Question for gigging musicians:

[chet]

This mostly for the people in so-called "bar bands" etc.

Do you come out ahead as far as what you end up making nowadays? Or is the rising cost of gas for instance taking a big chunk out of the profits?

From the threads like this in the past it seemed like most people weren't really making that much from gigging.

[chickenpicker]

I haven't gigged for a while, but when I did, I only ever made decent money as a soloist (with backing tracks on minidisc...sorry...).

I've never made any money in bands.

[john s]

All of us ( The Band) have day jobs so our gigs are a "bonus"
As my wife can't work ( through ill health) this makes up for her weekly wage.
Plus, every gig I play is something I look forward to every week. Also I am not spending too much on gas.

[Colo Springs E]

.....of two nights, I pocket anywhere from $175 to $225 or so, so yes, I definitely come out ahead. Even factoring in gear upkeep, etc, it's a nice little "GAS fund" if nothing else.

I sometimes use the proceeds to pay off a credit card, buy birthday presents, do something nice for my wife or daughter, etc... it's sort of "house money" that I don't count on, so when I have it, it's discretionary.

[gtrjones]

My current band is 're-investing' the profits in swag (t-shirts, stickers), recording budgets, etc. We've had one 'profit-sharing' in the past few months, but other than that, everything goes into the band fund.

We have some gigs that don't make much money, and we have others that do quite well. We're trying to quit some of the former, and get more of the latter.

[Steve G]

usually come out reasonably well ahead on any one night. Dont travel far to gigs, dont drink much anymore, dont spend lots on gear so overheads are low.
However, I do a fair few unpaid appearances so all in all i probably break even...

[telel6s]

No gigs at the moment, but when I did there was not much money in regular bar shows (except for the rare drunk's $100 tip to play a Dylan tune). I'd go home with between $30 and $60 usually. (The occaisional private gig could get close to $200.)

However, I figured that if I was not playing then I would probably have gone out with friends to have dinner and a beer and would have spent $30 - $60. Looking at it that way, I figured I was $60 - $120 in the black each night I played. And, yes, I keep enough of a budget to actually see where this was kind of true. It made it possible to justify buying a new guitar, pedal, amp, etc. Now, I haven't had a paying gig in over a year and have spent less than $150 on things that I did not sell something else first.

[Daddy Elmis]

As long as you don't factor in the cost of gear, you can come out ahead. If you accounted for everything as a "real" business would, most local bands don't come close to turning a profit. Hell, most touring bands don't either.

But it sure it fun while it lasts.

I'm with Chickenpicker -- the most I've made in my pocket was doing solo gigs with backing tracks. Most bars seem to pay within a pretty narrow range no matter how many band members there are, and the lower range for a soloist is more (on a per-belly-button basis) than the higher end for a 4-6 piece band.

[fltpkr]

According to my 1099, I averaged around a couple hundred extra a month, playing out maybe twice a month last year. Most bar gigs paid $50-80 a night, but we bumped the average take up by doing a number of casuals over the summer months. City park gigs and company picnics always pay much better than bar gigs, generally twice the pay for half the amount of time.
So no, it really doesn't add up to much, but an extra $2.5K a year more than pays the expense for doing something I'd probably (almost) do for free.
I've spent the last six or so months rebuilding the band, and the lack of band income hasn't really been noticeable.

[sixstringbastard]

We recently self-financed our album. We put nearly all of the $$ from 2 years worth of gigs into studio and pressing. We all have jobs and if we didn't we wouldn't count on the money we make from playing.
To make money in music, you either have to be a solo act or learn to play an oddball instrument(pedal steel, accordion, banjo) and be someone's sideman.

[Barbeque John]

I play occasional band and more often duo gigs with my son, money works out about the same, but duo are a lot easier, less gear, sitting down, quieter singing. A couple of weeks ago did 6 hours a day for 2 days, at a winery, no problem, woulda killed me off if it was a band gig. Still, hard to get more thqn $100 bucks a person, just like 20 years ago.

[Sonny Meaux]

I've been playing for about 3 years. I got my college degree and the next week played my first paying gig ever in Phili and I'm from Louisiana. Since then I haven't had a single day job and I pay all of my bills on the road with my telecaster. We're currently playing around 200 dates a year between europe and north america, and we just released our second disc on the arhoolie label. I may be one of the lucky few but I am proof that you can live comfortably and solely on music. Also I am lucky enough to be surrounded by a great number of musicians who do the same thing. The rising price of gas for us basicly means we have to ask more from our venues.

[Sleph]

About 7 years ago I used to get about $500 a night to perform as a soloist and I did this 3-4 times a week. Then I went o/s for a couple of years and when I returned I found that $200-$300 was all I could get.

It seems that all the open mike nights with kids wanting to play for nothing killed the market. If I play with a whole band now we'd be lucky to find a place that could afford to pay $1000 ($200 each)

...so now I only play with the band as an excuse to have a huge party in some bar with all of our friends.....

