Thinking about building recording space in basement

[GhostofJohnToad]

Well, after doing a few construction projects around the house I have gotten up some confidence and I think I want to tackle putting in a room or two for studio/recording/playing stuff. I have mostly a whole basement given I can't use certain areas(washing machine, dryer, furnace, etc). That's the background...

So I have been reading some on the internet and have found a LOT of conflicting information. I want some decent info for the DIY'er regarding materials, wall construction caveats, sound proofing etc. I definitely don't have a lot of money and will doing things here and there where I can. Any good books or sites that are "sound" in real world examples and practical?

[mudbean]

What's the current finish status of your basement, also, how high is the ceiling?

mud

[woodman]

there have been several useful threads here on the Recording forum ... if you dig backward, you'll find the benefits of many others' experience. i converted an 8 by 15 foot room with modest success, but many others have taken it further.

[GhostofJohnToad]

Basement is currently unfinished with a little over 7 foot ceilings. House was built in 1917.

[woodman]

noticed you mentioned soundproofing in the original post. is that a priority, or did you mean extensive sound conditioning?

[elmerbumpkin]

best of luck to you, I hope you're able to design and build what you're after...we added a nice 'music' room as part of an addition recently, and having a dedicated music space is a great thing, and something I've worked towards for some time...

that being said, you might poke around this Recording Studio Construction Forum. Looks similar to the TDPRI as far as different topics/forums related to building a recording studio. Pretty heavy on the 'professional' studio model, but alot of the audio principles are the same. Good luck!

[GhostofJohnToad]

Originally Posted by woodman

noticed you mentioned soundproofing in the original post. is that a priority, or did you mean extensive sound conditioning?

I guess I was thinking of making it quieter for those who might not want to hear me repeating things over and over. I guess that's not a huge priority, but I wouldn't mind keeping this in mind, as I am going to build the room and wouldn't mind having a little forethought, unlike every other time in my so called planning stages.

[woodman]

if it's a raw basement with the upper floor joists visible, it wouldn't be that hard to deaden it to keep the sound out of the rest of the house. are the neighbors a problem, or are you underground enough not to worry about that?

it's good that you're thinking ahead. since you're in no hurry, you can take one phase at a time ... like maybe the ceiling being a priority, get that taken care of, then think about your corners, or your wall treatments, or whatever. 7-foot ceilings aren't ideal -- i know this because the Woodshed has a 7-foot ceiling -- but i'd sure rather have a music space with 7-foot ceilings than no music space at all!

keep us posted as to your plans and progress, i'm sure plenty of people will jump in with (hopefully low-cost) ways to proceed.

[GhostofJohnToad]

Originally Posted by elmerbumpkin

best of luck to you, I hope you're able to design and build what you're after...we added a nice 'music' room as part of an addition recently, and having a dedicated music space is a great thing, and something I've worked towards for some time...

that being said, you might poke around this Recording Studio Construction Forum. Looks similar to the TDPRI as far as different topics/forums related to building a recording studio. Pretty heavy on the 'professional' studio model, but alot of the audio principles are the same. Good luck!

Dude! There is some incredible information on that site. It is pretty much the cat's pajamas on the subject. Thanks for the link. I figure by the time I have digested everything there we'll be settling on Mars and making teles out of meteorites.

[monetmelly]

basement is usually a terrible place for a studio because of concretewalls and standing waves

[idylldon]

Your biggest challenge will be the low ceiling. There are some great books out there, but these have some excellent info:

http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&sear...Gervais&page=1

http://www.amazon.com/Sound-Studio-C...4057328&sr=1-2

Cheers,
--
Don

[nicnite]

Good sites mentioned. Also check out Ethan Winer's site:

http://realtraps.com/info.htm

He is selling stuff, but he's also a very helpful and smart guy when it comes to acoustics and provides tons of useful info that in no way suggests buying his stuff.

A few general points:

-- Sound-proofing and acoustic treatment are entirely different issues. May seem obvious but lots of folks seem to confuse the two.

--Soundproofing is accomplished by:

)Closing all air gaps--tons of sound escapes through cracks under doors etc. Special treatments are available or can be constructed for AC ducts.

2) Where possible, isolating walls/floors/ceilings from structure. The extreme example is building a "box within a box", but even smaller efforts in this direction are helpful (floating a drum riser for instance).

3) Using the most dense, thick materials possible to prevent sound transmission. Foam is NOT an effective insulator of sound. Concrete is! Layers of sheetrock are better than layers of plywood. Layers of plywood are better than thin glass (cover windows). It's all about max. density and thickness.

4) Discontinuous materials transmit less sound. In some cases, for instance, two thinner sheetrock walls with an air gap between them is more effective than a single thicker wall. A double door with an air gap in between the doors is often better than a single thick door.

Acoustic Treatment:

Making a room sound "good" is an inexact science, and also partly subjective.

Typically in a live room (for tracking actual instruments) you want some reflectivity (ambience), some absorption (so it's not TOO live), and some diffusion which, by complicating reflection, creates a sense of more "space."

You maintain reflectivity by leaving some exposed hard surfaces (concrete or wood floors), hard walls/ceilings.

You control the reflectivity of higher frequencies with absorbent materials: foam, carpets, curtains, and soft furniture.

You achieve diffusion with specially designed surfaces called diffusors. These are a bit hard to build and expensive and you can probably get by without them. But if you want to make a very low ceilinged room sound a bit less "cramped" diffusion on the ceiling will help.

