Noodling between songs

[Larry F]

Back in my day, nobody noodled through an amp in between songs. We either played the song, or parts of a song, but no one played anything through an amp.

So now I've got this trio with two of my students, as I've mentioned in other posts. The bass player is, in general, an impatient guy. He drives so fast that cars don't have time to see him coming. He had two near misses when I rode with him the other day. If I'm talking about something, he interrupts and takes the conversation in his direction. When I am teaching him during the academic, I have a few ways of dealing with this, so it isn't a problem at all. But in rehearsals, sometimes we stop a song so that I can write something down on a MS Word doc projected on a big screen. Or I'll look for YouTube video of a certain song or performance. Or tuning my guitar. Throughout all of these things, he just noodles away on the bass, usually playing scale fragments or the bass part to a Led Zep song I don't remember. He used to do it as loud as when the band was playing, but now he does it at the level of a speaking voice. My problem is that I keep the song in my head while I am writing down changes to the arrangement, or searching for a video.

I've mentioned a couple of times that I find this distracting and could he play without the amp. Now, I've done this when sitting away working on the computer, then turning part way around to mention in the most offhand way that I can that it is hard for me to think about the song we are doing. I talked to him this way so that it wouldn't be a direct confrontation and some new rule that I am imposing. But he keeps doing, so what do you think? Just because I never experienced in other bands may not mean that it is common with other musicians. If people seem to think this is OK, then that will be good info for me to have, and I wouldn't push it. He knows from class, that if someone is being disruptive, I will stop right there and talk to the person who keeps doing it. It can be a little emotional and make for an uneasy atmosphere, but it usually fixes the problem. But, as I said, I don't want to seem too authoritarian, which I am already. The three of us work together on arrangements and share ideas, but I'm the leader/teacher/TA supervisor.

Should I let it slide and deal with it on a case by case basis, or have a little one-minute talk? Vibe is very important to me in this band, so that is the number one concern here.

[tiktok]

Dude, when was "your day"?

I've been playing in bands for twenty-five years and there's always been some guy noodling between songs, frequently the drummer. It's always irritating (just like when the singer insists on always addressing the rest of the band through the PA)

That said, I'd tell Chef Boyardee to can it.

[middy]

It's pretty common, IME, but I consider it bad form in a serious group. I would definitely tell him to stop. Just ask yourself, WWZD? (What would Zappa do?)

[woodman]

Ask him if he knows what that first knob on his bass is for. Noodle away, dude, just turn the damn thing down!!!! Common courtesy, no?

[tiktok]

Originally Posted by middy

It's pretty common, IME, but I consider it bad form in a serious group. I would definitely tell him to stop. Just ask yourself, WWZD? (What would Zappa do?)

After the Mothers, Zappa didn't have bandmates he had employees. Different rules apply.

[ScatMan]

Is it possible to do some of your work (writing, looking for videos, rearranging, etc.) before rehearsal? That might eliminate some of their down time.

If you need to go do something by yourself during rehearsal that doesn't require their collaboration, is there some task you can give them to do that doesn't require them to play their instrument while you go do what you need to do?

When you first started playing with him and you stopped, did he wait a while before noodling? Now when you stop, does he start noodling right away? He might have started out noodling out of boredom but now it might be a conscious or subconscious message to you: "Hurry up, I'm bored"!

The bassist is being disruptive. I'm just suggesting that since you are the more experienced band member and the leader that you do what you can on your end in order to lead your group to your common goals.

[getbent]

Originally Posted by tiktok

Dude, when was "your day"?

I've been playing in bands for twenty-five years and there's always been some guy noodling between songs, frequently the drummer. It's always irritating (just like when the singer insists on always addressing the rest of the band through the PA)

That said, I'd tell Chef Boyardee to can it.

I love you man.

[jazztele]

practice is one thing...he probably has no idea it's bugging you...I'd tell him. It could be a simple, "Dammit, I'm brain-dead today, Charlie, could you hang on a sec? I gotta hear this in my head."

On stage, between song noodling says "hack" to me almost as loud as audible tuning (but not quite as much as the oh so evil, audible tuning with distortion.

[jguitarman]

Maybe it's my age but I can't tolerate bandmates noodling while others are trying to work out arrangements. Noodling on stage is inexcusable and something only an amature would do. Whether at rehearsal or at a gig it really bugs me. What would a band sound like if everyone noodled?
Personally, I would talk to him one on one again and politely tell him that this will be the last time. After that, if he continues, give him the boot or find a more professional band.

