Running Rehearsals

[ROUNDOAK]

All new songs were butchered the first gig because no matter how long we rehearsed them some players couldn't remember the arrangement, chords, solos, harmonies, etc.,.

So, in the 90's I had everyone bring a cassette recorder and after we were ready, to record the new songs and listen to them before the next gig.

These days recordings of rehearsed tunes can be e-mailed as MP3s to band members. So, instead of learning by rote (I'm Dead For You take 99) we only had to get ONE clean recording of songs at rehearsals.

Better that players hear themselves and their own weak spots as well as our arrangements instead of the original. The next gig the katz were smokin' them new tunes!

[Big_Bend]

The tapes don't lie. It helps to record practices and listen back. All the mistakes take on a whole new light. I had no idea how bad I sucked until I started listening to my recordings. Really helps put things in perspective and shows the weak areas that need to be improved.

[boldaslove71]

We started doing this as well. Who is using what in terms of technology?
In some ways, I kind of miss the simplicity of setting up the boom box and hitting record.

I have basically resorted to a SM57 into Line6 UX-1 into Reaper > Cut up to make MP3 to send to band. The mix isn't great, but it gets the job done and set up is fairly quick.

[Jakedog]

Our rehearsal space for my original project is also our recording studio. It's one big room for live recording, but everything is baffled off, and there really aren't a lot of problems with bleed and such.

Everything stays set up and mic'd, and if we're rolling, so is the recording gear. We record EVERYTHING. You never know when you're gonna get a keeper, or catch a really happy accident.

Everything in the room is mic'd at all times, run to a SOundcraft Ghost mixer, a rack of comps and eq's and such, and an Alesis HD24 hard disc recorder. It also dumps into the computer so we can chop up a rehearsal into tracks, and burn CD's for everybody on the spot.

We have a full computer recording setup down there, but don't really use it much. All of us are kind of old school, and actually much prefer working with a real console, eq's, etc. The computer is a great tool for editing and really fine tuning and cleaning things up, but I'd much rather push real sliders than try to mix with a mouse and a monitor.

[BottyGuy]

I put one of these on a tripod:



Sony PCM-M10

I just point so that it has a direct line to a PA Speaker and the drum cymbals everything else (guitar/bass/keyboard) seems to bleed in pretty well. It has a wired remote with a track mark button that I hit at the beginning and end of a song so I can cut them up later.

[ROUNDOAK]

Great responses all.

Thank you.

Let me bounce this off ya'll:

I also found that by writing out the chords on a large chalk board or dry erase board, that a player who usually forgot those odd "chords, kicks and stops on the 3rd verse/bridge" later saw that board in his mind's eye and on the next gig he played the tune correctly.

These problems were present in my pro road bands and the weekend bands after I retired. So, they're in no way intended to reflect on the ability of anyone with who I gigged in the past. (Although the pros were expected to learn a song at rehearsal and play it that night, they also played full time and presumably were better at quick study)


And thanks to Moderator Chris S. for his assistance.

[Jakedog]

Quick study is what seperates the men from the boys. After that, retention is what seperates the assets from the liabilities.

Not a shot at ability, more like dedication. I recently started my new original project because I haven't put out a record in almost four years, and really need to get one done.

I had a great drummer, so we hired another guitarist, and a bassist, and got down to work. They were both top shelf players. Seven weeks into rehearsals, we weren't getting much accomplished. I was burning CD's for these guys that never got listened to, waiting around for them to show up for rehearsal (usually at least an hour late), having to re-hash stuff that should have been nailed down weeks before because they never took the time to run over anything on their own time, etc. Note, both of these guys were VERY good players.

So the drummer and I cut them loose. We now have another bassist and guitarist hired. Bassist is a former pro, now more of a hobbyist, but very nearly retired from his day job, after which he plans to be a pro musician again. Guitarist is a very basic, but very solid rhythm only player. You know what? I've gotten more done in two three hour rehearsals with these two guys, than I did in almost two months of rehearsals with the other guys.

They show up on time, they listen to the CD's, they work on stuff on their own time, and they are really in it to win it. The first guitarist I hired played these songs for seven weeks, still didn't know the arrangments, and was always looking at my hands for the chord progressions.

