Proper use of Capo

bcbeak · May 16th, 2008, 07:26 AM

Started a new gig with a female singer ... a need to capo some songs (Eb, etc.). I know ... I should be man enough to play everything without a capo .... but there are some licks and vamps that just work too well in the capoed open position.

Anyway, my problem is that when I capo any of my electrics, the tuning is off (sharp) a bit in the lower strings. I've tried placing the capo at every spot within the fret and still get sharpness, the best result coming from tight up and straight against the higher fret.

I never experienced this with acoustic guitars, and am worried that the pitch not working with the other instruments. Last year I played a gig and had to use the capo and the keyboard player flipped out.

Are there any tips/techniques for using a capo on an electric? Is the only solution to keep a second guitar capoed and retuned? FYI .. I'm using the Kyser quick change capo. Thanks!

guitarzan13 · May 16th, 2008, 07:33 AM

If you are using one of the "clothes Pin" capos.... lose it and get a shub or another brand that you can adjust the pressure.

guitarzan13 · May 16th, 2008, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bcbeak

FYI .. I'm using the Kyser quick change capo. Thanks!

Yup......those things suck on electric! They press to hard...

bad porcupine · May 16th, 2008, 07:34 AM

I'm no expert, but I would guess that you could try some heavier strings, or else loosen up the grip of the capo somehow... or try a different capo that doesn't have as tight of a grip?

wilkat1 · May 16th, 2008, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guitarzan13

Yup......those things suck on electric! They press to hard...

A capo with adjustable pressure is the way to go. Shubb is usually an excellent choice. Kysers are designed to have sufficient pressure to press down .013 strings and heavier on an acoustic - which is excessive for a set of .010s.

WallyArms · May 16th, 2008, 10:02 AM

Shubbs work well for me on electrics with careful placement... but you will still occasionally have to retune (or adjust the capo).

FirstBassman · May 16th, 2008, 10:04 AM

I agree with above ... Kyser better for acoustic ... Shubb better for electric. However also remember - one must re-tune after applying and taking off a capo if one wants to play in tune.
I know it's a pain but . . .

bcbeak · May 16th, 2008, 11:58 AM

Thanks ... for the capo suggestions .. I'll try the Shubb .. or others that I have found searching: Planet Waves, G7 Performance Capo.

FirstBassman .. are you saying that even with these, fine-tuning will be necessary? Seems to contradict the others and it really isn't feasible the way we call out the tunes.

If so, I'm back to having another guitar setup for that. Now if I could only get a roadie (who works for free) to set them up and hand them to me on stage (like all the big stars) .. that would be sweet!

esteban · May 16th, 2008, 12:04 PM

When retuning with a capo, do you leave the capo on and just tune? I tried it once, but got too paranoid about stress on the string from the capo and stopped...

guitarzan13 · May 16th, 2008, 12:10 PM

I almost never have to retune, but.... I am overly careful of the placement and pressure of the shubb.

bradpdx · May 16th, 2008, 12:54 PM

Using a capo on electric is easy IF the capo is properly adjustable.

The Shubb is a nice capo, but it requires that you set the force BEFORE you attach it to the neck - you must adjust the thumbscrew first. This makes fine tuning the force difficult.

My hands-down favorite on both acoustic and electric is the Victor capo now produced by Dunlop, though both of mine are pre-Dunlop versions. It is a simple "C clamp" that is 100% adjustable while in place on the neck.

To use it on an electric, just put it on and adjust the thumbscrew until it is just tight enough to fret cleanly. You will stay in tune, works like charm. I use these all the time on Tele and Strat with regular 10 gauge strings and never have to retune.

Capos provide a really nice musical effect that you just can't get any other way.