...lucky I play for love and not money.

[toadman]

karaoke killed the bar band scene! i play i two bands. one does all Zydeco music. we play alot of city park gigs, and a LOT of dance halls and not too many bars. our first cd sales paid for our second cd. that in turn is going to pay for our 3rd.
the other band does mostly bars that are very close to my house and we don't mak squat for money but we have a great time and we get an occasional party or gazebo gig out of it.
yes i have a day job(carpenter) when i'm not being "Mr Mom" for my two year old.

[hal]

We do about 2-3 club gigs/month. We are one of the highest paid bands in the club scene in Memphis. I get about 150.00 night. These gigs set us up for the private parties/corporate/wedding gigs. They pay about 4 or 5 times what we get in clubs.

[charlie chitlin]

One of the highest paid bands in Memphis at $150 a man...
Yikes.
I recently played a decent bar in Center City Philly, and was glad they paid us $150 (for the whole band), because we've never played there before, and they were taking a chance on us.
The room was packed, they loved us, and when we asked for another gig for a few more bucks, we were told that all they EVER pay is $150!!!
Cities are a bummer...too many bands willing to play for cheap or free.
I would love to get local bands organized and start holding out for more money.
They couldn't rent our equipment for $150!
Of course...Blues isn't too happening in Philly these days.
I'm making less money now than I was in 1980 when we would work for the door receipts and pack in 100-250 people at $3-$5 a head.
Even the $60/man lower end went a long way when my rent was $70/month.
Now we're getting $3-$400 for 6 of us.
It's pretty much a hobby.
Hey...there are much more expensive hobbies that generate zero income.
And very few of those involve girls shaking their butts in front of you.

[Tim Armstrong]

I'm very lucky to live in a beach resort where there's a fair amount of work, which is not to say we started out gigging a ton. It took us a couple of years of paying dues to develop enough of a reputation that we can work a lot and even turn down gigs at places that we don't enjoy playing. I'm glad to report that I haven't gotten less than a hundred bucks for a gig here yet, and $125-150 is more common. Last year I made just under ten grand as a musician! Fortunately, I have a day job, too!

I'm 47 (until July 3rd, at least!), and the last few years with this band in this town is the first time in my musical life that I've made more money than I spent on gear.

Cheers, Tim

[woodman]

at my age, i feel lucky to still be gigging in light of the deplorable booking situation in this area ... in 1976, i felt like i'd arrived when i was paid the princely sum of $50 a night. now, a whole lot of the gigs i play pay (you guessed it) $50 a night. but to play is to be fully alive for a short while, so i'd probably keep doing it even if it cost me!

[t_ross33]

I've only been playing out for the past year+1/2, after a 20 yr "life takes over" musical hiatus c/w wife, kids, mortgage etc. Having picked up a gig as a lead(ish) guitar player (having been primarily a bass player in my past life) I had to aquire new guitars, amp(s), pedals, miscellaneous and sundry cables, bits and bobs. At $150 to $200 each a night, and playing once or twice a month, I figure my "hobby" to be self sustaining.

We recently purchased a smaller PA rig, monitors, mics etc. for our 3-pc endeavor and now have it paid off after 5 or 6 gigs in the past 3 months. I think we'll be putting some of our future earnings towards the "band fund" for more gear, swag, posters/marketing etc.

All said and done, I ain't getting rich, but this is my hobby and there aren't many hobbies that can actually provide some income.

Trev

[hal]

Well, we pack the house. We are a dance band(www.theplaintiffs.com) and we learned a long time ago that if girls don't show up, nobody shows up. The clubs are for fun. The corporate/wedding/party gigs actually make it worth our while.

We gave up on being rock stars years ago. Everybody has a real job, so we only play about 4 times a month. Plus three of us play in church.

[blacklinefish]

Originally Posted by uncredited

As long as you don't factor in the cost of gear, you can come out ahead. If you accounted for everything as a "real" business would, most local bands don't come close to turning a profit. Hell, most touring bands don't either.

But you do need to factor in the cost of the gear by April 15, don't you? You know, when you report these earnings as income? That's when you want to show a "loss."

(I removed the name from the quote because I don't want you to think I was just picking on one person.) Anyhow, has anyone ever been audited?

--gh

[f69tele]

To make money in music, you either have to be a solo act or learn to play an oddball instrument(pedal steel, accordion, banjo) and be someone's sideman.

I play accordion and pedal steel. I never made more than the drummer or the guitar player in the bands I played in. We were all payed equal.

In Texas, you don't make good money unless you do the dance hall scene. I don't know how that's going these days - I got out of it over 10 yrs. ago. But, back then we were pi$$ed if we made less than $150. $200 to $300 was a good night. I've played gigs where we made $200 per hour. (each). Back then none of the guys had jobs, or had ever worked a regular job.

