Let's do a Sharp dressed Strat.....

[Ronkirn]

Hopdy... I don't know what to tell ya... since you're alergic to the solvents, I would suggest ya farm it out. If I recommend something, and you have a bad reaction, and turn into a Barry Manilow clone, well I don't wanna get sued for bad info.

Were I you.. I'd really stay away from the spray room.

Ron Kirn

[Arlo]

I sent ya a box of 11 CD's and a DVD on the 3rd. Just looked at the delivery date and it said delivered on the 9th.

It wasn't much just a bunch of my old albums.

Me thinks it went to the wrong place.

I just called FEDEX and put a tracer on it.

No big deal I will make you another if they can't find it. Some lil ol lady is rocking out to Rattlesnake right now.

OR: She thinks she got a bunch of nice beer coasters.

[robt57]

Originally Posted by Arlo

No big deal I will make you another if they can't find it. Some lil ol lady is rocking out to Rattlesnake right now.

That is the oldest trick in the book, how many sets did you really send out Arlo??

Did she sign you when you did the follow up call?

[Beatbx]

Ron do you find excessive humidity a problem when spraying/drying finish? Great thread once again, and thanks.

[Ronkirn]

box of 11 CD's

Oh yeah.. I forgot about it... I put them in the car to listen to instead of Rush when I'm cruising around.... I just haven't been out in a few days...


Humidity... dammmm ... it ticks me off...... yep it really screws with lacquer.... down here I cannot spray until mid afternoon, and only then if the afternoon shower hasn't dropped...

Some days, I have prepped everything for a good day of squirting.... and I walk out... and the humidity has dipped all the way down to 93%.... grrrrrr..

Ron Kirn

[e-merlin]

Originally Posted by Ronkirn

Oh yeah.. I forgot about it... I put them in the car to listen to instead of Rush when I'm cruising around.... I just haven't been out in a few days...


Humidity... dammmm ... it ticks me off...... yep it really screws with lacquer.... down here I cannot spray until mid afternoon, and only then if the afternoon shower hasn't dropped...

Some days, I have prepped everything for a good day of squirting.... and I walk out... and the humidity has dipped all the way down to 93%.... grrrrrr..

Ron Kirn

Darn, Ron, I just noticed you're in Jacksonville! I used to haul there when I was OTR trucking. There are several big grocery warehouses and freezers there. I would haul pork down and orange juice back. Many's the night I spent in a truckstop there. If I had known, I might have given you a call.


I'm enjoying the devil out of this build, but it would have been even better to meet you in person.

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by Ronkirn

Oh yeah.. I forgot about it... I put them in the car to listen to instead of Rush when I'm cruising around.... I just haven't been out in a few days...

Cool, so you did get them.

[dougk]

That looks amazing Ron! You've confirmed in my head to stop and sand around the half way mark on my lacquer schedule. Everyone just says lay it on and on and do it all at the end but seems counter productive to me.

I didn't catch it but you said you were using sherwin williams dyes and such, are you using SW lacquer too?

[old_picker]

Originally Posted by hopdybob

@ronkirn
maybe a bit off topic but did you ever used danish oil to?
i am trying to find out a way to colour the wood and than use danish oil.
(why, because i am alergic to most of the solvent (i think one calls it that way in englisch)that are used in todays finnish products)

why dont you post this as a new topic?
dont want to hijack this thread
but i have tried alternatives to the smelly gut rotting nitro

[Ronkirn]

Cool, so you did get them

Yep... the FedEx guy came today to check to be certain.. I'll have to take a ride to listen to 'em.

but i have tried alternatives

Here's the deal on the multitude of finishes... if it's not commonly being used, it sux... there is something wrong with it. Most often it doesn't provide adequate protection, it wears off too soon. That's why I don't use tung oil, danish oil, or any of the "off the wall" finishing systems.

When a large manufacturer introduces a "new" finish, it's only for one of two reasons, either it speeds up the manufacturing process, or it's for marketing reasons. They aren't ever going backwards regarding finishing technology, ever...

Not that doesn't mean other finishing systems will not suit your needs, it's just that I build guitars to be around for a few years, and I want the finish to be there for the long haul.