The new guy is not even half the player the first guy was from a chops perpective, but he came in the first night (after having a five song CD for two days) and knew those five songs cold. Bassist didn't get a CD, but knew those five songs cold after two runs through 'em, and was adding backing vocals. I'm happy if I can nail down three songs in a three hour rehearsal with a full band. They don't have to be totally cold as ice, but they have to be workable. With these guys we did seven on the first night. I figured started from scratch, we'd be a couple months out from tracking. I think we'll start in about 2-3 weeks.

I understand people are busy and have lives, and not everybody is a pro player. For some folks it's just fun. But if you're gonna be in a band, at least make an effort. None of us are kids. All of us have some. We have lots of things to take up our time, but we still manage to learn the stuff, and be ready at rehearsal. It's not too much to ask.

[ROUNDOAK]

Originally Posted by Big_Bend

I had no idea how bad I sucked until I started listening to my recordings.

Quotable Quote by Mr. Big_Bend!

I recorded a local TV station ID spot when I was 19. The rock music jingle was written by the director of The Va Beach Symphony and he hired me, my "bass player and right hand man" and our tired drummer (who couldn't play 4 fast tunes in a row) to go into the local 4 track studio. (2" tape AMPEX recorder-remember those? It burned coal I think)

Well, because of the track limitations (music was on a single track) I played the little filler turnaround riffs and the chords on the same track on my Les Paul Deluxe. If that didn't keep me busy enough, we found that when I didn't move my guitar in wildly exaggerated down stroke gestures so the drummer could follow the accents he blew the take. (the director/producer said, "I hope you fellows don't mind if I use my own drummer next time, this guy is costing me money!"-how embarrassing, especially for the drummer, and who knew before that he was following my visual cues on stage when our power trio was gigging?)

Well, the director later had some choir do the voice over, "Reach out reach out, and bring us in to view....eyewitness all the news.....blah blah... Reach out reach out, to Big BIG TEN!"

The bass player and I were tuned to 440 but the piano they later used for the voices was not. Even though no one else commented or seemed to notice it, there was just enough dissonance between the music and voices to drive me crazy.

Let me tell you friends, that despite my little rippin' riffs of which I was somewhat proud, my homies gave me the business about that commercial, and it aired a dozen times a day for years.

And I was very grateful for all of those home made cassettes my big brother made of me singing, El Paso, Wolverton Mountain, etc.,. that my daddy was so proud of. I learned years before I started recording in studios what not to do, and to pay close attention to tempo, string noise, rhythm strum changes, etc.

[ROUNDOAK]

Thank you for that great post, Mr. Jakedog.

You just validated the things that for years I preached to a deafened choir.

And I had written the same thing about ability versus dedication in my post before editing it out. (I tend toward lengthy dissertations, as in "Look Ma! I'm writing!")

The players who now perform satisfactorily no doubt appreciate your offer to record, your substantial financial investment and the chance to make a product of which they can be proud.

"Prima Donna" is such an ugly criticism and in my day it was overused to describe artists (both male and female) with temperaments, not just those who expected spring water to be provided for their poodles as part of the contractual arrangement. But in my opinion it would not be an abuse to describe any who show up late or unprepared as such.

Give me a solid player with a solid meter, one who understands that "the spaces are as important as the notes" and I'll be thrilled to have her or him.

[Wrong-Note Rod]

My current band rehearses maybe once a week and uses the old "play the song three times in a row" at rehearsal, never records anything, and then next week, they make a lot of the same mistakes.. they've forgotten a lot of the arrangement.

I'd get irritated, but I'm old, and sort of dont care anymore, as this is just another cover band. They're nice people, so I dont feel a need to tell them how to drive their car. My expectations arent very high artistically; I'm just happy to be playing, at this point in life.

My last band was a lot more "professional"... we would work on an arrangement until we had something we liked, then record it live, 8 mics and midi drums thru the mixer to my DAW, and then I'd mix it down and chop it up and send MP3s in the mail to everybody.

the nicest thing about that (as long as the arrangement never changed) was that then I could zero out the electric guitar I played, rip new files with everybody playing but me, and practice alone with that file, just like they were there.

But my new band doesnt wanna come over to my house... their loss.

