SD Broadcaster or VZ True Vintage?

[tkingen]

Anyone have experience with both of these pickups? Is there much difference between the two?

Thanks in advance.

[bluesation]

Originally Posted by tkingen

Anyone have experience with both of these pickups? Is there much difference between the two?

Thanks in advance.

i had both. because of the dislike i had them in only a short period of time, and it is a long way back. but what i remember:

i didnt like any of them. the sd is to thin sounding for my ears, even it is named here often as favorite. it has les bass, and all in all lifeless. i remember, right after getting the broadcaster out i threw the the SD 54 in again. a A/B comparisson you can say. There were tons of more sparkle, massive tone, muscle. what speaks for it is the reasonably price.

the vanzandt is a good pus, sure. but for me it is a pu that stands for nothing. it is said that it is a 50's replica, but this is said about many pus out there, but they all sound different. the VZ is a rather boring pu. it has no strength or weaknesses, it sounds not to bright, nor to muddy. it has a growl but not much, it has some mids. it is ok, not more not less. but for my opinion
it is much to expensive.

general statement: I think there is to much hype about all these boutique pu winders, the widely known ones (Fralin, Barden, Kinman, Suhr etc) and the garage winders. I had pus from winders here in Germany (Haeussel.com, Leosounds, Barfuss) and international winders like VanZandt, Duesenberg, Rockinger, Lollar etc).

What i like most after a long time periofd of seek the sound (tele and strat) is the Dimarzio Twang Kings and Fender OV 52 (you get the nancy sound with it, who is Don Mare?) and the stock pus for Squier JV strat. I dont speak about P90 and humbuckers here.

The small differences between the good pus can be simply compensated by using another pick*, another stroke technique, (down) tunings, strings or only the equalize section at the amp.
(*Go to your Guitar store get some different picks and do a test. You will hear the big changes that using a different pick can have. You will be surprised.)

So i say: get a PU that suites your taste (50's,60's, blues, country etc) from a major company (Fender, Duncan, DiMarzio). get it used (saves money) and be happy. And remember: The Sound* is always in your hands, and these cant be changed.

*One more surprise: some times ago i recorded the same riffs and chord progrssions with all my guitars: single coils, P90s, humbuckers. I used same amp settings for same riffs. then i didnt hear the recordings for some month. after that i got my player in random playing mode. And i was surprised about the small sound differences of the recordings to the fact that they were played with different guitars. the higher the overdrive/distortion was the smaller became the differences, and i did no high gain, only clean, low and medium gain. with some recordings i was not abel to say what guitar is it (e.g. single coil neck recordings). and thats to the fact i am playing some of the guitars over 25 years. For me the evidence that the sound is in my (your) hands.

[jumpnblues]

bluesation,

I think you've made a pretty honest assessment based on your personal experiences. I wish I could afford to buy about one of everything and try it to see what the real truth about pu tone is. I'll have to admit to being a bit of a boutique p.u. snob. I have VZ's and Lollars in my Strats, A&F's (Alan Hamel and Fred Stuart) and Lollar in my USACG Tele, three Lollar P-90's in my Gibson Switchmaster and two Lollar P-90's in my Epi '56 Les Paul Goldtop.
I haven't owned anything with either stock or "production aftermarket p.u.s" (eg. Duncan, Dimarzio, EMG, etc.) for more years than I can remember. I have a set of Don Mare/Rick Holmstrom models awaiting installation in a USACG Tele that I just ordered. I would really like to hear the true differences between all p.u.s. Maybe someday there'll be a website dedicated to showing each brand of p.u. in each position of perhaps a Strat, Tele, L.P., a couple archtops (thin and thick bodied). I'd like to hear actual differences between P-90s too.
Websites like S.D. have sound samples of their own p.u.s but I'd like to know of a website comparing several different brands of p.u.s in different positions of different brands and models of guitars. ACME guitars is another website with sound samples of several brand p.u.s, but still compares only a few. It would be interesting, for example to compare the tonal characteristics of a Don Mare 2234 to a Dimarzio Twang King in both the bridge and neck positions of a Tele, then compare Hamels, Stuarts, H.D., VZs, S.D.s, Fenders of different models, etc. Then demonstrate all of them with the tone control dialed back 1/3 to 1/2 on the bridge p.u. etc.
I think it's only a matter of time before this is available simply due to the strong need for it. I'm very aware of the sonic limitations of website sound samples, however, a sound sample is usually (though not always) better than nothing.
OK, so we need a volunteer to purchase every brand single and double coil p.u. for all positions of the guitar and several different styles of guitars and do an exhaustive comparison. Step right up. Anyone?

