Noise gate

[Larry F]

My normal stomp box chain is Barber Tone Press, Blackstone Appliances, Maxon Delay, and BBE Sonic Stomp through a Champ with a Weber Minimass. I recently put a Bad Monkey after the Blackstone OD and like it a lot. I wouldn't use it a lot, since it is very wild. In particular, there is a lot of noise when I'm not playing, due to the high compressor settings that I'm experimenting with. I'm just having fun at home, so there's nothing major at stake here. Anyway, I'd like to cut off that noise due to the compressor because I pause a lot to write down what I am playing. I know I should play around with the settings, but right now I'm getting a good, fun sound. So I'm thinking about a noise gate. Any experiences with those?

Again, I know I can improve things by experimenting with the chain and settings, but I wonder how people find noise gates in these kinds of situations?

[kp8]

Originally Posted by Larry F

My normal stomp box chain is Barber Tone Press, Blackstone Appliances, Maxon Delay, and BBE Sonic Stomp through a Champ with a Weber Minimass. I recently put a Bad Monkey after the Blackstone OD and like it a lot. I wouldn't use it a lot, since it is very wild. In particular, there is a lot of noise when I'm not playing, due to the high compressor settings that I'm experimenting with. I'm just having fun at home, so there's nothing major at stake here. Anyway, I'd like to cut off that noise due to the compressor because I pause a lot to write down what I am playing. I know I should play around with the settings, but right now I'm getting a good, fun sound. So I'm thinking about a noise gate. Any experiences with those?

Again, I know I can improve things by experimenting with the chain and settings, but I wonder how people find noise gates in these kinds of situations?

You can usually score a DOD FX30B for low dollars. They are awesome and have a bunch of useful features. A kind of swiss army knife pedal.

I don't use noise gates... but i do use the FX30 for signal gating an other things.

Otherwise a vol. pedal might work for that application.

-kp

[bowman]

It's hard to beat the good old Boss NS-2. So simple: put your noisy stuff in the loop, and it's not noisy anymore. My live sound, because of the volume we play at, would have a constant wall of hiss without the NS-2.

[klasaine]

I'm a fan of this one ...
http://www.isptechnologies.com/decimatorproducts.htm
It's really not too different than the Boss NS-2.
Tim Bowen shipped me his ns-2 to compare and they performed virtually identically with my gear.
I use mine at the beginning of my chain to quell my single coil p'up noise - the biggest offender - which in turn quiets ALL my OD's.
I chose the ISP frankly because I got a deal on one. It is built like a tank.

[Jenix]

I disagree with the lot rootin for the ns-2. I found it sucked alot of tone and changed how my pedals sounded. Alot of people complain how it takes alot of the highs away.

When I was shopping for one it came down to Electroharmonix hum debugger or ISP decimator and I went with the decimator. The hum debugger only has two settings as to the isp has a knob. I pretty much just turn it until the noise goes away.

You need to find out what is causing the noise because some noise pedals perform better in other areas. The NS-2 is best with the fx loop send and return and the isp is better at the front of the chain. I think I've seen the ehx hum debugger at the end of the chain more.

My only complaint with the ISP decimator is when its turn on and I'm not playing its dead quiet but a little bit of the noise comes back when I strum a note. Not really that noticable but worth mentioning.

Good luck, check out the rocktron unit that just came out as well.

[fivenote]

Originally Posted by Jenix

My only complaint with the ISP decimator is when its turn on and I'm not playing its dead quiet but a little bit of the noise comes back when I strum a note. Not really that noticable but worth mentioning.

That's pretty much the way the noise gates work. When you're not playing, the gate is closed and all noise is blocked. When you play, the gate opens to let your sound through, but also the noise. When playing with high-gain (the case when you most need the noise gate), the "bad" noise gets lost in amongst your "good" noise, and everybody's happy.

If you have significant noise in low-gain settings, then you have another issue with your gear. The noise gate won't help much since it lets that noise through when you play, and it's more noticable.

That said, I use the MXR SmartGate. Works fine. I don't notice any "tone suck" when its on.

[bowlfreshener]

I like the NS-2, but I guess they aren't for everybody. But I figure if Yngwie uses one, then its good enough for me...LOL, Just kidding. My decision to use the NS-2 has nothing to Yngwie, but all because it does what I needed something to do. I do find that you have to take some time to find its "sweet spot" otherwise there may be some minor "squashing" issues. And technically the NS-2 isn't a noise gate, but a noise suppressor.

