Desperately seeking pickup advice.

[Fun with a Tele]

Long time lurker, relatively short time member and first time poster. There's just so much information here, I found the answer to nearly all of my questions by making use of search function. However, there's one question now that I can't be answered that way, so here's my first post then.


Despite my user name, I'm not having fun at all with my Tele at all. I tried to, but now I'm THIS close to giving up on my Tele and any single coil pickups completely. The reason ? I can't seem to get a set of pickups that works for me. I tried asking at a different forum. But instead of real advice, it just turned into an endless list of random <insert pickup name here> posts by people who couldn't be arsed to actually read my post.
Though I don't gig any more and I'll be getting rid of most of my collection soon, it would be nice to have a complete and functional guitar in the attic instead of a pile of Telecaster bits. Beside regular procrastination, what's keeping me from putting it together is the lack of a decent sounding set of pickups.


First, I had a Seymour Duncan Vintage Broadcaster bridge and Seymour Duncan Vintage Rhythm neck. The bridge was really nice with the perfect amount of output to drive my amp. I'd like my next bridge pickup to be just as powerful. What I didn't like about it was that it seriously missed some "complexity" or "air" or whatever I should call it. It was a sound without a soul, without a feeling, without character or anything going on.
The neck was quite nice as well, but again, without that certain something. Also, it was quite weak compared to the strong bridge. Switching from bridge to neck resulted in a tremendous loss of volume and and the difference between both pickups on or just the bridge was rather small.

Next were Don Mare Pickups, I only had them in my guitar for a couple of moments with alligator leads. For the bridge, I got the (then) secret Black Crowes bridge: a souped up Super Sport that is now available as the EL Black Krowe. Though this pickup had all sorts of wonderful harmonic overtones going on that I was missing with the Duncans, they were kind of drab. As exciting as an equalizer pedal with everything in the middle but the output volume at minus five. Yes, it really was quite a weak sounding pickup compared to the force of the Broadcaster.
For the neck, Don recommended the S-Telly. A pickup that is supposed to mimic a Strat neck pickup. This also had the complexity I missed in the Duncans, but no distinctive voice, flat as a diet coke after an hour. The Balance between the two pickups was somewhat better, but still not ideal.

About five years ago, I got to play a Fender Custom Shop Telecaster Custom Classic. It had a "Classic Tele" in the bridge that I didn't really care for. Sure, it sounded like a nice Tele, but nothing out of the extraordinary. The neck pickup, however, was really neat ! It was called the "Twisted Tele." At the time, the Twisted Tele only came with the Custom Classic and the John 5 Signature Tele. I don't know if they changed anything about it when they moved the Twister out of the Custom shop and into the Baja Tele.
What's been keeping me from buying a used one on eBay is that I didn't like it when the amp was set to dirty. There were harsh, shrill, nasty and metallic overtones that I couldn't dial out on the guitar or on the amp.


So now that you know where I'm coming from and where I'd like to go, I'd really like to hear recommendations from people who have actual experience with any of the pickups mentioned above.
If you can't tell me how your recommendation compares to these pickups, it'll be another guess for me whether or not it will be the sound that I'm looking for. I've pissed away enough money like that...


Thank you for your help !

[Telenator]

The answer is simple. You don't like Teles!

Seriously, you need to get out there and play some guitars. I don't know what you have in the way of stores where you live but, the only way to truly discover what you want is by hearing it.

You've listed some fine pickups by some of the best manufacturers and none of them gets you all the way there. The subtle nuances you're looking at can only be discovered by getting out there and hearing things for yourself.

The journey to discovery can be a lot of fun! Good luck!

[musicalmartin]

What amp are you using?

[Fun with a Tele]

Mostly Marshall Studio 15's.

[WaylonFan76]

Originally Posted by musicalmartin

What amp are you using?

That was going to be my first question. My second one : what type of music do you play and what musicians' tone would you like to emulate ?
You may not need some new pickups but maybe a new amp.
The Mare S-Telly in my experience is an amazing pickup and SD stuff is great too.

[donh]

OK, here's advice:

You are looking for what you don't like rather than looking for what you *do* like. Until you flip that you will, by definition, be disappointed.