Throughout the guitar's history virtually every type of finish has been tired, those that work well, are known, those that didn't are long forgotten as a bad idea.

If ya wanna do it right, then do it right, but if you want to experiment, have at that too, that can be a lotta fun too.

Ron Kirn

[hopdybob]

Originally Posted by Ronkirn

Hopdy... I don't know what to tell ya... since you're alergic to the solvents, I would suggest ya farm it out. If I recommend something, and you have a bad reaction, and turn into a Barry Manilow clone, well I don't wanna get sued for bad info.

Were I you.. I'd really stay away from the spray room.

Ron Kirn

never would sue someone giving advise, have to use my own head to, but thank annyway, learning a lot of your topics!!!

[hopdybob]

Originally Posted by old_picker

why dont you post this as a new topic?
dont want to hijack this thread
but i have tried alternatives to the smelly gut rotting nitro

good idea
so i started here
http://www.tdpri.com/forum/stratocas...h-guitars.html

[Ronkirn]

Strat 2-33

OK, back to the task at hand…. As I mentioned, I jumped on finishing the neck with out thinking. My wife will kindly remind ya, that’s not at all uncommon for me. So she’s all lacquered and ready for the fret leveling wet sanding and polishing….

This is what she looks like before the final assault.







Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

First thing, I remove the lacquer build-up from the frets. The tool is a screwdriver I reshaped the tip to cradle the fret, as I scrape the soft lacquer from the fret.



I use the fingerboard protector to prevent the inevitable slip…



Once the majority is removed, I go back gently scraping each edge of the fret.



I don’t have to be NASA clean room certified here, the fret leveling, and polishing will remove the remaining residue. Some will not remove the lacquer at all. But allow the fret leveling to “clean” the fret. I do not, because I feel that allows the lacquer to remain far to high up the edge of the fret. It will eventually separate, chip, and look rather messy.

Now I want to adjust the truss rod to bring the neck to as level a state as possible. Many often ask, why in heck do I level the frets on a brand new neck. Here’s the reason. When a fret is pressed into the wood, via any method, the fret encounters lumber of varying densities up and down the neck. To use “plucked from air” numbers, say it takes 10 pounds to seat one fret, it may only take 9.0876488344 pounds to set the next to exactly the same height, and the next may require 10.0000045899900 pounds to set that one. The point is, each one requires a different pressure. Therefore it doesn’t matter if you use a Fret press, Hammer and Caul, or whatever, it is impossible to regulate the pressure exerted to seat the fret exactly the same as the previous one.

Therefore once the neck is fretted, some will be microscopically higher or lower than the mean average. If you like very low action a fret leveling is paramount. As an example, if the 13th fret is .001 Higher (that’s 1/3 the thickness of one sheet of the paper you have in your trusty printer right now) than the 12trh fret, you will have to raise the action about 1/32 inch at the 12 th fret to keep the 13th from buzzing. That 1/32 is a bunch. Particularly if you like ‘em fast.

I always set the truss rod so the tension is pulling the neck to the correct setting as opposed to releasing the tension to do the same.



Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

Using a straight edge… thanks to Tom Osuch….I check to see which way to go..



Be certain to position the straight edge down the center of the fingerboard, the radius can throw ya wayyyyyy off.



And continue adjusting the truss rod until it is as level as possible. You almost certainly will not be able to get it “dead” level, that’s why we do the fret leveling..



If the last handful of frets fall away, this is not a problem. The trend today is to have the last several frets lower than the others to facilitate modern playing styles…



I’ll address that later….

Ron Kirn

[madmark]

You do beautiful work. Is the guitar sold already ?

[Ronkirn]

Oh yeah, the tape in that last shot is to hold the straight edge in place, darn near impossible to do when a camera is occupying one of my two hands..

Now secure the neck whatever method you choose, I run a wood screw through one of the tuner holes into the workbench after I have pressed the heel into a neck pocket and pulled it tight.



Now, I recommend taking a marker, and coloring each fret… this makes seeing what you are doing much easier… and you can fine tune you truss rod leveling…..



