Blues to jazz

[Ash Telecaster]

Hi, I'm a blues guitarist who wants to expand his vocabulary. Since comming to this forum I have found out about some great music and that has given me a thirst to grow. I'm loving the chicken pickin stuff and I'm loving the jazz stuff. Its become an addiction really. I'm about ready to trade my kids in on a Telecaster!

The purpose for this post is to discuss some jazz blues songs that are good to disect and study for the blues guitarist who wants to learn the jazz language.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions!

[bingy]

IMO there is only one place to start:
T-Bone Walker (Stormy Monday is the quintessential cross over tune.)

[Ash Telecaster]

Thanks Bingy, I'm going to Amazon it right now.

[jefrs]

+1 on Stormy Monday
Most anything from late swing era R&B comes with jazz influenced blues and jazz-blues, even BB King throws in jazz licks. Once you've heard it you can't go back to just three chord blues.

[tjalla]

Two places to start: T-Bone Walker and Lonnie Johnson.



Then swing blues guys like Pee Wee Crayton and Hollywood Fats

Or Jazz guys with blues leanings - Grant Green, Barney Kessell.

[wangdangdoodle]

Do you mean recommendations for music, or purley on a technical level? All the guys mentioned above are great to listen to.

As someone who started off as a blues guy myself... I'd say the first thing to would be to learn some Jazz chords. In Swing/Jump Blues 9ths, 13ths, 6ths, diminished, are all common and bring much more colour and harmonic interest.

Single note wise... the best thing to start doing is target the 3rd's and 7th's in a Jazz/Blues 12 bar progression.

[stevieboy]

Originally Posted by tjalla

Or Jazz guys with blues leanings - Grant Green, Barney Kessell.

Add Kenny Burrell to that list too. Especially his work with Jimmy Smith the organist, along with Stanley Turentine.. To me that's the ultimate crossover jazz/blues stuff. You find in the jazz section (that is, if you can find a record store), but they played some gutbucket blues IMO.

If you haven't, check out the "Swingy Jazzy Blues Chords" thread in this very section of the forum.

[Ash Telecaster]

Thanks everybody for your suggestions!

I've done some major downloading today. I got some T Bone and Barney Kessell and BB and Pee Wee Crayton and Hollywood Flats and Barney Kessell and Grant Green and Kenny Burrell.

I appreciate all the suggestions but I was wondering. All these recordings sound pretty old. Not that I have a problem with listening to old recordings but I was wondering if there are any current people doing this kind of stuff?

Thanks

[Corey]

+1 on Stormy Monday. Another good one is Blue Bossa:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sr7BXinJMw

[jefrs]

I saw The Cadillac Kings recently. They're not blues and they're not jazz but somewhere in-between. Maybe semi-pro but they're on iTunes http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/M...23687&s=143444
I had a natter to them. The lead was playing an original 53/54 Harmony Stratotone.

[Axis29]

Originally Posted by GitHead

Thanks everybody for your suggestions!

I've done some major downloading today. I got some T Bone and Barney Kessell and BB and Pee Wee Crayton and Hollywood Flats and Barney Kessell and Grant Green and Kenny Burrell.

I appreciate all the suggestions but I was wondering. All these recordings sound pretty old. Not that I have a problem with listening to old recordings but I was wondering if there are any current people doing this kind of stuff?

Thanks

Most of the bigger acts in Jazz have moved further from the Blues. I think after Coltrane, many feel they have to push the limits. But if you find guys playing in smaller clubs, I think you'll find more Bluesy jazz... or maybe I'm just not listening to the right radio stations and finding the guys I'd like to hear more!

The Bebop crowd of the late 50's and into the 60's started expanding blues based songs and pushing the ideas of substitution. This continues to this day. However, I am still drawn to the more bluesy sounds of jazz myself.

Check out Tuck Andress:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M56QwDjE6PQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfjFdtMlH6o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kLujUQx6mk

Amazing guitarist....

A more Bluesy guy for me is Clarence Gatemouth Brown:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sT42VwUTsRw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzTpg9f4oF8

This is where I lvie when it comes to music... Wishing I could play Jazz, but loving the Blues....

[jefrs]

It's certainly out there. The local, cof, jazz scene tends more to swing then bebop and there are a lot of jazz elements creeping into the local, cof, blues scene. But these are not big acts and it's not main stream, so little recorded.

[tjalla]

Looking for a newer guy? Grab Duke Robillard's Uptown Blues, Jazz, Rock Swing DVD.

[nosuch]

chitlins con carne by kenny burell would be a nice song to learn. simple but effective

[Ash Telecaster]

Wow that Calarence Gatemouth Brown was cooool! What an unusual picking style. All index finger but hes pretty quick picking that way. That one oclock jump was really hopping!

The Tuck Andres was cool too. I love the way he redid the Hendrix. its like he peeled away the efects and revealed the real song living underneath.

The Duke R stuff is very cool. I have it along with Duke in concert coming via Netflix.

Thanks again for all your suggestions

[tjalla]

Sidenote gem - anyone notice Alison Krauss in the Gatemouth "Okie Dokie stomp" clip? Seems he's playing bluegrass on her fiddle

[Ash Telecaster]

Originally Posted by tjalla

Sidenote gem - anyone notice Alison Krauss in the Gatemouth "Okie Dokie stomp" clip? Seems he's playing bluegrass on her fiddle

Yah and I like that little talkin riff he does at the end!

[Ash Telecaster]

Okay an addon question. Anybody know where I can find a roadmap for chord and scale options for blues progressions? I mean from a jazz perspective.

[jazztele]

alright, so let's start with something simple: I7 IV7 V7 blues. (lets do key of A)

over the I, you can play:

A blues scale (or minor pentatonic)
A major pentatonic
A mixolydian (major scale with a flat seventh)

over the IV

A blues scale/minor pentatonic
D mixolydian (D major with a flat seventh)

over the V

A blues scale/minor pentatonic
E mixolydian (E major with a flatted seventh)

you can also play hybrids of each, so, over the A, start with a minor pentatonic line but land on a C# (the major third)

you can also think arpeggios/chord tones and throw the scales by the wayside...i like this approach. in other words, when playing over the A7, play the notes that make up an A7. or, get a little deeper, and try A9. A11. A13. If your ears like it and it doesn't clash with the melody, any dominant 7th chord can be extended further into the 9th, 11th and 13th range (11ths are probably less common than 9th or 13th, which have "instant" bluesy sounds to them)

now, in order to start sounding jazzier, you're going to want to play the notes between the notes too...huh? I mean, approach the "money notes" chromatically. check this lick out over an I in a three chord blues in A

------------------5-------------------------------
---------5-6-sl-7----8-7-6-5----5-5---------------
--5-sl-6----------------------7----5-h-6----------
------------------------------------------7-6-5---
---------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------

what's happening there? really major pentatonic to minor pentatonic back to major, with a few chromatic passing tones. the last note of the series is the G, the flat seventh, which can be thought of as returning to minor or sugesting mixolydian (mixolydian is essentially the scale that most directly relates to a dom7th chord--not the only choice, but never a bad one)

again, this is just a start. but if you dig it, I'll keep it coming.

[stevieboy]

Originally Posted by tjalla

Sidenote gem - anyone notice Alison Krauss in the Gatemouth "Okie Dokie stomp" clip? Seems he's playing bluegrass on her fiddle

That's backstage at the big all star blues tribute concert they had in NY, which is the subject of the "Lightning in a Bottle" DVD.