[ROUNDOAK]

Originally Posted by Wrong-Note Rod

My current band rehearses maybe once a week and uses the old "play the song three times in a row" at rehearsal, never records anything, and then next week, they make a lot of the same mistakes.. they've forgotten a lot of the arrangement.

I'd get irritated, but I'm old, and sort of dont care anymore, as this is just another cover band. They're nice people, so I dont feel a need to tell them how to drive their car. My expectations arent very high artistically; I'm just happy to be playing, at this point in life.

My last band was a lot more "professional"... we would work on an arrangement until we had something we liked, then record it live, 8 mics and midi drums thru the mixer to my DAW, and then I'd mix it down and chop it up and send MP3s in the mail to everybody.

the nicest thing about that (as long as the arrangement never changed) was that then I could zero out the electric guitar I played, rip new files with everybody playing but me, and practice alone with that file, just like they were there.

But my new band doesnt wanna come over to my house... their loss.

Understood. And, "there ain't no senior prom looming on my horizon", either.
I once read a definition of music as, "A system of proportions in the service of a spiritual impulse". And, if music fulfills the spiritual needs of your group and you're no longer competing with others for....well, you know what and why, then enjoy it. I know I'd probably like what you're playing because if you're enjoying it then I would too.

EDIT:
"They're nice people, so I don't feel a need to tell them how to drive their car." Now that's funny!

[Wrong-Note Rod]

I try to just get along and go with the flow, and enjoy it for what it is... some friends getting together and ham-fisting our way thru some rock covers. It can be tedious and irritating if you expect it to be great music thats gonna define you as a person.

Sure, I like it to sound good and go out to a bar and play well and hear the applause too.

But this way, it keeps the emphasis on fun.

[ROUNDOAK]

Originally Posted by BottyGuy

I put one of these on a tripod:



Sony PCM-M10

I just point so that it has a direct line to a PA Speaker and the drum cymbals everything else (guitar/bass/keyboard) seems to bleed in pretty well. It has a wired remote with a track mark button that I hit at the beginning and end of a song so I can cut them up later.

By the way, BottyGuy, doesn't that recorder have built in stereo mikes to resemble either the O.R.T.F. or Decca Tree techniques?

How do you like the recorder? I believe they're pricey, too huh?

[bargoedboy]

We put up a set list of songs we want to do on Spotify, maybe 15-20 songs , we all learn them, and quite often try one or two at asoundcheck and if it feels right we gig it.
Any song tends to change a little when you gig it anyway, so long as feel is pretty close to what we want , away we go.
We tend to have maybe 3-4 rehearsels every year, allready had one this early in the year

[PeterVV]

Originally Posted by bargoedboy

We put up a set list of songs we want to do on Spotify, maybe 15-20 songs , we all learn them, and quite often try one or two at asoundcheck and if it feels right we gig it.
Any song tends to change a little when you gig it anyway, so long as feel is pretty close to what we want , away we go.
We tend to have maybe 3-4 rehearsels every year, allready had one this early in the year

Hah, you aint changed a bit!

[bargoedboy]

Nope. Still use both my solo`s (well one with and without Distortion)
I think the point is what do you want from your music and how professional you are.
If its Your main source of income and the audiance are more discerning, the rehearsels are worth it every time, however if its a weekend fun thing, and to be honest the punters around here don`t care what you play as long as its the same as last band, do your homework and gig it.

[BottyGuy]

Originally Posted by ROUNDOAK

By the way, BottyGuy, doesn't that recorder have built in stereo mikes to resemble either the O.R.T.F. or Decca Tree techniques?

How do you like the recorder? I believe they're pricey, too huh?

Yes stereo mics, pointed at about 90 degree angle, it records a gig from the audience really well. The sound is very good for a compact unit, i've gotten complements for recordings I've sent out.

I got it used on ebay but it was still kinda pricey, I think it cost me about $180, they are $230 new. I've been using it as a guitar trainer as well, its got speed and pitch control plus a-b looping so I can learn riffs and solos. Also, two AA batteries last a pretty long time in this unit, which is different for audio equipment.

[GigsbyBoyUK]

Pen and paper helps too. If at a rehearsal we decide that we want to end a song by repeating the second half of the chorus and then staying on the one chord or something, we write it down. Every time we don't bother writing it down when we play again we all say 'hey we had a good ending worked out to this but what was it?.