Hope this is the right area--best values for treble bleed ca

[Brewbaker]

For humbuckers that is--I know some folks use just a cap and some combine it with a resistor. I'm trying to remember the value(s) that work best for keeping some highs when you turn down, but retain a natural sound.

[Kevin]

See the thread I started below...

I've always used a single .001 cap (no resistor) until I swapped bodies to a new ash one... The .001 cap was too bright, so I started experimenting...

Seymour Duncan recommends a .002 cap with a 150K resistor. Kinman recommends a .0013 cap with a 130K resistor. One guy recommended a 680pf cap with an 82K resistor... Another recommended just a 680pf cap.

It really depends on the sound that you want.

I've not decided definitely, yet, but the three values I've liked best are .001 cap with 82K resistor, 680pf alone, and Kinman's set (he sent me a couple of caps and resistors gratis).

To my ears, the 680pf is still too bright, and the Kinman set is a bit too dark, so I'm thinking of going back to the .001 cap and 82K resistor....

YMMV and probably will.

[poboy]

Also keep in mind that the effect will vary depending upon the guitar cable you are using.

Regards.

[Kevin]

OK...

I just spent the last couple of hours trying different cap/resistor and cap-only combinations in my tele...

The caveat to all of this is that it depends on your guitar/amp/cord(s)/pots/etc....

I had what I thought was an almost perfect-sounding tele before I switched the body (for cosmetic reasons), and was using CTS split-shaft pots, a ceramic tone cap, plastic-covered wire, and a .001uf bleed cap. Oh, yeah, it was an alder body...

I switched to an ash body, CTS solid shaft pots, a waxed paper tone cap, cloth-covered wire, and tried the .001 bleed cap. It was a little too bright when I rolled the volume back -- no doubt about that....

I then tried soldering an 82K resistor in series with the .001 cap, and it was pretty good, maybe just a bit bright?

Next, I tried a 680pf cap by itself -- that sounded right on the rolloffs, but seemed to "choke" the sound when the volume was all the way up (I don't know how to describe it, but I know what I heard).

Next, I tried Kinman's combination of a .0013 cap in series with a 130K resistor. The treble stayed pretty consistent throughout the volume pot taper, but it seemed that I was losing some taper in the pot and the guitar wasn't as bright full-up.

In the end, I went back to the .001 and 82K resistor. This works best, I think, for my setup now .

The moral here is that you should get a bunch of caps and some alligator clips and try them out in your guitar through your amp. You will likely come up with a different combination....

[Andy B]

I currently use 470pf or 680pf caps in all mine. I have 250K pots in all of them. You need to use different value caps depending on the value & taper of the pot.


Andy

[dand]

In my tele with Texas Special pups, I had a 0.001uF bleed cap. But I felt it got too bright as I turned the volume down, so I replaced the volume pot with a push-pull switch to take the cap out of the circuit when I didn't want it. But now I realize that it's too muddy without the cap when I turn it down.

And so I think I'm going to put in the original pot and replace the cap with a 680pF cap, or a 0.0012uF with a 130K resistor in series, as people have recommended in other posts. Depending on availability and cost I'll try both. Will let you know of the outcome, hopefully tomorrow. I'm all pumped now ;)

Daniel

[Kevin]

See my post above... I tried both of those combinations, but ended up using a .001uf cap with an 82K resistor -- one guy even suggested a 680pf cap with an 82K resistor.

A lot of it, too, depends on your amp, your pickups, and your fingers. I don't think there's one answer that will work for everyone...

Let us know what you decide, though; I'm always interested to hear what other people come up with.

[dand]

So I went to Tokyu Hands (in case any Tokyo-ites are interested) and bought a 0.001uF, 0.002uF (they had no 0.0013uF) and 680pF capacitors, along with a 82kΩ and 130kΩ resistors, as well as a bunch of tiny alligator clips. I tried and compared pretty much every combination and settled on a 680uF capacitor with a 130kΩ resistor in parallel.

Some of my observations are:

• With the vol all the way up I couldn't hear the difference.
• With nothing, it sounds dull and "round" as I turn down the volume.
• 0.001uF and 680pF alone gets too bright and thin.
• 0.002uF alone sounds more mid-rangey.
• 0.001uF or 680pF with 82kΩ in parallel gets a bit too bassy/muddy.
• 0.002uF with 130kΩ in series sounded good -- the tone was consistent at all volumes.
• 0.001uF with 130kΩ in parallel sounded similar to the above.
• 680pF with 130kΩ in parallel sounded like the previous two, but sounded a bit more "clear" as I turned the volume down. And so I chose this.

I'm really pleased with the new sound. I think it makes the volume knob a whole lot more useful. FYI, the pickups are Texas Specials, and the caps are ceramic capacitors (the only kind they had of those values).

Peace :)
Daniel

[Kris]

You've done your pals here a great service with your systematic comparison of many options.

I've been most happy with my 680pF cap lately. However, your comparison convinced me to try the effect of a 130 kOhm resistor in parallel with the 680pF. I just tried this in my MIM 50s classic with a set of Harmonic Design '54 Specials. I agree with you: adding the resistor changes the effect in the way that you described. For this guitar, this has turned out to be a definite improvement, especially when using the neck pickup.

Thanks a lot, dand!

Kris

[dand]

I'm glad it's helped :)

I thought I'd add one more thing I noticed: when I added a resistor in parallel to any of the combinations, I noticed a much louder hum. Perhaps resistors are prone to catching interference? The noise was only there when I was testing it with alligator clip cables, so I guess the shielding on the control cavity effectively prevents this.

So if your guitar isn't shielded yet, get that cavity shielded! ;)

Daniel

[Kris]

Ok, I've put this combination (680pF, 130kOhm) in two teles now, the second one with an SD Broadcaster, and I've played them in challenging environments without detecting any increase in hum.

What I do notice is an apparent change in volume control taper after adding the resistor. The volume now drops more slowly as I turn down, which I like as it gives me more precise control.

Kris