Place your leveling tool on the fingerboard and give it a shove, remove and check the marked frets… it the end frets have been scraped and the middle ones not, then tighten the truss rod a touch and repeat. Continue until the frets toward the center of the fingerboard are being “hit” too. Now re-coat all the frets with the marker, and recheck. If the majority of the frets show exposed metal from the fret leveling tool, you are ready to rock.

Now using your fret leveling tool.. oh… here’s how to make one……. Use any good flat material…. Corian is great, but plexi-glass (1/2 inch thick) works or MDF… cut you a strip about 2” wide by about 18” long….. then cut a second similar strip… glue, screw, or whatever it to the first in a “T” configuration. This makes it rigid. Now check it with something of known flatness. A cast Iron table saw table is perfect, but a piece of glass on a flat surface works too. Using spray glue, 3M-77 is what I use, glue a sheet of sand paper to the flat surface, now take the “T” shaped tool you have made, and run the working surface across the sandpaper until the entire surface has been sanded. That’s flat enough. Now using the 3M-77 glue a strip of something like 180 grit wet or dry paper to the tool and you are ready.


Now begin scrubbing the frets…. I use relatively short circular strokes allowing the tool to roll with the fingerboard radius. You will see the tops of the frets being exposed.



My tool is a machined piece of steel, with 180 grit shop cloth 3M-77ed to the working edge



Now, you continue until every fret has “SOME” of the crown exposed through the marker ink you applied.

[Ronkirn]

Sold?? yeah.. this one's headed Down Under....

Ron

[Ronkirn]

This is what you are looking for..



IF your neck has the last several frets falling away… that is lower than the rest of the fingerboard… take your fret leveling tool, press down on and over those last few frets from. Say. The 17th on… and level those. This will create a natural incline up to the 16th and lower…. If this is more advanced than you are comfortable with… try this… eBay is loaded with bunches of junk necks….usually under 50 bux.. buy one and learn on that….it will need plenty of work… and the money spent will save you bunches once you get the “hang” of leveling frets.

Why is this important? If you have ever picked up a guitar you thought you were familiar with, one that perhaps you have played other’s like it, and found it played, felt, sounded incredible…. It almost certainly was nothing more than a good setup which includes the fret leveling. A good leveling, crowning and setup will do more for your guitar than ANY other mod you care to mention. Ya just can’t see it. It’s not shiney, and it doesn’t have some artist’s signature on it, so it doesn’t get the respect its due.

If I were a playing professional, and a Genie popped out of the air and granted me one of these 3 wishes, either the most awesome pickups ever made, or the most toneacous bridge the “Gods” could create, or a first rate setup…. Guess which I’d go for…

Anyway…. ‘nuff of that….. once the frets are level.. let’s crown ‘em… a Crowning file is one tool you cannot make, ya cannot find something else and make do, you gotta go buy one… so do it…. I’ll wait….. Laaaa, Laaa, dooo, deeee, dooo, Hummmm Hummm*.. oh ya back, that was fast….

Watching the marks left by the sandpaper on the leveling tool, crown the frets…. Rocking the file to allow for the radius of the board…



If you’re good, or crazy, I’m not sure.. you can do it like above, risking scratching the fingerboard, or you can use the protector, as seen here,



Continue on each fret until the scratched from the fret leveling tool are ALMOST gone… just a faint hint should remain… do all the frets the same way..

They should all look like this…



Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

I make a habit of saving used sandpaper from about 300 grit to 500, I use it to rough polish the frets….



I cut ‘em in to small pieces, and give each fret a good going over… watching the reflected light off the crown to see when all the tooling marks are gone..



the tape above is to hold the proctor down while I took the photo with the hand that would normally hold the protector… this stuff is complicated ain’t it….

Once that is done, I move on to wet sanding the neck. I just use 800 grit here with mineral spirits as a wetting agent and a small, about 1 ½ inch square block..



I think I have mentioned this before, but there is a considerable difference among the various brands of wet or dry sandpaper. Some of the types available at your local hardware or Home supply store may be inferior to the good stuff, which is why the good stiff is called good… I use 3M Imperial, it cuts fast and lasts long….