Tom

[bluesation]

my dear jumpnblues,

with pus or other accessoires it has much to do with faith. example. Some years back in the 90's i think. Jim Marhall wanted to know if the dispute about tube/valve amps and solid state amps (today modelling) is not only a thing of faith.
He invited long time Marshall users to do a test. He got a room, buildes some stacks some with a tube head some with solid state heads in random order. the players werent told what amps is online. They could be play the amps and at the end they had to say, which is tube and which is solid state.
Result: if someone maintains to hear the difference it is a fairy-tale. There was only one who had 100% right tips: Gray Moore (who wonders?), second was Alvin Lee, but his hits were a lot under 100%, but cant remember. Perhabs, another day, Gary would have had some faults too.

If i think at recordings, there are so much influences from all parts of the sound chain (strings, picks, cabel, pedals, amps, speaker, mics, room, mixer, effects, mastering, playback unit, speakers, room, ears) that you cant tell me that you hear if the tele was equipted with brass or steel saddles.

please keep in mind, that i am a tone freak too. some songs only work with the special sound, e.g. La Grange, Radar love...

ok, as you, i also would like to have a website were i could hear all the pus for tele. Played with same amp and settings, same guitar and player, same riffs and chord progressions. For myself, i am collecting most of soundsamples i can find, most come from the manufacturer website. And you can buy "the all pickup check CD" from Rockinger.com

BTW: here in germany we have a freak. He tested all overdrive pedals of the world. He wrote reviews about every pedal, but it is in german. A lot of pedals he owns, but most are given to him from other entusiasts for the review. A great job he did and always does. you can find it here: http://www.guitartest.de/OVERDRIVETEST.htm

If i had some money left i would do this for pus. but you have to get a special guitar, were changing the pus is less lavish than with standard guitar. but i think no one will get his pus out for a test, an later get them in again. a pedal in that case is better to handle.

ok, lets go for work.

[tkingen]

Thanks for your well thought out opinions, guys!

[Brick]

I haven't tried a lot of pickups. I put a pickup in a guitar and if it sounds pleasing to me, it stays for the most part. Out of the half dz or so bridge PUs I've tried, the Duncan Broadcaster and the VZ flatpole are my favorites. VZs in two and the Broadcaster in one. I have VZs in both my strats ( true vintage). To me what matters most is that I do not like overwound PUs. I have friends who do, but I'd rather use a clean boost if I want to slam the front end of an amp. I also got the VZs realatively cheap. I just put a Duncan antiquity in a MIM that sounded great. Trust your ears. Some PUs just do not sound right in some guitars.

A good starting place would be to buy a Broadcaster and something like a Rio Muy Grande, and see if you like the hotter output of the Muy. Then you can post a question like " I have a Broadcaster in my AM Standard and it is too bright, but the Muy Grande doesn't twang quite like I'd like it to. Any suggestions?" Then the zillion people who have tried one or the other can give you some feedback as to what might work for you.

I have the exact same VZs in my hardtail ash maple neck strat and my alder wang bar rosewood neck strat and they sound VERY different.

I just bought a set of Tex Mex PUs for a beater I'm putting together just to have something different, but I doubt I'll like them.

I do agree that price isn't always reflected in what you hear.

And remember, the tone control is your friend.

[jumpnblues]

"And remember, the tone control is your friend."


Especially on a Tele! You can get some really sweet, fat, tones on a Tele bridge pu by dialing back the tone control from about 1/3 to 1/2. You are so right.

Tom

[tkingen]

Originally Posted by Brick

A good starting place would be to buy a Broadcaster and something like a Rio Muy Grande, and see if you like the hotter output of the Muy. Then you can post a question like " I have a Broadcaster in my AM Standard and it is too bright, but the Muy Grande doesn't twang quite like I'd like it to. Any suggestions?" Then the zillion people who have tried one or the other can give you some feedback as to what might work for you.