Colt W. Knight · May 16th, 2008, 01:00 PM

I gotta say Shubb capo as well. Those Kysers apply to much string pressure and go sharp. On acoustics using 13s, there not always strong enough to capo to proper pitch up the neck. Plus, the Kyser is prone to loose spring tension, and the one I have the strings actually wore out the rubber pad on the 6th and 5th string. Now when I use it I have to apply extra pressure to get it to clamp tight enough. I do not like Kyser Capos. Shubbs are great. When your not using them, you can simply slide them onto the nut where they are out of the way.

klasaine · May 16th, 2008, 01:01 PM

One of the gigs I do requires me to capo almost the entire gig at the 1st fret on electric - strat and LP with .011's. I use a Shubbs. There are 3 tunes that are non-capoed. Sometimes I do have to give a little yank on my low E and G after re-capoing or un-capoing. That's pretty normal though.

Colt W. Knight · May 16th, 2008, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by klasaine

One of the gigs I do requires me to capo almost the entire gig at the 1st fret on electric - strat and LP with .011's. I use a Shubbs. There are 3 tunes that are non-capoed. Sometimes I do have to give a little yank on my low E and G after re-capoing or un-capoing. That's pretty normal though.

When I use a shubb on my banjo, I generally have to retune the g string

FirstBassman · May 16th, 2008, 01:06 PM

To answer a couple of questions above –

If one must quickly change from one song to another and you’re playing loud raucous rock n’ roll, sure IMHO ya can sacrifice a little tuning for the perceived advantage of gig dynamics and flow.

Aside #1 – Kanter’s guitar tech retunes Paul’s capo’ed guitars between every change. Granted we all probably don’t have guitar techs on our payroll.

Aside # 2 – Just came from a workshop with bluegrass musician Pete Wernick who stated (unsolicited by anyone) “re-tune when applying (and taking off) a capo!”

As far as concern about breaking a string – as others above have said, the pressure on the Shubb is adjustable by using the screw. The capo should be just be tight enough to make the adjoining fret act as a nut. Not to squeeze dear life out of the strings. So, tuning with a capo on is entirely possible.

klasaine · May 16th, 2008, 07:28 PM

Yeah, I definitely DON'T over tighten my capo as you must be able to tune once you clamp it on.
A capo is something you have to learn to use effectively just like anything else.
It's just a tool.

gmann · May 19th, 2008, 11:22 AM

Also, if using a Shubb, make sure it has the proper radius. The one I use on my Gibsons have a 12" radius, on my Fender I use a Shubb with a 7.25" radius. One size does not fit all.

bradpdx · May 19th, 2008, 12:04 PM

Notes from the field:

This weekend I did a duo gig with a longtime singing partner. She has been using a Victor capo for a long time (as do I) and we are always in tune.

This weekend she brought a Shubb because the rubber on her old Victor was damaged. While the Shubb worked OK, every time she used it we were slightly out of tune - it reliably pulled her Martin guitar sharp by just a bit.

My Victor, on the other hand, left the guitar perfectly in tune.

+1 for the Victor design.

klasaine · May 19th, 2008, 12:25 PM

All capos use slightly different pressure and have different widths and thicknesses. You have to get used to "placing/positioning" each brand and style individually. They'll ALL be in a slightly different place. I also use as spares; Kyser and Victor (which is a Dunlop, I think?). They both work great and are equally as in tune, but I do have to position them differently than the Shubbs. I stick with the Shubbs because of it's size - specifically it's flatness - I put it in my back pocket or 'coin' pocket when I take it off.

Tim Bowen · May 20th, 2008, 11:01 PM

All I can figure is that I totally missed the bus when it comes to capos, and I've been using them for years. I use Shubb, Kyser, and Planet Waves for electric and acoustic standard and high-strung guitars, Kyser for mandolin. Doesn't matter how well-intonated and maintained my instruments are, how carefully I apply the device or where within fret span, doesn't matter as to matching radius or any of the other variables mentioned here - if I'm using a capo, I'm retuning for intonation. The Shubb is probably the most accurate as to intonation, but it's not dead nuts either. The bigger problem I have with the Shubb in general is plink and buzz, particularly on the A string of guitars. In any event, when I've properly tuned one of my instruments with a capo, it sounds fairly horrible with open position chords after the device has been removed, and subsequently needs to be retuned.