I begin on the face of the headstock… wet it with your wetting agent of choice and give ‘er a go…



Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

As you’re wet sanding, keep checking, to see the progress.



In the shot above, you can see some areas are still glossy, the sand paper hasn’t broken the glaze yet. You will want to continue, sanding the entire surface, even what does look adequately sanded. You want to bring the entire surface down to the part that has not been touched..

Here you see a correctly sanded surface..



While I’m thinking about it….. it is not necessary to begin with 300, then advance to 400, then 500, 600, 800, 1000, 2000, 2,000,000… grit… once you have sanded to around 800 that’s fine…. I usually start with 600, follow up with 800 and begin polishing.

All the higher grits do is make polishing go a bit faster, at the expense of additional sanding, so you get to decide, more sanding, or more polishing. A finer grit paper will NOT guarantee a shinier gloss. That is accomplished with the polishing.

Compound curves and rounded surfaces can be done by hand holding the paper..



On the back of the neck, since it’s not a compound curve, I use the block again to “level” any surface ”Orange peal”. Then I’ll go over it all by hand, with 600 grit using very small circular motions, this gives the back the patina of years of playing. Once the areas of the neck that get polished are done, I give it a coat of good quality wax.. that way the neck feels as smooth as any well played instrument.



I hold it up in the light to see that there are no spots that have been missed..

Tomorrow…. I’ll polish it.

Ron Kirn

[B Valley]

I don't see any earlier reference to the neck in this thread. Do you build them or buy them from a supplier and finish them?
Also, where do you have the decals made?

[Ronkirn]

This one is a USACG


rk

[Ronkirn]

Now that the neck is all sanded, and ready to polish, I mask off the body of the neck, because I do not want that part polished. The matte surface that the sanding leaves feels much more like a well played neck than the sprayed satin finish used by most manufacturers. Sure I could do it that way, but the satin finish is achieved by introducing additives to the lacquer. Since I have made every effort to use the same lacquers used in the 50’s and 60’s I won’t be pouring additives into it. The sanding produces a vastly superior surface.







once the masking is complete, I charge the buffing wheel with polishing compound, and get to it..



If using any power buffing machine, you must be aware of heat buildup. The lacquer will soften and the buffing wheel will remove it in a heart beat so a balance between speed, pressure applied and how long you work a specific area is important. This is one of those “feel” things you just gotta get in there and do to learn.

Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

I just stay with it, constantly checking as I go until its as glossy as can be…



I do the same on the heel, then re mask and do the edge of the heel. Once that’s done I begin polishing the frets, I use several methods, depending on the neck, here I’m going over each with a cleaner car wax. It’s perfect because is will polish the fret and clean any residue from the base of the fret.



After the frets are polished, I’ll examine each closely and, using my scraper, remove any lacquer, that I may have missed. Then re-polish those frets.



that completes the polishing…

Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

At this point I’ll go over the neck closely, checking the frets, the fret ends, and the fingerboard edge; everything should be baby butt smooth.



Then I give it a good coat of a quality carnauba based wax..



The neck, will now have an organic feel, almost like it’s alive. Remember the skin on Betty Lou, the cheerleader when you played High School Football…. That’s the sensation ya get..

Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

Next phase… assembly



The Keys, nut and retainer is all that’s left. But the Sperzel keys have a 5/32 inch pin, I’ll be drilling a 7/32 hole, that doesn’t leave a lot of “wiggle” room, so accuracy is important.

First I ream the holes to clear out the lacquer buildup, I use a rotary file so there’s no chance of it grabbing and splitting the head,



once the holes are clear, I insert a key and give it s light tap to make an impression where the pin goes..



I do this in each of the 6 holes, then using an awl, mark the 1st and 6th.



Now I want to be certain all the holes are in line, remember I only have 1/64th of wiggle room.

Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

Now I take a straightedge.. and align it between the two all points..



I mark each location to insure they are straight relative to each other. I then take a caliper, dividers, or any precision instrument, and mark the distance from the hole edge to the location of the pin hole.