In the mean time, dust off the Don Mare pickups and actually bolt them in place and solder them into the circuit. Clip-leads are good for finding out if something will fire up, but horrid for tonal evaluation.

Also, look at the tone control cap and if it's a ceramic disc cap hit it carefully with a hammer and buy a different cap.

Slow down.

Enjoy!

[WaylonFan76]

...and if you still don't like your S-Telly, PM me and I will send you some cash to take it off your hands. I'm serious.
I have a Twisted Tele, we can swap ...

[Mike Simpson]

What style of music do you play or whose sound do you like?

Maybe it is your amp.. have you tried other amps?

I have a set of Nocasters in one guitar, and esquire with a SD Broadcaster and a 3rd with 3 P-90s. I like them all... the 3 P-90 and Nocaster equipped guitars are very versatile. I play mostly blues and blues based stuff. My current amp is a SF Princeton Reverb.

[newmachine]

from my experience, using a Vox Pathfinder 15r:

- Custom Shop Twisted Tele (black/white/yellow wires) : bright, clear & nice details. kinda shrill when overdriven.
- Baja Twisted Tele (black/yellow/green wires) : not as bright & detailed as the CS, clear & has more low/bottom end, sounds more 'rounded' than the CS.
- Baja Broadcaster bridge : has more low/bottom end than the Duncan Broadcaster, handles overdrive/distortion better. not as detailed but has more "air"
- Seymour Duncan Vintage Broadcaster : complex but flat(?), I don't really like it when pushed harder on overdrive/distortion.
- Highway One set: not too detailed, less twangy, more "modern" sounding, sounds great when pushed into heavy distortion.

basically, all of the above are great. For now I stick with the Baja set because it has more low end than the other I tried.

hope that helps....

or maybe you need to plug the Tele to another amp....

or maybe your guitar is just a dud, no matter what pickups you put in there, it will always sound a dud.
so, by the way, what tele are you using??

[Fun with a Tele]

I was thinking about using my Tele mostly for bluesy rock or perhaps some occasional contemporary guitar pop/rock. I'm not trying to emulate anybody, I'm really just looking for my own Tele tone. I know what I like and I know what I don't like about the pickups I have tried so far and I was that the buffs of this forum would know where to steer me.


Trust me when I say I wouldn't ask you good lads about pickups if I hadn't narrowed the problem down to them. It's either the pickups, or Telenator is right and I simply don't like Teles.

While the Studio 15's get the most use with the Tele, I have a wide variaty of amps at my disposal from my gear-hoarding days and I'm not happy with my Tele on any of them. The better amps in my collection include various Marshall JCM800's (all split channel versions) that aren't fond of single coils. Then there are a Handwired VOX AC15 and Mesa/Boogie F-30 that both might move to a new owner this weekend. The last traditional amp worth mentioning is a worn down Fender Hot Rod Deville.
I also have a couple of racks from my gigging days. One is build around the Marshall JMP-1 preamp, the other around Mesa/Boogie TriAxis preamp.

The Tele in question is a Warmoth with swamp ash body, maple neck and fretboard that I wouldn't call "dud" myself. As in most of my guitars, the caps are NOS Paper-in-oil from the Russian military and the pots are made by CTS for RS. The last time it was a complete and functional guitar, it was wired to have a master volume and a master tone.

[fezz parka]

Ron Ellis. Do a search for his stuff on this site.

[Ricky D.]

You only tried the Don Mare set briefly with a jury-rigged installation. I suggest you install them properly and play them for a few weeks. Why not? You might just discover the things that they do best.

I have the Don Mare Supersport/Stelly pickups in my #1. My favorite set. Your Black Crowes bridge is the same pickup wound 100 ohms higher, a negligible difference IMO. For me, adjusting the heights gets them in balance close enough. Into my 5E3 clone, the sound is superb, precisely what I want. The bridge is bright enough to chop through when I want it to, gutty with the guitar tone rolled back a little. The neck is mellow but very clear and defined.

For all I know, I might feel the same way you do if I was using a Marshall Studio 15 and trying to play the same type of music you do.

