the 5-years rule of guitar learning...

[P Thought]

It continues to amaze me how much better I can get, and still suck.

[jmthurman]

Plateau? Perhaps.

Need a new teacher? Probably.

Need a new luthier? Maybe.

Stuck forever? Not as long as you're breathing.

Daniel Levitin (This is Your Brain on Music), Chip & Dan Heath (Switch, Made to Stick), and many others write about what makes expertise. Levitin deals specifically with musicians in this regard. What makes a great musician? Talent or work? The answer?

10,000 hours... of focused, intentional, grinding, difficult, boring, exciting... work.

10,000 hours trumps talent.

The Heath brothers use the Beatles as an example in Switch. Before 1964 they had played 6 - 8 - 10 hours a day in Hamburg and other cities...almost every day. Even though they got together in 1960 and didn't have the typical 10 years that it takes to log 10,000 quality hours; they still logged the hours in the crucible of live performance that made their 1964 US debut possible.

Sure, you may reach the majority of your potential at some point down the road. By then, I'd wager, you will be accomplished enough to focus on the fine points of composition and performance that make truly great entertainers great. (BTW, many great musical entertainers aren't great musicians....)

Keep going until your desire to be better goes away. Then...ask yourself if you need a break, a new challenge, a new teacher or a new avenue of expression...

Best,
Michael

[Kewk]

That's just about the worst bit of un-inspirational advice I've ever heard. I don't think one lifetime is long enough to plateau. I've been playing for 30 years and still learn new tricks.

[Mechanic]

I've actively been takeing lessons now for 18 months, but played off and on for over 30 yrs. My playing just got a little insite and I've been noodleing with it now for a couple of weeks. As has been stated above in any learning or skill it is a constant process of knowlage aquisition. I play to spark my synapses and keep my hands functional, and learning new skills is the main bennifit to life. Get out of your rut and climb up to that next platau.

[hybridrocknroll]

Originally Posted by imsilly

I hope he's wrong. I definitely don't want to reach a ceiling before I've gotten as good as I want to be. I suspect your progress is relative to the passion you have and not the time you've been playing.

THIS, 100% this. I feel that you can play for 10 years just strumming chords and truly not get better, or play for 6 months with passion and a willingness to learn, and easily surpass that person strumming for so long. I feel that if you think you can be better, then you can.

If nothing else, go back and try to play some parts of a song you never thought you could play before. You'd really notice your gain in experience when you start banging out those riffs that seemed impossibly hard for years...

[tele12]

I've heard it stated as a 10 year rule, whatever you want to learn, be it music , a sport it takes 10 years to really learn it. Not that I beleive it has any basis if fact.

[tele12]

Originally Posted by wright4000

..... There is a book by Malcolm Gladwell called "The Tipping Point" where he makes a case for "The 10,000 Hour Rule" of practice. He states the if a person can put in 10,000 hours, regardless of "natural talent", then that person can achieve greatness. He supports his claim with several great examples. It's a great book. Read it!

I don't believe "10,000 hours" either, I think it is a made up number, why not 7,845 hours?........why not 12,382 hours?

I've heard it stated in golf instruction, it takes 10,000 repititions to learn a physical skill.

[sax4blues]

I don't think there is any flattening of the learning curve.

But there may be a balancing of life's priorities. The person who is really good at something usually puts a lot of effort and thought into that activity. So the thought could be if after 5 years I'm just average, unless guitar moves up the scale in priority, I will probably always just be average. For the person who in their first 5 years really excels, unless guitar moves significantly down in their balance of priorities, they will probably continue to excel.

[paulvcarter]

I suggest you improve your playing discipline by song writing and recording. If you have a apple use Garageband, it's free and easy to use.

Recording is lik playing in a band, it improves your tightness and you really hear how you sound - usually worse than you think.

Playing to a simple back beat then soloing over it or building multiple melodies is real fun especially as you played all the parts.

The other best way to improve is to find new players - a new teacher would work especially if it's in a group.

We all improve over time but we won't all be Jimmy Page.

[historicus146]

Well, I lived through the era of NO internet...NO tab....NO Youtube...

Being by yourself...and trying to taperecord songs.... slow them down..(pitch skew)..
was a tough go...

The internet rejuvinated me...and you younger guys are lucky to have the full blown benefits of it for years.

Point...with the internet...I dont see how you can go stale...Learn a jazz lick... or something you might not normally go after to break the monotony

If you like playing... I dont see how you can stop getting better..imo

[hymiepab]

I've been playing about 30 years. I have to admit that within my first five years, I reached a plateau. I could play OK rock guitar, good enough to play with most of the locals.
I fell into playing too many pet licks because they were good enough.
About 10 years later, I started to work with a teacher who worked with me on theory, sight reading and technique. I was motivated to learn these things and now am at a level far beyond what I thought possible as a kid.
If you stay curious and disciplined there really is no five year rule in my opinion!

[chilldude]

Been playing for 45 years, lefty strung righty, and I'm still fascinated and still getting better.
I like to reach a little past what I know every day. There's been ruts here and there, but basically I'm in the camp that says your luthier is wrong.

[gatimberframer]

If you are trying to improve and doing the work you will improve.

If you are content to just do what you've always done, you may not improve.

[jvanoort]

Originally Posted by bobbydeerfield

So... an old luthier-player told me that, no matter how hard do you practice and study guitar, after a definite amount of time (usually 5 years) you'll reach a certain level, high for some and poor for others, and basically you'll be stuck there for the rest of your playing life. Like the learning curve flatten.

As a (former) professional teacher I strongly disagree!
I suppose the old luthier seemed a little frustrated about his own progress and started building guitars instead of playing them....just filling in

[jazztele]

5 years? You can stop improving a lot sooner if you stop working.

If you keep working, no plateau has to be permanent.

[Tele-Monster]

I call BS! Keep practicing and keep playing that's the most important thing to remember.

[Lost_N_Austin]

The young people in this video have probably peaked and should just quit practicing because they probably won't improve with more woodshedding.


I love the dog in these videos of the Tuttle kids. Go Molly, you ROCK.

Lost_N_Austin

[String Tree]

- 1 to the Luthier.
I started when I was 13. What I lacked in talent I made-up for with Ego.
When I was 18 I was much better in my mind than I was in reality.
After High School I made Guitar Playing my life. I practiced like a man possessed. Went to College and Majored in music. I didn't finish because I didn't want to become a teacher.
By the time I was 20, I really was pretty good.
Went on the road playing Clubs for a couple of years. Played 5 and 6 nights a week, 5 hours a night. By the time I was 23 I a hundred-fold better than when I was 20.

The so-called 5-year rule may apply to some people, but not to everybody.

[AM866]

Originally Posted by TC6969

I dont agree but I DO have a local guitar/keyboard/sax/harmonica/singer whom I have been listening to for 38 years.

This guy hasn't missed two weekends in a row without a gig in all that time.

He has kept himself fairly current as far as the country/rock scene goes but the poor guy was a hopeless hack in 1972 and he has not improved ONE IOTA in 38 years!

His timing is good and he manages to stay in pitch really well, but his playing ability is just horrid and always has been!

And you're still listening to him? I probably would've quit, oh, I don't know, 38 years ago

Or 33, if you subscribe to the luthier's theory.

[n7918]

Graduated from a music school 30 years and played so bad I quit playing for decades. Started playing again in 2006 and I'm much more disciplined about playing and play mo' better. Maybe your luthier's nitrocellulose lid is ajar!