Anymore, I simply take the time I need between tunes when applying a capo, at least at bar jobs. For quickly paced shows in venues where this sort of down time (and it's not a lot of time, really) is a buzzkill, I use a dedicated capo-equipped guitar. I understand the quirks of how capos, my instruments, and me interact, and I really don't have a problem with it. My problem starts when somebody I'm working with slaps a capo on their instrument and doesn't check the tuning prior to launching into a song. At this point, all bets are off.

klasaine · May 21st, 2008, 12:32 PM

Lol! You haven't missed the bus at all. That IS the bus! It's not perfect.
Just like a beginner playing a barre chord or an inexperienced player playing a barre chord on a recording and hearing back how horribly out of tune there "perfectly intonated" guitar really is.
Whether one realizes it or not, a guitar player is, or should be, making CONSTANT adjustments to finger placement and pitch. I still notice that if I'm a little excited while playing a gig, especially if it's a loud gig and I'm standing, that I'll pull a barre chord out of tune from too much pressure.

May 16th, 2008, 07:26 AM	#1 (permalink)
bcbeak Tele-Meister Join Date: May 2003 Location: Newburyport, MA Posts: 189 6 Photos	Proper use of Capo Started a new gig with a female singer ... a need to capo some songs (Eb, etc.). I know ... I should be man enough to play everything without a capo .... but there are some licks and vamps that just work too well in the capoed open position. Anyway, my problem is that when I capo any of my electrics, the tuning is off (sharp) a bit in the lower strings. I've tried placing the capo at every spot within the fret and still get sharpness, the best result coming from tight up and straight against the higher fret. I never experienced this with acoustic guitars, and am worried that the pitch not working with the other instruments. Last year I played a gig and had to use the capo and the keyboard player flipped out. Are there any tips/techniques for using a capo on an electric? Is the only solution to keep a second guitar capoed and retuned? FYI .. I'm using the Kyser quick change capo. Thanks! __________________ http://www.myspace.com/leomelansonguitar

May 16th, 2008, 07:33 AM	#2 (permalink)
guitarzan13 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: LaGrange, GA Age: 43 Posts: 1,020 8 Photos	If you are using one of the "clothes Pin" capos.... lose it and get a shub or another brand that you can adjust the pressure. __________________ Practice make permanent!!!!....Perfect practice makes perfect!!! Chris B. Current Band www.productoffaith.net Last band as a bass player www.neonjones.com

May 16th, 2008, 07:34 AM	#4 (permalink)
bad porcupine Tele-Meister Join Date: May 2006 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Age: 47 Posts: 144 9 Photos	I'm no expert, but I would guess that you could try some heavier strings, or else loosen up the grip of the capo somehow... or try a different capo that doesn't have as tight of a grip? __________________ My loathings are simple: stupidity, oppression, crime, cruelty, soft music. -- Vladimir Nabokov

May 16th, 2008, 10:02 AM	#6 (permalink)
WallyArms Tele-Holic Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: TN Posts: 873	Shubbs work well for me on electrics with *careful* placement... but you will still occasionally have to retune (or adjust the capo). __________________ Save The Hymnals!

May 16th, 2008, 11:58 AM	#8 (permalink)
bcbeak Tele-Meister Join Date: May 2003 Location: Newburyport, MA Posts: 189 6 Photos	Thanks ... for the capo suggestions .. I'll try the Shubb .. or others that I have found searching: Planet Waves, G7 Performance Capo. FirstBassman .. are you saying that even with these, fine-tuning will be necessary? Seems to contradict the others and it really isn't feasible the way we call out the tunes. If so, I'm back to having another guitar setup for that. Now if I could only get a roadie (who works for free) to set them up and hand them to me on stage (like all the big stars) .. that would be sweet! __________________ http://www.myspace.com/leomelansonguitar

May 16th, 2008, 10:04 AM	#7 (permalink)
FirstBassman Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Virginia Posts: 808	I agree with above ... Kyser better for acoustic ... Shubb better for electric. However also remember - one must re-tune after applying and taking off a capo if one wants to play in tune. I know it's a pain but . . .