I think Telenator had the best advice. Play a lot of guitars until you find one that does what you want. Nobody else is going to want what you want and hear what you hear. I can't possibly advise you. Our tastes are too different, and my amp makes everything sound great. To me.

[newmachine]

no, your guitar is not a "dud"
and I believe your playing skill is far better then mine :)
maybe it just isn't for you?

[fezz parka]

I just wanted to add this: Don's pickups are extraordinary. His dedication to tone, and his skill make his pickups worth every penny you pay for them. They deserve a second chance in the guitar if you still have them. Wire 'em up for real (no alligator clips) and let them live in the guitar for a while. Mess with the pickups heights, play them for a while both on your own and in a live setting. If they don't work for you after putting some time into them, then I'd say a call to Ron Ellis is in order.

[Don Mare]

Hi, Its not the right pickups for you..

that was a big risk going from wire 43 to a overwound 42

and going for the Straty neck was also risky -

seemed like you were OK with the Seymour wire 43 and regular neck.

but just wanted something more intriguing..

you really just need my (0038) 10k wire 43 model and a 1955 neck with Nickle Silver cover..


since you never cut or soldered my leads send them back to me and lets get you into a set that will perk your ears up..

I wish you would have emailed me this problem instead of, seeing my pickups take a beating and a blame on a public forum when it was not their falut at all.. the same pickups you did not like - actually have received nothing but compliments for five years and not one negative!, so I'm pretty proud of that and also a bit protective if someones trying to unfairly blame them..

send them back - I will be very happy to see that (like most of us here) , you too will LOVE Teles soon!

address-info: is on my web site

please do not add anything on to the shipping that would demand a signature from me or my PO BOX - cause that automatically sends me to a different post office to sign for it, and Id have to stand in long line- for about one hour - we have long lines this time of year here - X-mas rush, and I cant stand at all really - cause my knee is blown out (awaiting surgery) and my other leg is shot from doing all the work - my limit on standing is about 5 min..

also add a note with package and on it: rewrite your address super clearly and that your trading for a 10K and 55 neck,ok

[fezz parka]

No beating here, pal. Most here know you make some of the best damn pickups around...and the fact that you'll take them back shows you're a true believer in tone. And customer service.

[Ricky D.]

Way to step up, Don!

Just out of curiousity, how would you describe the difference between my Supersport/Stelly set and the (0038) 10k wire 43 model and a 1955 neck with Nickle Silver cover you are recommending to the OP? This would be with a 5E3.

[Telenator]

Right on Don!

[Derek Kiernan]

I prefer something like a Fender Twin, but really, if you have a decent amp and a speaker that reproduces the frequency range with coloration you want (not always easy to discern), I wholeheartedly recommend turning up the mids all the way, while turning down the bass and treble from most people's settings. With Bill Lawrence's pickups (amazingly clear), it tends to work out to be bass on 2-4 and treble on 1-3 with most amps and guitars I've tried, but that will of course vary with other pickups (sometimes substantially). Also, particularly with the bridge position, I would turn down the tone pot to about halfway to take out the sharp quality to the resonance with many pickups. On Fender, Vox and Marshall amps, both the treble and bass are effectively boosts, while the mid control is a cut. If you want an even tone with a lot of body, it's helpful to experiment with a flatter voicing at the amp and adjust to taste depending on what the speaker cabinet needs. This avoids the mid scoop that can result in a lack of lower order harmonics on the higher strings (making them sound treble-heavy) and stealing tons of definition from lower strings, leading to terribly unbalanced chords and difficulty adjusting for even playing characteristics in general. Of course this approach works best with a very clear pickup to start with, but it will give you a strong impression of how to best resolve issues with others as well.

I'd take Don up on his offer before putting money into an additional set of pickups. Good luck!

[Derek Kiernan]

Originally Posted by Don Mare

my knee is blown out (awaiting surgery) and my other leg is shot from doing all the work - my limit on standing is about 5 min..

I don't know if you've ever had therapy for either, but I really recommend a book called Pain Free by Egoscue. I used to have a considerable physical problems that weren't resolved through physical therapy and I was pretty concerned I'd have to end up getting surgery, and this book really helped me out tremendously. Be well soon Don!