Strat tremolo arm looseness

[yoni162]

Hey,
I ran into some articles, as well as reading about this issue on Callaham's guitars webpage, and also on Suhr..
It's basically saying that it's not good to have the tremolo arm like it's usually set in the bridge, when there's this looseness, meaning the arm isn't really locked into place, you can wiggle it a bit without the bridge moving..according to Callaham this can potentially ruin it..he suggests (apart from, obviously, buying his bridge block) wrapping the part that screws in the bridge with teflon..this is also recommended by Suhr..have any of you here tried this?

[fezz parka]

Teflon plumbers tape does the trick. Been doing it to Strats for years....

[Mark Davis]

Thats the ticket.

When you look at the cross-section of the blocks at the Callaham site and see how the threaded end goes in and what the area looks like its easy to see why it needs a little help with a real thin layer of teflon tape.

[chickenpicker]

Whatever you do, don't do what I did to a 1979 stratocaster:

cut down the arm and welded on a piece of m6 studbar, then drilled out the block and tapped it to suit the new thread.

OK, it works much better, but with the benefit of hindsight )and eBay)...

[GTO]

A loose trem arm wears the threads in the trem block, and can even break them. Either way, if it starts off loose it can only get looser. The tape takes up some of the play in the arm and stops it rocking in the block, and thus stops the wear. The tape itself can wear though, and often needs replacing from time to time. In Fender vintage trems using the proper spring (instead of tape) in the bottom of the whole not only stops the arm rocking against the threads, but also helps keep it in position.

[Mark Davis]

Originally Posted by GTO

A loose trem arm wears the threads in the trem block, and can even break them. Either way, if it starts off loose it can only get looser. The tape takes up some of the play in the arm and stops it rocking in the block, and thus stops the wear. The tape itself can wear though, and often needs replacing from time to time. In Fender vintage trems using the proper spring (instead of tape) in the bottom of the whole not only stops the arm rocking against the threads, but also helps keep it in position.

All the trem block makers recommend not using the spring. Maybe is so they can sell more blocks LOL but here is what Callaham says.

This counterbore is also in American Standard blocks. The counterbore creates a tremendous stress riser on the first thread of the trem arm, the weakest section of the arm, because the arm is completely unsupported at the top of the block. The forces developed when using the trem are applied directly to the threaded section of the arm. It doesn't matter if the arm is made from high strength materials, it will eventually fail right at the first thread. The counterbore also reduces the leverage over trem springs. Fender arms also have significant play in the threads making the bridge very slow to respond and making subtle vibrato effects difficult. The Fender solution is a heavy spring in the bottom of the block. This spring causes the threads to gall and suddenly the arm is locked in the block and the only way to remove it is to break it off. Most people loss this spring without even knowing it, which is good. But trying to replace it is a mistake.

[yoni162]

Alright, teflon it is then..should I wrap it around the entire arm (the part that's going in that is), of just the upper part of the screw-y part?

[WickedGTR]

Just wrap the threaded portion....

I got the new Callaham bridge with the delrin insert, and their heavy duty talent lever, which is only threaded at the very bottom....very nice, and no looseness (yet).

[fezz parka]

Originally Posted by WickedGTR

Just wrap the threaded portion....

I got the new Callaham bridge with the delrin insert, and their heavy duty talent lever, which is only threaded at the very bottom....very nice, and no looseness (yet).

No slop in that one.

[GTO]

...............here is what Callaham says.

Yeah I know, you just have to look at all those vintage Strats with supposedly stripped trem blocks to see where Callahan is coming from. If there isn't a crisis that helps you sell stuff, create one!

Mind you, the design of the Callahan block is 'theoretically' better. I doubt that it translates into a more reliable block/arm combo than a properly used Fender block/arm, but it does most definitely cater for badly used and maintained trems, or 'the idiot factor'.

[CancerLeoCam]

I use the black spring things from Fender for my AmSe Strat and it's plenty snug for what you need, however I do like a bit of looseness to play. If I lose a block over it, I don't care. I'd just buy a $50 replacement many years down the road. Tires don't last forever either. Just play.

