Blackstone Appliances Mosfet Overdrive

[Geoff738]

Originally Posted by Bill

Hi Geoff,

It sounds like you plugged the BAMO into two different solid state amps (Roland 120 and Princeton Chorus) and they didn't sound as good as the handmade tube amp (Swart) cranked up.

I'm not surprised. I think most folks (myself included on the amps I've used) prefer the overdriven sound of a tube amp to a SS amp for most situations. I've heard the BAMO can warm up a SS amp but I don't think it would work as well as going into a clean tube amp.

Did you try plugging the BAMO into the Swart set clean? Wonder how that would have compared to the other two amps with the BAMO.

Well, I didn't try it through the Swart that day, but did on a previous visit. Not in a band setting. The Swart's owner was/is checking into pedals so he can play it at lower volumes. He thought the Blackstone sounded ok, but still a bit pedalish - compressed, a tad 2-D maybe. We then plugged in his Dean Markley something or other (Overlord maybe) that had a tube in it. he preferred that. It certainly wasn't bad. He also had the Swart pedal which is designed to go along with the Swart. It didn't really float my boat. The Swart turned up sans pedals was just divine though.

I've played with the Blackstone at home a bit as well. Again, I like it. It sounds good, it's versatile. But does it sound as good as the "real thing" - ie a good cranked Marshall or tweed whatever? I don't think so. But at home I've been using it at fairly low volume, so that factors in as well.

So I should try and have a go at higher volumes and see how I think it hangs with my amps (AC15 and THD Univalve) natural distortion.

I should try recording with it too.

Maybe in the next month or two I'll get some time to do that.

Cheers,
Geoff

[nosuch]

Originally Posted by 4 Strings

Whoa! I tried my brand spankin' new BAMO very briefly this afternoon, and though it may in part be for the charm of novelty - I am the first to admit that - I must say that it sounds really promising. Just the BAMO, a tad of (Boss FRV-1) reverb and into the 5E3, vol set at a mere 9 o'clock. Fat, raunchy, and just plain old "oh how good t'is" bad!

4, could you do a recording with that rig, maybe some more touch-sensitive playing (than is on the vendors site) so we can hear the dynamics of that box?

[4 Strings]

Originally Posted by nosuch

4, could you do a recording with that rig, maybe some more touch-sensitive playing (than is on the vendors site) so we can hear the dynamics of that box?

Who? Me? Naaawgh...

Nosuch, I don't have the equipment to make a recording. But more important, I am too much of a ham-fingered home noodler for that. But nevertheless I appreciate your confidence.

If you check out Gearmanndude's BAMO review on u-tube you'll get an idea of its dynamics. But as stated above, the clips don't really do it justice. All I can say is that you don't get the feel of the feel of the pedal (clear, huh...?) from those demo clips. The box gets nasty if you dig in and it cleans up if you back up. This isn't all unique to the BAMO, of course. But unlike the very few other OD's that I have tried the BAMO feels less like an addition and more like a natural part of the tone and hence of my playing.

I should also say that I tried the BAMO with my cheesy Yamaha Twentyfive-112 combo (you're right, it's SS), in hope of finally getting a good tone out of that amp at neighbour friendly volumes. Let me just say that it didn't work. Where the BAMO worked wonders together with the 5E3 and a little reverb, with the Yamaha it simply didn't.

[Al Watsky]

If I relied on the clips I wouldn't have bought one .
I dropped the dollars cause' it sounded like a good bet.
Lucky this time it was.
I picked up a used Blues Jr. for a knock around amp the other day and
got curious a minute and plugged the BAMO into that with my current
#1 Tele and it does the trick , that trick being.
1. Clean Amp 2. Brown BAMO for Crunch 3. Red BAMO for Scream
Sounds good.
I have other amps. I don't claim that this Box sounds like a Tweed Deluxe on 12.
It has a pleasant sound and cleans up when you turn down the guitars volume.
The only odd thing I hear is that in unbuffered mode the decay of notes or chords is uneven. As the note is fading the level of distortion changes, perhaps due to the lowering of the voltage the pedal sees from the guitar.
Its less audible in the buffered mode.
Thats the only inorganic thing the pedal does.
It has personality, its a bit quirky, has a point of view.
When set to high gain setting on the Red channel it "surges" in an interesting way when sustaining tones, it gets brighter towards the end of the decay. Again a voltage drop thing. I guess.
I'll be happy to hear playbacks with this sound.
I could cut a record with it. No problem.
Its another good choice. This week.
Hey ! Its the last pedal "I" bought ! It must be the best there is, right ?
Ha !
Its real good though.....