You also want even bass response which is a big problem in rooms with parallel walls and ceilings. In such rooms standing waves develop, especially at lower frequencies. These cause bass response to vary radically from one spot to another. This is a problem both in terms of mic placement, but also in terms of judging sounds as you set up to record. A "muddy" sounding room is also usually a problem of excessive bass build up in some parts of the room as well as excessive reflection of low-mid freqs.

You control bass response with bass traps of various kinds: devices that absorb well at bass frequencies. Such devices can either be specially designed (Helmholtz resonators) which you can build, or heavier types of absorptive material (rigid fiberglass insulation panels), placed especially in corners where standing waves develop most readily (due to the fact any incident wave in a corner is reflected back out at the same angle).

Depending upon your sonic tastes and your room, you may find it doesn't need treatment at all. Probably best to do some recording in it before you invest in much treatment since you need to know how it sounds and what, if anything, you want to change.

A typical basement studio will generally benefit most from some broadband absorption--for instance panels of rigid fiberglass (not Auralex type foam) mounted across corners or standing off a couple inches from walls and ceiling. Such treatment will absorb some bass and the critical low mid "mud" frequencies. If you do one thing for acoustic treatment this is probably the thing to do.

Auralex foam is fine for reducing reflection of higher frequencies (deadening a room) but it does very little for low mid and low frequencies. It's expensive too, though it is fire retardant which some cheap foams aren't.

If you have a separate control room, you want to try and treat that for a very even freq. response across the freq. spectrum, and a minimum of reflection. Such treatment makes monitoring and mixing easier. With nearfield monitors, the room is much less of a factor in mixing, though it can still play some role.

Ok, probably more than you wanted to hear! Hope it's helpful.

Just Nick

[octatonic]

I've built my own studios from the ground up on a couple of occasions- it is a big job but worth it if you have some DIY skills.

Planning is everything.

Are you wanting heating/air conditioning?
Will you have a machine room?
Do you want a separate control and live rooms?

You ideally want to avoid 90 degree angles- float the ceiling and the floor so they aren't parallel to one another (the floor needs to be flat obviously, but the ceiling should slope, at least 5 degrees).

This is a huge topic- but I am happy to contribute- I've done this enough times that I've made pretty much all the mistakes you can make.
The last time I did one it was pretty much ideal- from room dimensions to how I lay the audio and power cabling in the floor and the walls.

Give me a bit more of an idea of the space and I'll try to help.

BTW- 7ft is pretty low- I'd shoot for 10ft ceilings if I was you, but you can get by with 7- floating the ceiling and the floor probably won't work though, unless you are a midget.

[woodman]

Originally Posted by octatonic

BTW- 7ft is pretty low-

too true! the Woodshed has a 7-footer and it won't contain much sound. makes it hard to track a guitar amp at gig volume due to sheer din, and when i mix, i have to keep the monitor volume fairly low to get any sort of true picture. it helps to deaden the ceiling above the spot where you sit to mix.

[GhostofJohnToad]

I thank you for all the good advice but I think with the 7 foot ceilings it's going to be tight. I'm only 5'8" so for me It would kinda work, but I just don't know. I'm only planning it to be for me, but most of my friends are my height as well.

As far as what I envision...
1)I really just want it to be a one room studio. I'll build something more elaborate my next house around. This is too get my feet wet and just get a space.
2) Heating and air conditioning - not really. But it would be easy to bring in if I need to as there is a vent coming off the ducts that I could easily tie in.
3) Probably float the floor, not the ceiling. Just put some rockwool in the spaces between the beams and something thin over top or maybe incorporate the beams to give it a rustic look?
4) doesn't have to be dead quiet just fairly ok. Won't ever be a full band in there. Loudest things will be vocals and my guitar amp.
5) Room dimensions are still being thought of...

[octatonic]

Originally Posted by GhostofJohnToad

I thank you for all the good advice but I think with the 7 foot ceilings it's going to be tight. I'm only 5'8" so for me It would kinda work, but I just don't know. I'm only planning it to be for me, but most of my friends are my height as well.

As far as what I envision...
1)I really just want it to be a one room studio. I'll build something more elaborate my next house around. This is too get my feet wet and just get a space.
2) Heating and air conditioning - not really. But it would be easy to bring in if I need to as there is a vent coming off the ducts that I could easily tie in.
3) Probably float the floor, not the ceiling. Just put some rockwool in the spaces between the beams and something thin over top or maybe incorporate the beams to give it a rustic look?
4) doesn't have to be dead quiet just fairly ok. Won't ever be a full band in there. Loudest things will be vocals and my guitar amp.
5) Room dimensions are still being thought of...

Hiya,

My thoughts - in response to your points above.

1. Cool.
2. HVAC is a BIG deal. It adds $15k to a build. Period.
3. Good plan- although you want to float some bass traps on the ceiling above your mix position.
4. Dead quiet isn't ideal for a mix room in terms of acoustic treatment.
If you are talking about isolation, good- complete isolation is virtually impossible on a reasonable budget.
6. Go to Ethan Winer's site- he has a PC app that can give you ideal dimensions for a 7ft ceiling.

My second to last room was an 8ft ceiling- I managed to mix 1/2 a dozen records in that room; it can be done.

Also look at John Sayers site http://www.johnlsayers.com/
It is an excellent resource.

Seriously, this is an undertaking- the cheapest I have spent on a studio is $4k in materials alone but that includes tools.
You need a table saw, mitre saw, a couple of good drills, various other tools.
(I did built an entire studio with a hand saw and hand-drill- I wouldn't recommend trying it yourself).

You need a good friend who won't ***** when you ask him to help you to hang drywall- it is impossible to do alone, at least on the ceiling.

Make sure you use a mask when laying the rockwool in the walls and ceiling- you don't want to breathe that sh*t into your lungs.