May 16th, 2008, 12:04 PM	#9 (permalink)
esteban Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Austin, Texas Age: 19 Posts: 1,078 3 Photos	When retuning with a capo, do you leave the capo on and just tune? I tried it once, but got too paranoid about stress on the string from the capo and stopped... __________________ When I die, they'll say, he couldn't play sh*t, but he sure made it sound good. - Hound Dog Taylor

May 16th, 2008, 12:10 PM	#10 (permalink)
guitarzan13 Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: LaGrange, GA Age: 43 Posts: 1,020 8 Photos	I almost never have to retune, but.... I am overly careful of the placement and pressure of the shubb. __________________ Practice make permanent!!!!....Perfect practice makes perfect!!! Chris B. Current Band www.productoffaith.net Last band as a bass player www.neonjones.com

May 16th, 2008, 12:54 PM	#11 (permalink)
bradpdx Tele-Holic Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Portland, OR Age: 49 Posts: 549	Using a capo on electric is easy IF the capo is properly adjustable. The Shubb is a nice capo, but it requires that you set the force BEFORE you attach it to the neck - you must adjust the thumbscrew first. This makes fine tuning the force difficult. My hands-down favorite on both acoustic and electric is the Victor capo now produced by Dunlop, though both of mine are pre-Dunlop versions. It is a simple "C clamp" that is 100% adjustable while in place on the neck. To use it on an electric, just put it on and adjust the thumbscrew until it is just tight enough to fret cleanly. You will stay in tune, works like charm. I use these all the time on Tele and Strat with regular 10 gauge strings and never have to retune. Capos provide a really nice musical effect that you just can't get any other way. __________________ ---------- Tech Geek and Sensitive Artiste String bender ordinare!

May 16th, 2008, 01:00 PM	#12 (permalink)
Colt W. Knight Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Wyoming Age: 24 Posts: 1,331	I gotta say Shubb capo as well. Those Kysers apply to much string pressure and go sharp. On acoustics using 13s, there not always strong enough to capo to proper pitch up the neck. Plus, the Kyser is prone to loose spring tension, and the one I have the strings actually wore out the rubber pad on the 6th and 5th string. Now when I use it I have to apply extra pressure to get it to clamp tight enough. I do not like Kyser Capos. Shubbs are great. When your not using them, you can simply slide them onto the nut where they are out of the way.

May 16th, 2008, 01:01 PM	#13 (permalink)
klasaine Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: los angeles, ca Age: 46 Posts: 1,189 3 Photos	One of the gigs I do requires me to capo almost the entire gig at the 1st fret on electric - strat and LP with .011's. I use a Shubbs. There are 3 tunes that are non-capoed. Sometimes I do have to give a little yank on my low E and G after re-capoing or un-capoing. That's pretty normal though.

May 16th, 2008, 01:06 PM	#15 (permalink)
FirstBassman Tele-Holic Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Virginia Posts: 808	To answer a couple of questions above – If one must quickly change from one song to another and you’re playing loud raucous rock n’ roll, sure IMHO ya can sacrifice a little tuning for the perceived advantage of gig dynamics and flow. Aside #1 – Kanter’s guitar tech retunes Paul’s capo’ed guitars between every change. Granted we all probably don’t have guitar techs on our payroll. Aside # 2 – Just came from a workshop with bluegrass musician Pete Wernick who stated (unsolicited by anyone) “re-tune when applying (and taking off) a capo!” As far as concern about breaking a string – as others above have said, the pressure on the Shubb is adjustable by using the screw. The capo should be just be tight enough to make the adjoining fret act as a nut. Not to squeeze dear life out of the strings. So, tuning with a capo on is entirely possible.