[msteurbaut]

Originally Posted by klasaine

I use mine at the beginning of my chain to quell my single coil p'up noise - the biggest offender - which in turn quiets ALL my OD's.

Interesting. Why not at the end of the chain?

[Jenix]

Originally Posted by msteurbaut

Interesting. Why not at the end of the chain?

if your noise starts with your pickups then every od or overdrive magnifies it. At the end of the chain theres alot more noise then at the beginning and alot more work for the gate to do which equals higher settings and more damage to your tone

[klasaine]

Originally Posted by msteurbaut

Interesting. Why not at the end of the chain?

My pedals are all quiet and I don't really play with a ton of gain. My only unacceptable noise issues are with my single coil axes in situations with 'dirty' power. Hence, at the top of my chain. I just want to reign in the buzz from my guitar. If a different situation arises with a noisy pedal I'd probably place it at the end(?).

Also as to the tone suck or tone change of the the NS-2. I auditioned both the Boss and the ISP and found that the Boss did "very slightly" attenuate the top end. But I actually liked what it did in my rig(?). The ISP does too - just differently. If and when I have to buy another gate I'd probably go for the Boss as it has more in and out options.

[bowlfreshener]

Originally Posted by klasaine

I'm a fan of this one ...
I use mine at the beginning of my chain to quell my single coil p'up noise - the biggest offender - which in turn quiets ALL my OD's.

Thats how I use it at times as well...

[bowlfreshener]

Originally Posted by klasaine

Also as to the tone suck or tone change of the the NS-2. I auditioned both the Boss and the ISP and found that the Boss did "very slightly" attenuate the top end. But I actually liked what it did in my rig(?). The ISP does too - just differently. If and when I have to buy another gate I'd probably go for the Boss as it has more in and out options.

I've noticed this as well, but always just figured it was the top end just sounding like it should since some of the noise is being suppressed...

[klasaine]

Originally Posted by bowlfreshener

I've noticed this as well, but always just figured it was the top end just sounding like it should since some of the noise is being suppressed...

Excellent point!
I feel that a little of the "sound" of single coils is their somewhat noisy top end. I hate all noisless singles and I really don't even really like that new Suhr (essentially a type of 'dummy coil') system for that very reason ... a little of the single coil "sound" IS the noise.

[Tim Bowen]

What I hear with an NS-2 engaged is a very slight bump in the mids. The ear could easily perceive this as attentuation in the highs, or maybe it's vice-versa. Either way, we're talking nitpicking of the borderline infinitesimal variety here, especially in a live setting. If the NS-2 is 'on all the time' (as I use it, other than as a master mute switch), then any needed EQ compensation is a quick and easy fix. I don't get on with noiseless singles either. Any time noise is suppressed, there's some degree of compromise involved. For whatever shortcomings the NS-2 has, I wouldn't go back to the 60 cycle hum fiascos that I endured prior to its employment, for all the tea in China.

[JohnSS]

For my money, best Noise suppression unit has been the Rocktron Hush II. No discernible coloration of sound, and I even used it in my signal chain when mixing analog tape signals and MIDI info to PCM F1 and DAT stereo masters.

[tazzboy]

Sorry for hijacking your thread Larry F But I am curious to know if any one has try the Boss NF-1 Noise Suppressor? I have seen a couple of these on Music-Go-Round and was wondering what people thought of them?

[Tim Bowen]

Originally Posted by tazzboy

I am curious to know if any one has try the Boss NF-1 Noise Suppressor?

I've used one. More later.

Originally Posted by bowlfreshener

NS-2 isn't a noise gate, but a noise suppressor.

I'm not qualified to say what the difference between the two is, but there's definitely a difference in my experience. The BOSS noise suppression circuitry (NS-2; discontinued NS-50 half space rack unit) claims to use a "high speed LFO envelope", maybe that's the difference, who knows.

Anyway, I auditioned a bunch of (at the time) studio-quality noise gate rack units in my live electric guitar rigs from about the mid 80's to the early 90's. The deal with a traditional gate is that if you set it to tame the noise for your higher gain settings, it will chirp and chatter and pump and breathe with your lower gain settings. After screwing around with gates for a while, I tried a variety of the Rocktron Hush units; these did not have the typical gate chatter, but they destroyed my high end and presence, so those were a no-go. Tangent: as I understand it, the ISP Decimator was designed by the team that developed the Hush circuitry. I've not personally played the ISP ped, but reports are overwhelmingly positive, so I have to speculate that it sounds and responds differently than the Hush units I played.

