Is Squier becoming the Standard Of Excelence Within Fender ?

[iblastoff]

Originally Posted by longbow

This is a very thought provoking thread indeed. I am basically a bargain hunting fool when it comes to guitars. One of the last axe's I picked is a HOHNER Pro SE35. Plays as well as any other 335 I have had my hands on bar none. Korean made in 90. The very last axe I scarfed off the bay is a Squier Standard Strat. Vintage white with upgraded pickups from a custom American Strat. Very very nice guitar indeed. Paid less than 150 for it and the fella shipped it in a hard case to boot.

Now I have had many Epi's, a Prestige Standard, several MIM tele's and Strats, high end Ibanez guitars, Rondo's, Xavier, and some I have probably forgotten and all manner of Squiers. As it stands right now I would have to say that the Squiers I have currently are about as good as any guitars I have played to date. I should have never sold an E series MIJ tele but needed the dough. Rivaled any guitar mentioned above and then some.

I am going to scarf one of the Jazzmasters and then probably one of the GFS hollowbodies. I was thinking of investing in a Gibson LP and an American tele and strat but truth be told if you upgrade the pickups how much better can they be? thanks

i think the one thing that can be agreed upon from this thread is that no matter what you pick, as long as it sounds alright to YOU, you'll probably fall in love with it regardless of the make/manufacturer/cost/etc etc.

just because some people seem to be happy with 100$-$300 guitars doesn't mean everyone will be, just as not everyone will be automatically happy with $1500 and up guitars.

[bynapkinart]

I think if you want to look at the standard of excellence in FMIC, it (for now) is still MIA Fender product. Think about it: even in the CV series, heralded as the best that Squier has offered since the JV era, has some serious QC issues it hasn't worked out yet. Yes, for the most part the fretwork is incredible, and yes, for the most part the pickups and electronics are fantastic even stock...but we are getting lots of CVs in stores with dead pickups.

I LOVE my CV50. It is hands down the best Fender product I've owned, including MIA. But I had to search pretty hard to get the right one, and the disparity between the one I bought (2008 serial) and some of the ones I tried (2010 serials) was massive. Not that the 2010 stuff was particularly bad, but I can tell from the earlier models that they really took their time and produced a product that would garner a lot of attention. Once that attention was caught and they started shipping in volume, we have dead pickups, thicker finishes and shady electronics (in some models, still not the majority).

When you hang the medal of "standard of excellence" on any product, it at least indicates that there is an inherent consistency to the product. I think Squier is quickly becoming a strong brand with fantastic product, and I think that is because of competition at the lower price points of guitar production (as others have touched on before).

Now, I own a CV50. I love my CV50. It is AT LEAST as good as most MIA standards. The difference between the MIA standard and the CV is the fact that if you pick up any MIA in a (non-Guitar Center) dealer, and A/B it with any CV, chances are the MIA will consistently be a nice, well made guitar, and the Squier will have one or two small issues. I'm not crazy about some of the fretwork coming out of Corona recently, but almost every single guitar that gets out of the factory there has very nice fit and finish to it, the electronics work very well and the stock pickups are fantastic. They accomplish all of that at a consistently high level at volume.

I think Squier is quickly becoming the best Fender you can get that isn't MIA. While I still think MIA is the standard by which all Fenders should be judged, I think that with the advent of certain models, it is becoming quite difficult to construct a non-political argument against Squier.

[Jimo]

Originally Posted by PJ

Hey...when I was a kid, Teisco Del Reys were in all the discount stores for $29.00. Sure wish I had a few of those in the attic.

They are still horrible, however...lol.......Strings 1 inch off the fretboard--and those Black Diamond Strings!...oh baby!!!!!!

[telewhacker24_7]

Standard of excellence,nope,no way.A nice budget fender style guitar,yes...Squier's are cool for the kids and people on a budget.When they learn to play and get more money they will buy a real Fender.If not,it's not much of an investment.That's the way the cookie crumbles.

[Jimo]

Originally Posted by telewhacker24_7

Standard of excellence,nope,no way.A nice budget fender style guitar,yes...Squier's are cool for the kids and people on a budget.When they learn to play and get more money they will buy a real Fender.If not,it's not much of an investment.That's the way the cookie crumbles.

Robin Trower, Peter Green, and Jeff Heally would disagree..

[wshelley]

Originally Posted by Jimo

Robin Trower, Peter Green, and Jeff Heally would disagree..

Certainly notable exceptions to the rule.

But the list of MIA and CS players who would disagree with them might be so long it would jam up the server.

[musicmatty]

[QUOTE=telewhacker24_7;3103743]Standard of excellence,nope,no way.A nice budget fender style guitar,yes...Squier's are cool for the kids and people on a budget.When they learn to play and get more money they will buy a real If not,it's not much of an investment.That's the way the cookie crumbles.[/QUOTE]

Oh..I see, thanks for sheding that light on this thread.

[telewhacker24_7]

Oh..I see, thanks for sheding that light on this thread. [/QUOTE]

Your welcome!Fender likes it too

[JeradP]

When I bought my CV50 at Guitar Center, it played better than every guitar I ompared it with. Granted, GC avoids set ups at all costs, I wouldn't see any need to pay more money for a similar guitar. 2 CV50s, an Affinity, a few MIM Teles, and a couple American Teles I tried out and I bought the, by far, best playing guitar. I'd assume Squier is hit or miss and Fender is less "dud-y".