Mark each with an awl…



and drill away… Oh. Don’t go through..



this may seem a bit tedious but it gets the job done correctly. Sure Sperzel gives a cardboard template but it’s not exactly accurate.

rk

[Ronkirn]

It’s just a matter of pressing them in the respective holes and tightening the Ferrules.



not too shabby…



The nut slot needs to be cleared of any accumulated lacquer. I made a tool just to do this by grinding a sharp edge on the end of a file, it scrapes the lacquer from the floor and the sides quite precisely.



Once that’s done, I take the nut, bone in this case, and lap it on a flat surface to get the thickness down to the correct size..



Care must be taken, because it’s easy to apply more pressure on one end, with the resulting nut being thicker at one end than the other.

Continue until it’s a snug fit.

Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

Once it’s seated firmly in the slot, I take a pencil and mark a rough line indicating the top of the nut..



then over to the disk sander and a preliminary shaping, including the ends.



Now, it looks about like a nut should..



Now I take a nut slotting file and rough in the 1st and 6th string slots.



Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

This is one tool I find indispensable. The location of the strings should not be exactly symmetrical, this because they are different sizes, I’m betting you noticed…

I use an Xacto knife with the tip of the blade ground to etch each string location.



Then I highlight the marks with a pencil’s graphite..



and using the appropriate slot file make a preliminary slot for each string..



The nut will not be finished until I do the setup, at that time I will cut the slots to the correct depth, then remove any unnecessary height, and polish it.

Ron Kirn

[Ronkirn]

I now take a piece of string.. this is the Stewart McDonald guitar string retainer placement string, only 32.50 a foot… and wrap it around the 1st and 2nd key posts and across the nut to indicate the location of those 2 respective strings. Place the retainer on the strings, and mark the location of the pilot hole for the screw.



Drill the pilot hole, and coat the screw in bee’s wax… a good idea for any screw you will be running into hardwood.



Tighten the bugger down, not too tight…. The lacquer’s only 2 weeks old… and she’s ready for the body, which is still about a week away from the polishing…

Next up… the pickups and electronics…..

Ron Kirn

[e-merlin]

Originally Posted by Ronkirn

The neck, will now have an organic feel, almost like it’s alive. Remember the skin on Betty Lou, the cheerleader when you played High School Football…. That’s the sensation ya get..

Ron Kirn

So, that's why I get a beauxnre when I pick up a guitar...

[Vizcaster]

OK my wife was actually a cheerleader, but truth is none of us played football and we didn't meet cheerleaders unless we played in a band. Even at that you had the drummer to contend with...

Now my real reason for posting - Ron what rule of thumb do you use for the location of the low and high E strings? I tried using a small 6" Starret combination square with the beam set maybe 3/32 from the end, using that with the beam against the neck/nut and the file against the edge of the ruler to locate the outer string slots.

[Ronkirn]

I set the strings in usually about 7/64ths, not quite an eighth.. I've done it so often, I don't even have to look.

Often a guitarist will have a unique request, high E 9/64ths low E 1/16th.. I actually have pretty good eyes relative to dimension... calibrated by Starrett. and I make the marks with a razor knife, so I don't have to deal with a mark 1/64th wide.

This often has more to do with how a guitarists fingers hit the strings than anything else. Some will push up and into the neck, they can get away with the string right at the edge, others pull down and off the neck, they need more "landing space" a control tower and a ground crew is helpful too.
but for most about an eighth shy is fine.

Ron Kirn

[Doug Ferguson]

She's really shaping up, Ron. Beautiful! BTW, I like your method of cleaning, dressing, and leveling the frets. Going to start using it myself.

[Beatbx]

Ron do you do anything else to the fret ends, or is that addressed during 'rough polishing?'

[Ronkirn]

the fret ends,

Nah, all the attention the frets get polishes 'em naturally.... If someone wants 'em sharp, or way sloped, I'll do that when I'm prepping the neck for finishing.


rk

[boris bubbanov]

I think I learned more on thread # 95 than I have everywhere else all week.

And then there's # 104. Heck this is all worth its weight in gold!

Much obliged!

[Ronkirn]

Humm so how much does a digital image weigh???

rk