[ShortBuSX]

Wouldnt just a lil bit of Loctite work too?

[charlie chitlin]

Interesting idea.
Most Loctite dries and becomes brittle...or holds too tightly.
There is some stuff, though, that is made for assembly line-type operations that you can put on a fastener and use it any time in the next few months.
It's pretty thick and stays a little gooey.
They all have numbers, but I don't know the number...it may have a name with the word "fleet" in it.
I used to have a tube.

[yoni162]

Originally Posted by GTO

Yeah I know, you just have to look at all those vintage Strats with supposedly stripped trem blocks to see where Callahan is coming from. If there isn't a crisis that helps you sell stuff, create one! .

I was holding the same opinion, seeing as I've never heard of anyone breaking a thread in their bridge block..but as it turns out, seems like a lot of guys (according the the responses in this post) prevent this from happening..so I guess that there is some truth to the matter..

[lightice]

You mean the trem arm looseness would translate into breaking the block or arm?

Now thats quite serious, on the callaham site, it shows that the arm in the block is fully supported by 'bushing'. From the pictures it just seems like an extra layer that closes the gap between the trem block and the arm, thus supporting it all the way up to the trem arm hole at the top of the block.

Isn't that the same as wrapping the trem arm with plumber's tape all the way up to where it would fit inside the hole. This method also creates a support as with the 'bushing'. Just that its removable and replaceable when worn.

Any ideas?

[WickedGTR]

The Delrin material they use on the Callaham block is a very dense and durable nylon like material. It is fitted into the block and not replaceable AFIK.

I've busted of several arms in the past. And wore out the threads in the blocks. It does actually happen. Not all of those vintage strats have the original blocks in them, and not all vintage strat trems have seen much use.

Plumbers tape is much softer. I've used the plumbers tape many times to compensate for slack, it does work for a period of time, and it needs to be replaced occasionally, which is not a big deal.

At some point the only real cure is to replace the block, and the arm while you're at it.

I didn't buy the Callaham because of the hype. I like the quality of all of the parts I have gotten from them, and was not disappointed with the quality of every component of the strat bridge assembly.

[lightice]

Originally Posted by WickedGTR

The Delrin material they use on the Callaham block is a very dense and durable nylon like material. It is fitted into the block and not replaceable AFIK.

I've busted of several arms in the past. And wore out the threads in the blocks. It does actually happen. Not all of those vintage strats have the original blocks in them, and not all vintage strat trems have seen much use.

Plumbers tape is much softer. I've used the plumbers tape many times to compensate for slack, it does work for a period of time, and it needs to be replaced occasionally, which is not a big deal.

At some point the only real cure is to replace the block, and the arm while you're at it.

I didn't buy the Callaham because of the hype. I like the quality of all of the parts I have gotten from them, and was not disappointed with the quality of every component of the strat bridge assembly.

When you use plumber's tape, do you only wrap the treaded areas? Or the whole arm?

Can we increase the lifespan of the block by using tape on the arm even before the arm becomes loose?

Like for example bracing the entire arm that fits into the block with tape from the first time of usage.

But I always remove the arm when storing, so I think the tape would get worn out very fast from removal of the arm and reattaching it.

[WickedGTR]

Just wrap the threads....

I don't know if it will extend the life of the arm, but it certainly won't hurt it. I generally leave the arm in, even in the case, if possible.

[lightice]

Originally Posted by WickedGTR

Just wrap the threads....

I don't know if it will extend the life of the arm, but it certainly won't hurt it. I generally leave the arm in, even in the case, if possible.

Won't the arm break when placed inside a case?

My friend's trem arm snapped and left the stud inside the block, had to replace the whole block.

[WickedGTR]

I've been using a bag mostly....but never had one break in the case.

It's probably better to take it out. I'm from the 'drive nails with it all day long and it still plays in tune' school....I look at it as more of a hammer than a delicate instrument.

Replacing the block is not a big deal in this day and age. Parts are cheap, easy to find, and plentiful.