[Larry F]

thanks, everyone. I think I'll go ahead and ask him to ease back on that. The arrangements are things we do together (we are all composers in our other lives) and it is very stimulating and fun. All I am doing at the computer is writing down a words to remind us of what to do when. It takes about 2 minutes for that.

He's aware that he can be a little pushy and impatient, so I think he will be receptive to what I say. It is so important with the PhD students that I balance every criticism about the mechanics of life in music and academics and put it into a broader context. So I never just blast someone directly, tempting as is often is. I don't know if may of you guys have been in a situation to notice this, but the so-called persona of the professor is much more even-handed and less confrontational and blunt. Fifteen years ago, for example, you could slam a student for good effect and ultimately win their love, kind of like in the movies or like the way I was treated as a student. Now, however, everything is more transparent, as they say. Anything I say to a student can be repeated verbatim to other students, other teachers, the administration, and the internet. About 5 percent of my students have attitude issues and can make trouble with the administration. So I try to monitor everything I say at any time in any place in any setting so that if it is repeated verbatim, I don't look like a jerk.

[klasaine]

Tell him that if he wants to be a pro(?) ... "that he better knock that **** off pronto!"
Seriously, and in my exact language. If he's lucky someone may take him under his wing (this being you Larry) and will tell him that.

Stand still, work out stuff with your volume ALL THE WAY down or - how about this for a novel approach - help the leader get the job done faster.

[max_twang]

So much depends not on what you say, but on how you say it. Ask nicely with a smile on your face. Lots of people noodle. I'm guilty sometimes, and if my band mates ask me to stop, I do without taking offense.

[woodman]

Originally Posted by max_twang

So much depends not on what you say, but on how you say it. Ask nicely with a smile on your face.

Yeah! "Hey man — — got a volume knob on that thing?"

[smsuryan]

yeah i would tell him...thats just annoying...everyone is replaceable...if he has a hard time understanding wait till he is explaining something at rehearsal and do just what he does..start going through a phrygian dominant mode or play smoke on the water 70 times in a row...lol okay maybe thats not the most productive way but its funny to think about..

[Billy B.]

I always TRY to take someone aside away from the rest of the group to discuss a problem one on one that way ego/defensive attitude is less likely ,people usually want to get cocky as a defense if there are witnesses, so I always go outside with them for a positive flavored "suggestion" if that fails then go ahead and embarrass them in front of everyone else if that doesn't work then they dont work! I work with a bass player in a long time band who between songs ,on stage ,in an originals band would always start playing the same bass riff from a song by the damned at full volume ,We had to embarrass Him onstage to finally make it stop .Good luck Larry You are obviously a very smart and considerate Guy ,get nasty if You HAVE TOO for the greater good.

[klasaine]

Originally Posted by max_twang

So much depends not on what you say, but on how you say it. Ask nicely with a smile on your face. Lots of people noodle. I'm guilty sometimes, and if my band mates ask me to stop, I do without taking offense.

In this case, respectfully, no.
He's going to music school ... which means he at least 'thinks' he might want to be a professional musician. He needs to hear it fast and loud and aggressively right now. Doing that cr*p between tunes is one of the fastest ways to get fired and stop getting called.

[Phaze]

Maybe you could involve him, or even give him your task. Such as, "Young Padewan, what is it I want to make note of here, hmmm, why don't you do it, you would be better at this. Here, sit for a second."

Then...while he's typing away...YOU NOODLE!! HAH! Game, Set, Match! FINISH HIM! BAM!, there, I nailed it!


Whoa, sorry, I got carried away there. But you know what I mean.

[mudbean]

Originally Posted by klasaine

Tell him that if he wants to be a pro(?) ... "that he better knock that **** off pronto!"
Seriously, and in my exact language. If he's lucky someone may take him under his wing (this being you Larry) and will tell him that.

What Ken said.

Larry, you're the teacher, right? Isn't this akin to a student talking in class at inappropriate times? Take control, man!!!

mud

[68thinline]

I admit it - I'm a noodler.

I noodle between songs as a way of indicating to the others that I'm BORED. Ususally after playing some lousy cover tune that I really have no interest in playing. My time is really important to me - especially the little of it I get to play my guitar through an amp.

[Telefone]

Before practice starts there is a lot of it going on. warming up the fingers if you will.
It can get really irritating when you are trying to get some work done,our keyboard player is really bad sometimes. he likes to mess around while we are listening to recordings ect.
Never tolerated at a gig!!!!!