And remember, the tone control is your friend.

Good suggestion! I'm looking for a big, fat steel tone out of the bridge without being too hot and bright, but still some twang. In the neck, fat and smokey yet with clarity.
In the last couple of weeks I've tried:

Bridge -
Fender Vintage Noiseless -trebly and sterile.
Van Zandt Vintage - edgey and Buchananesque but seems a little compressed.
Duncan lil' 59 - in parallel mode it sounded like a big, fat steel guitar pu. Too hot, though. Hated series mode.
Duncan 5/2 - nice but a little more polite than the VZ.

Neck -
Fender Vintage Noiseless - not fat enough.
Fralin Vintage - midrange scooped, kind of stratish.
Duncan Quarter Pounder - fat and smokey but a little too hot.
Duncan 5/2 - modern and a little mid scooped, but not as scooped as the Fralin.

I've sent the lil' 59 bridge and Quarter Pounder neck back to Duncan and am exchanging them for a set of Vintage Stacked. The soundclips seemed to be an interesting compromise from SD's other offereings. Plus, you have hum canceling and coil taps for different sounds. I liked the tones Pete Anderson was getting when he was using them and Brent Mason's tone is fat and twangy at the same time.

I'll begin by wiring them without the taps to see how the fundamental tone shapes up in this guitar. If they are keepers, I'll start experimenting with the coil taps and 4 or 5 way switch.

I know that the same pickups can sound different in different guitars. A bridge pup that sounds twangy in one guitar can sound piercing in another. It takes some experimentation to find the right marriage of components that best suit the guitar and the sound in your head. Luckily it's a fun pursuit (although can get pricey!) and it's a godsend that a forum exists where like minded folks can discuss this stuff.

[tkingen]

Originally Posted by Brick

A good starting place would be to buy a Broadcaster and something like a Rio Muy Grande, and see if you like the hotter output of the Muy. Then you can post a question like " I have a Broadcaster in my AM Standard and it is too bright, but the Muy Grande doesn't twang quite like I'd like it to. Any suggestions?" Then the zillion people who have tried one or the other can give you some feedback as to what might work for you.

And remember, the tone control is your friend.

Good suggestion! I'm looking for a big, fat steel tone out of the bridge without being too hot and bright, but still some twang. In the neck, fat and smokey yet with clarity.
In the last couple of weeks I've tried:

Bridge -
Fender Vintage Noiseless -trebly and sterile.
Van Zandt Vintage - edgey and Buchananesque but seems a little compressed.
Duncan lil' 59 - in parallel mode it sounded like a big, fat steel guitar pu. Too hot, though. Hated series mode.
Duncan 5/2 - nice but a little more polite than the VZ.

Neck -
Fender Vintage Noiseless - not fat enough.
Fralin Vintage - midrange scooped, kind of stratish.
Duncan Quarter Pounder - fat and smokey but a little too hot.
Duncan 5/2 - modern and a little mid scooped, but not as scooped as the Fralin.

I've sent the lil' 59 bridge and Quarter Pounder neck back to Duncan and am exchanging them for a set of Vintage Stacked. The soundclips seemed to be an interesting compromise from SD's other offereings. Plus, you have hum canceling and coil taps for different sounds. I liked the tones Pete Anderson was getting when he was using them and Brent Mason's tone is fat and twangy at the same time.

I'll begin by wiring them without the taps to see how the fundamental tone shapes up in this guitar. If they are keepers, I'll start experimenting with the coil taps and 4 or 5 way switch.

I know that the same pickups can sound different in different guitars. A bridge pup that sounds twangy in one guitar can sound piercing in another. It takes some experimentation to find the right marriage of components that best suit the guitar and the sound in your head. Luckily it's a fun pursuit (although can get pricey!) and it's a godsend that a forum exists where like minded folks can discuss this stuff.

[Telewringer]

I have SD Broacasters in both my Teles and love them. I get the
Brent Mason fat tone through a DOD250 Overdrive Pedal used to
boost the gain into a 70's Silverface Twin and use Ernie Ball .008 Stings.