[waffle waitress]

Originally Posted by weezy109

Rewire them and change out the hardware and id put em up against any other guitar as far as them being gig worthy. Are they perfect and fit you to every detail? Well they certainly won't be perfect for everyone. They are just wood how can they "fold". Many great guitarists played with cheap guitars on bigger stages than most anyone on this forum will ever see so i don't find your claim to be true

Weezy, I think your right. I have owned about 5 or 6 ishibashi guitars (jazzmasters/jags/teles) and on a couple of them I first upgraded the pickups...improvement....then I upgraded the wire/pots/switch and that made about the same difference as the pickups...sounded a lot better.

I never had a problem with the frets, intonation, anything like that on the MIM or CIJ...both were very nice.

My problem was with the tone when playing full volume w/the band. I use a fully serviced/stock 1971 Pro Reverb w/the OCD or ZVEX Distortron or TS9 or ZVEX fuzz factory and Fulltone Fat Boost (whatever the newest version is). I was just never stoked about they way they sounded in a band/gig setting. it did work well w/my Princeton in much lower volume hired gun female singer/songwriter gigs but that was very sparse/subtle.

[tap4154]

I've been doing a song via the internet with an old buddy in Ohio, and recording rhythm tracks clean, I'm finding my CV50 has a nicer and more "chimey" tone than my '52 AVRI. Doing the same track on both guitars in the middle position, the CV just sparkles more (both with tone full on). The pine body seems to have a brighter/sharper tone unplugged as well.

[waffle waitress]

PS...sorry to take this thread off topic.

I will agree that these CV guitars are AMAZING for the money. The neck on a LPB 50's CV strat I played was VERY nice.

[waffle waitress]

Originally Posted by tap4154

I've been doing a song via the internet with an old buddy in Ohio, and recording rhythm tracks clean, I'm finding my CV50 has a nicer and more "chimey" tone than my '52 AVRI. Doing the same track on both guitars in the middle position, the CV just sparkles more (both with tone full on)

That makes sense. Those tele customs seem to be light weight and the 52 ri have a poly finish as well (topped w/nitro though...but it's thick).

[tap4154]

Originally Posted by waffle waitress

That makes sense. Those tele customs seem to be light weight and the 52 ri have a poly finish as well (topped w/nitro though...but it's thick).

It's not the custom, it's the CV50. Just over 8 lbs, my '52 is a pound lighter.

[Cpt.Blues]

I would have to respectfully disagree as well.

Although the quality of the Squier line has improved tremendously over the past few years, I feel that the MIM Fenders are the best overall quality guitars in the Fender line up. You are always going to find guitars made in all the Fender plants that have minor quality control issues, but to me the Mexico plant makes the most consistanly fine instruments.

The last three guitars I have purchased have all been MIM guitars. Great value for the money, but most importantly, the best bang for the buck.

[PJ]

RE: $29 Teiscos - Think about it. The only thing that's changed over the years, is that the quality of Asian guitars has increased astronomically. But, even 40 years ago, my '70 Tele still cost me 8 times that of the $29 Teisco. And today, a CS Tele will cost you the same 8 times that of a CV.

[PraiseCaster]

Right now I have to equate the guitars were seeing out of China, to the late 60's/early 70's guitars we saw out of Japan: SERIOUS CONTENDERS! And many of us had blinders on during this era.

And what I really mean by that is, those with "refined tastes" in guitars are experiencing a "Deja-vu" in the sense that the Japanese quality began matching what the US was producing, and yet many only quietly said to themselves, "Wow, this is serious!", but publicly still proclaimed, "Its not like a US made guitar."

China is studious and goal driven. It is embedded into their society, much like Japan was in the 60's-70's. Remember how awesome Japanese manufactured guitars where by the early 80's? Well, I think China may just be on the precipice of repeating this.

Deja-vu...............

[Stu Gotts 68]

I say this too often, but I have made my living as a guitarist for 53 years. I played my CV50 at an outdoor gig yesterday at gig volume, I left it in the car overnight,(this is in Florida about 80% yesterday and maybe 55 last night.) I hooked it up today and it was still in tune from yesterday, so do not tell me the CV50 does not stay in Tune!
The neck is thin, that is fine with me, and the frets are fantastic. Stu

[PJ]

A problem with China, is that they have (in many cases), less adherence to the patent and trademark laws of other countries. And, as an international trade partner, that presents some problems. In America, our system depends on those laws for legal trade. Ever see the current run of knock-off Fender & Gibson stuff finding its way over here? That's going to force more company-owned factories - to try to protect designs, trade secrets & other intellectual property. (IMO)

[musicmatty]

Originally Posted by PraiseCaster

Right now I have to equate the guitars were seeing out of China, to the late 60's/early 70's guitars we saw out of Japan: SERIOUS CONTENDERS! And many of us had blinders on during this era.

And what I really mean by that is, those with "refined tastes" in guitars are experiencing a "Deja-vu" in the sense that the Japanese quality began matching what the US was producing, and yet many only quietly said to themselves, "Wow, this is serious!", but publicly still proclaimed, "Its not like a US made guitar."

China is studious and goal driven. It is embedded into their society, much like Japan was in the 60's-70's. Remember how awesome Japanese manufactured guitars where by the early 80's? Well, I think China may just be on the precipice of repeating this.

Deja-vu...............

Cudos to you...Seems there is only a few of us who will go public at the risk of scrutiny to say that there is a product rising above expectations and prejutice that is being made in Red China and Indonesia. And it seems, it is comming up thru the ranks rather quickly and not so quietly any longer