After the gates and the Hush unit gig benchtests, I happened upon the BOSS NS-50 half-rack unit, and later, the NS-2 stomp. Here at last was a unit that would tame my single coil noise and gainer hiss without stomping all over my base tone, dynamics, and sustain, regardless of gain settings derived from other sources. Sold. That's what I settled in with, and have been using ever since.

Back to the NF-1. I used it at a club gig years ago. I set the sensitivity to deal with my highest gain settings, and I remember going to a clean tone for a cover of the Moody Blues' "Nights in White Satin", and the circuitry clipped my signal to the point of embarrassment. It's a gate, not a suppressor.

[franchelB]

I don't use a noise gate for a guitar because I have an effects loop in my Peavey Delta Blues. I do use a compressor "in front" so there IS a bit of noise, but not enough to bother me. I do use an old 1/2 rack mount Boss RCL-10 in the effects loop for my bass rig though.

Anyway, a noise gate might not be a bad idea if you don't have an amp with an effects loop.

[eugenedunn]

Hey Larry,

Even though your post is old, I thought I'd revive this thread 'cause I have a similar pedal setup where I began to see a need for noise reduction......

I play an American Nashville 3-pickup Tele B-bender a lot. Put a Lollar P90 in the neck position which is beautifully fat and sassy.... however in the that position or other positions where there's no hum canceling, the 60-cycle buzz is BAD.

Likewise, my guitar plugs into a Barber Tonepress, then a Bixonic Expandora, then a Bud Wah, then envelope filter, then tremelo, then delay, then Peterson tuner, finally into the front end of my Allen Old Flame head.

Because I leave my compressor ON all the time, sometimes the buzz is loud.... and if my distortion box is on....Wow. Anyway, the best solution I've found is the ISP Decimator pedal. Works as an "smart" noisegate. One knob and seems to not mess with your sustain...PROVIDING you don't overdo the noise suppression. Because of the nature of all noisegates, you really have to play with it a bit to find the absolute minimum suppression setting. Once you get there, you might hear just a hair of noise, but it is really tolerable compared to the untreated sound.

Now I can have the compressor on, distortion maxed, my amp maxed with very little noise when not playing.....and my sustain is pretty much all there. I think the key is to place the Decimator right after the compressor and distortion....BEFORE the delay and modulation effects.

If you put the pedal and the end of the chain or in the effects loop (like ISP recommends), you might truncate the delay or reverb sustained trails.... I think that would be more unnatural..... Ok my two bits. I recently paid 129.95 new from Guitar Center..... works out to be $140 with tax. I think it's worth the supremely quiet & peaceful atmosphere.....and you won't believe how loud your amp is when you start playing..... I have to check to see if my amp pilot light is on sometimes.

[Astro1176]

I am a fan of the Boss NS-2 for 2 reasons - because of the loop and because it is not true bypass.

The loop is important if you use a lot of compression and/or distortion pedals. Both of these pedals reduce the dynamics of the signal, amplify the noise of the guitar, and sometimes add their own noise too. Any noise suppressor has to figure out the difference between a note or sound you intend to make, and what is the unwanted signal. They generally do this by assuming the notes you play are louder than the unwanted noise. If you put the gate after the compressor and distortion - the difference between the noise and the notes is small, so the noise suppressor may seem unreliable. If you put it before the other pedals, it won't cut off the noise introduced by the other pedals. The loop lets you have your cake and eat it - it senses the noise from the guitar before the pedals, but cuts it off after the pedals, cutting their noise too. Doing it this way also lets it cut the signal in a more natural way.

With true bypass pedals I have tried (eg the Hush) - if you turn the pedal on or off during a note, you can here a clunk as it switches between the impedance and sound of the direct guitar to the buffered and processed sound of the circuitry. This is a deal killer for me - I want the sound of it on and off to be the same. Why would I want to turn the suppressor on and off during a note? If I am hanging out a long note, maybe with a touch of feedback, its great to be able to turn the suppression off, and then click it back in for the choppy stuff.