every measure. Then it's 12/8, not 4/4.

[boneyguy]

Originally Posted by Joe-Bob

Sure, but not all of every measure. Then it's 12/8, not 4/4.

Well that's just wordplay at this point. Your original statement was "The count is not divided by 3 in 4/4"

We're talking two different thigs here: time signature and feel. It may be cumbersome to notate a 12/8 feel in 4/4 but it's not wrong as you're implying. And as two other members have suggested this song could be heard as a slow 4 with each beat divided into triplets. That may not be typical but it's not unreasonable

[Joe-Bob]

Originally Posted by boneyguy

Well that's just wordplay at this point. Your original statement was "The count is not divided by 3 in 4/4"

We're talking two different thigs here: time signature and feel. It may be cumbersome to notate a 12/8 feel in 4/4 but it's not wrong as you're implying. And as two other members have suggested this song could be heard as a slow 4 with each beat divided into triplets. That may not be typical but it's not unreasonable

Sorry again, but that is incorrect.

Look, I didn't make up the rules of music theory, they've been around for hundreds of years. To call this song a 4/4 is wrong. Whether any of you believe me or not has no effect on the truth.

[String Tree]

All this talk about ZZ TOP is making me thirsty.

Time out!

[CharlyG]

Originally Posted by Joe-Bob

6/8

Listen carefully; it's two beats sub-divided into three. The definition of 6/8.

Plus 1