[Bill]

One thing I noticed is that it's a little picky about batteries. As I recall the manual said standard alkaline batteries work best. Did you have fairly fresh batteries Al? Because I notice a really strong version of what you described when the batteries in my BAMO were going south. It makes me think you're on the right track about it being a voltage thing, maybe regardless of the state of the batteries.

[Guitar_Ninja]

I just took a peek at the schematic and it's definitely not a Tubescreamer. Has more in common with a Red Llama actually...

The name alone is actually quite cute once you take a look at the circuit.

[Al Watsky]

Bill,
Yesterday I was using a Boss wall wart. I'll try my voodoo labs today.
See what thats like.

[Tele-phone man]

Originally Posted by Guitar_Ninja

I just took a peek at the schematic and it's definitely not a Tubescreamer. Has more in common with a Red Llama actually...

The name alone is actually quite cute once you take a look at the circuit.

Where did you get the schematic? I'd like to see it.

[Guitar_Ninja]

It's at freestompboxes.org. You have to sign up to view the images though.

Or you can go to runoffgroove.com and check out the Double D pedal. It's basically the same concept.

[ac15]

I'm pretty picky about overdrives (don't like most of `em), but the Blackstone works great for me. I use it with a Gretsch Executive amp mostly. Cleans up great with the guitar volume knob and I only really use the brown channel set about half way.

[Durango Twango]

I can't think of a single gain pedal I've liked at bedroom volumes. Most are designed to work with a cooking tube amp. If you plug most OD's into a PA directly, they sound horrible. Maybe a touch better through solid state amps. Plug them in to a Twin at low volume and they sound a lot better, but still pretty much like a pedal. Plug them into a 40 watt amp or that same twin at band levels and they start behaving the way they're designed to and sounding brilliant.

The Blackstone really comes into its own at band volumes for my ears. It adds a nice fatness to a slightly cooked amp and really adds a touch of Marshall flavor. I don't think ANY pedal ever makes one amp sound like something else 100%, but in a mix it's very hard at times to tell the differences to any meaningful extent.

[afunkymonk]

Hi All - first post.

My Blackstone arrived today, prompting my first ever pedal shootout. The experience of doing this was interesting enough as it made me realise what a totally personal thing tone is.
I lined up all of the dirt boxes I had used in the last few years for gigging and set them all to what I thought was about a similar level of gain with no volume increase when turned on.
I set my blues junior (billm mods of course) for a nice edge of break up and let the pedals push it over.
pedals were:
Blackstone mosfet
Analogman KOT
Xotics AC Booster
Ibanez TS9 ('82 model with the good chip)

All sounded great in their own way, with the KOT coming out top for less 'blanket on the amp' and more dynamic feel. The AC Booster was very nice too, with a good range - more than the TS9 one trick pony, although I think the circuits are probably very similar. Blackstone sounded quite different to the others - more what I have in my head as a Marshall tone. The rest sounded like overdriven fenders, which I guess is what they were doing.

Then I set the amp for clean, lowish volume (vol3, master 6).

All but the Blackstone sounded thin, fizzy and less than impressive. The Blackstone sounded different to the previous test, but still very full and engaging.

I bought this pedal because most of the gigs I play in we use the house amps which are usually big SS jobs that do nice clean but gritty overdrive. I wanted the ability to channel switch between clean, crunchy rhythm and a overdriven sustaining solo. I originally bought the KOT for this purpose but was really disappointed with how it sounded live vs how it sounded through my own rig at home. The Blackstone however I have much higher hopes for on this first showing.

Sorry for the long post, I've been lurking long enough and I guess I must have saved up...

[4 Strings]

Hi Monk!
Welcome to the forum and congrats on the pedal!

[Bill]

Welcome afunkymonk!

Interesting to hear that the Blackstone was best of the bunch with a clean amp setting, as that's what I got mine for. Equally interesting is that the Blackstone might NOT be the pedal for me if I was going to plug into an amp that's already cooking. (A good reason to hang onto my other overdrive pedals.)