May 16th, 2008, 07:28 PM	#16 (permalink)
klasaine Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: los angeles, ca Age: 46 Posts: 1,189 3 Photos	Yeah, I definitely DON'T over tighten my capo as you must be able to tune once you clamp it on. A capo is something you have to learn to use effectively just like anything else. It's just a tool.

May 19th, 2008, 11:22 AM	#17 (permalink)
gmann TDPRI Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Okinawa, Japan Age: 54 Posts: 44	Also, if using a Shubb, make sure it has the proper radius. The one I use on my Gibsons have a 12" radius, on my Fender I use a Shubb with a 7.25" radius. One size does not fit all.

May 19th, 2008, 12:04 PM	#18 (permalink)
bradpdx Tele-Holic Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Portland, OR Age: 49 Posts: 549	Notes from the field: This weekend I did a duo gig with a longtime singing partner. She has been using a Victor capo for a long time (as do I) and we are always in tune. This weekend she brought a Shubb because the rubber on her old Victor was damaged. While the Shubb worked OK, every time she used it we were slightly out of tune - it reliably pulled her Martin guitar sharp by just a bit. My Victor, on the other hand, left the guitar perfectly in tune. +1 for the Victor design. __________________ ---------- Tech Geek and Sensitive Artiste String bender ordinare!

May 19th, 2008, 12:25 PM	#19 (permalink)
klasaine Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: los angeles, ca Age: 46 Posts: 1,189 3 Photos	All capos use slightly different pressure and have different widths and thicknesses. You have to get used to "placing/positioning" each brand and style individually. They'll ALL be in a slightly different place. I also use as spares; Kyser and Victor (which is a Dunlop, I think?). They both work great and are equally as in tune, but I do have to position them differently than the Shubbs. I stick with the Shubbs because of it's size - specifically it's flatness - I put it in my back pocket or 'coin' pocket when I take it off.

May 20th, 2008, 11:01 PM	#20 (permalink)
Tim Bowen Friend of Leo's Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Age: 47 Posts: 3,045	All I can figure is that I totally missed the bus when it comes to capos, and I've been using them for years. I use Shubb, Kyser, and Planet Waves for electric and acoustic standard and high-strung guitars, Kyser for mandolin. Doesn't matter how well-intonated and maintained my instruments are, how carefully I apply the device or where within fret span, doesn't matter as to matching radius or any of the other variables mentioned here - if I'm using a capo, I'm retuning for intonation. The Shubb is probably the most accurate as to intonation, but it's not dead nuts either. The bigger problem I have with the Shubb in general is plink and buzz, particularly on the A string of guitars. In any event, when I've properly tuned one of my instruments with a capo, it sounds fairly horrible with open position chords after the device has been removed, and subsequently needs to be retuned. Anymore, I simply take the time I need between tunes when applying a capo, at least at bar jobs. For quickly paced shows in venues where this sort of down time (and it's not a lot of time, really) is a buzzkill, I use a dedicated capo-equipped guitar. I understand the quirks of how capos, my instruments, and me interact, and I really don't have a problem with it. My problem starts when somebody I'm working with slaps a capo on their instrument and doesn't check the tuning prior to launching into a song. At this point, all bets are off. __________________ Can't say, 'cause I don't know. - Bullwinkle

May 21st, 2008, 12:32 PM	#21 (permalink)
klasaine Tele-Afflicted Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: los angeles, ca Age: 46 Posts: 1,189 3 Photos	Lol! You haven't missed the bus at all. That IS the bus! It's not perfect. Just like a beginner playing a barre chord or an inexperienced player playing a barre chord on a recording and hearing back how horribly out of tune there "perfectly intonated" guitar really is. Whether one realizes it or not, a guitar player is, or should be, making CONSTANT adjustments to finger placement and pitch. I still notice that if I'm a little excited while playing a gig, especially if it's a loud gig and I'm standing, that I'll pull a barre chord out of tune from too much pressure.