I have been looking to see if the technology has come along with a pedal that's even better for my clean amp uses. The two potential top of my list to try pedals have been the Zendrive and the King of Tone. So I thought the KOT might have done better than the Blackstone with a clean amp, but I guess not. So that's one pedal down I suppose. Thanks for your review. Now please buy a Zendrive and tell me how that sounds in a clean map compared to the Blackstone!

[Al Watsky]

Played a couple of shows with the Blackstone last week in Denmark.
Great pedal. Nothing but joy here.
Perhaps the best distortion device I've used with a clean amp.
My concerns about the note decay are gone.
On a stage it was nothing but smooth musical tone
I was using the buffered mode
Feels great ,sounds great
Very glad I laid the money down
No remorse here
I still dig my Full Drive and my old Rat but for a clean amp, the Stone rules.
Every thing else requires a tube amp verging on break up. This thing thrives on clean.
I made a last minute change at one show and had the crew put a Deluxe Reverb on stage rather than the HRD that they had up there earlier. I know Deluxe's and Twin's and just set it as I normally would, our sound man Stephan was on the board so it was easy.
I wanted the Tremlo and less watts. This was "after" the sound check, so it was a gamble.
I had my effects where I wanted them and knew I would be OK.
I have a solo in the first tune of our set and when I hit the Blackstone it was so right.
None of the crazy "distorto' buzzola'" jive. Just a cushy crunchy singing situation.
Very cool.
Props to Mr. Blackstone.

[11 Gauge]

Originally Posted by Guitar_Ninja

I just took a peek at the schematic and it's definitely not a Tubescreamer. Has more in common with a Red Llama actually...

Yep - absolutely correct. I just saw that I was being what looked like "kind goading" back on the 1st page of this thread - someone insisting that it's YATS, and it definitely is not.

The Mosfet Appliances is in the "CMOS inverter" family of overdrives. These include the following:

- Craig Anderton's Tube Sound Fuzz (the progenitor of most of them)
- Red Llama, Mule, other animals - basically slightly tweaked TSF above
- Electro Harmonix Hot Tubes V1 (this one and the Blackstone look similar)
- runoffgroove.com projects, such as the 3 Legged Dog, Double D, Ubescreamer, 22/7ths...
- Frank Clarke's Hot Harmonics
- Emma Reezafratzitz

Some of the above simply use the CMOS chip itself, like the TSF, Ubescreamer, and Emma Reez. But since the CMOS inverters are low gain, you can't really get a lot of drive without chaining them together, when used this way. The TSF and all clones only use 2 inverters. I believe that the Ube uses 5, one being a dedicated clean stage that bypasses the OD signal, a la Sparkle Drive. The Emma pedal uses all six inverters for maximum Marshall like OD tones. It's interstage circuitry is much more involved than the TSF, which is quite spartan.

The 3LD and Double D use a jFET booster stage to get more amplike characteristics out of the CMOS chip. And the DD is a two channel deal like the Blackstone, with both channels sounding really nice. And it has a jFET output buffer as well (the CMOS inverters have high output impedances and can load down the next device in the signal chain).

The V1 Hot Tubes (circa 70's), the Hot Harmonics, and the Blackstone all use an op amp stage to drive 3 CMOS inverters (the Hot Tubes may use more for EQ shaping). The Hot Tubes is the clear ancestor to this grouping. But the Blackstone certainly does some clever stuff by splitting the signal up into faux channels, where the gain and EQ can be addressed individually. And the low input impedance (sans input buffer on new models) is what makes it so dynamic.

Of worthy mention is Tim Escobedo. He is clearly a frontrunner and pioneer with all things CMOS related. But he's a bit on the fringe with some of his ideas, as he doesn't seem at all interested in traditional pedal designs.

So what is a CMOS chip? It's nothing more than a solid state logic switch - different voltages turn it on or off. But it's 6 inverters are comprised of multiple mosfet transistor circuits. And any F(ield)E(ffect)T(ransistor) has the benefit of sounding more amplike, since the electron interaction is indirect, making the gain and clipping softer and more dynamic.

T.M.I., but I felt like writing, explaining, and sharing what makes the Blackstone tick, and different from many OD pedals out there. Hopefully someone gets a little something out of this. If not, all apologies for the pedal geek speak...

[Durango Twango]

I like mine through both a clean amp and a moderately cranked amp. I just change the settings.