My personal musical focus is in an entirely different direction now. I've seen it from all angles - bar band, club band, party band, dance band, opening act & headliner. I don't say that braggingly, but I've been blessed to have played at all those different levels.

[backalleyblues]

Well, the Tampa Bay scene is all over the map...
A good night around here in the clubs is pulling in $75-100 per man. Mercifully I have a few of those. Occasionally private parties turn up and we get $100 per man (4 piece band). I know there are some choice corporate gigs around here, but they're sewn up by a pretty tight clique. Fair number of City park gigs around here too, and we do play those (blues band). There's also a good local scene so at least there are places to play and people who are into the music.

Cash-wise, we come out slightly ahead, we make our own swag and CDs, and they actually sell at shows (often netting an extra $100 per night). Of course, we don't price our stuff sky-high, partially because our costs are low, and we'd rather sell 10 pieces @ $10 than 2 pieces @ $15-it's amazing how sensitive people are to prices.

Franc Robert
Back Alley Blues Band

[hollowman]

Wish I could say I made some cash playing out, but we get paid some of the time, usually $50 a man, or just play for free at parties, etc. We're not willing to play the covers that would get us hired at a wedding, so we don't even worry about it. All of us have day jobs, so it's pretty much just icing on the cake if I play a gig, which is usually 6 or 8 a year with the band. I do get paid a little to play some bass in a jazz outfit that does the retirement group/rest home circuit, but that basically covers gas and a pack of smokes...

I just love to play out, and I'm fortunate to be in a position to get to do that enough to make it a cash thing

[bender-freak]

playing out in this area is a total fiasco....between rising gas prices and crackdown on drinking and driving the public is staying home; that includes the private gigs i used to get as well as club gigs...2 beers is enough to be "over" here in this state....i don't drink the silly stuff ever, but the people that used to get out sure do...i made way better money in comparison back in the 70's and 80's than can be made now....as another poster said...kareoke and guys/girls willing to play for free have killed it...can't compete with free....guitar and equipment up-keep sure as the crap ain't free....i mostly stay home and drink pepsi/coffee,tea and watch reruns....

[Tim73]

When I was originally playing back in my teens / twenties, I reckon I must have earnt about £300 a year at most over 13yrs and spent several thousand! We did well in terms of releasing CDs & getting on TV etc but never seemed to get paid etc. I used to see a certain irony in my 1st singer telling me I was great at the business side (this meant that I designed & cut up the flyers!).

Now I'm older we are getting about £150 per gig (4 in the band) and £300 at the last show. That said, I do spent a fortune on petrol but for me, it's not my main job so any money gets ploughed straight back into either the band or musical equipment.

[Daddy Elmis]

the regular expenses (gas, photocopies, etc) are sufficient to offset any income we generate. Several times we just declare the income and pay the taxes on it. I absolutely do not want to start depreciating or expensing my gear as business equipment -- I don't want the hassle if/when I sell anything.

[frank4001]

We'll get anywhere from 75 - 125 per, for bar gigs. Special ocassions and New Years we'll get 800-1,000.00. Studio stuff about 75 a song. (rare for me though). I have a day job 2 kids and the wife so I stay local and try to have fun and the money doesn't hurt..What of someone paid you to go bowling? You'd do it right?

[Stubbs]

The last 5 or 6 years I have played about 65-100 a year. The average take on a gig is about $100 per member. Of course there is the occasional benefit gig ($0) and the occasional wedding or special engagement($200-$400 per).

Then of course there is all the time put into bands when you don't get paid, like recording, practices, keeping up the website, making promo kits for booking, post office. I would be too depressed to actually figure out an hourly wage when you factor in all the other extra time.

That being said I love being a "professional" musician. I am a stay at home dad (3 kids 3,5 and 8 years old). It allows me to work mostly on weekends.

[chet]

Originally Posted by Stubbs

The last 5 or 6 years I have played about 65-100 a year. The average take on a gig is about $100 per member. Of course there is the occasional benefit gig ($0) and the occasional wedding or special engagement($200-$400 per).

Then of course there is all the time put into bands when you don't get paid, like recording, practices, keeping up the website, making promo kits for booking, post office. I would be too depressed to actually figure out an hourly wage when you factor in all the other extra time.

That being said I love being a "professional" musician. I am a stay at home dad (3 kids 3,5 and 8 years old). It allows me to work mostly on weekends.

Yeah, but isn't that part of the fun- making sure your band is getting better or staying at the level it's at?

[jjlinus]

the same here in italy.we play bar gigs for 250€(50€ each +50 for gas).in summer we take 500€ for rodeos,bikes conventions etc.my solo-guitarist plays also in weddings with a computer and a singer ant takes 300€(200 for him and 100 to the girl)playing some crap dance music

[Colo Springs E]

edited...

[Jeff Mason]

I reckon we're getting the same money now as in the 70's! Depending on the gig, between £30 to £50 each. I'm in a four piece & we just play local bars.
The expenses on fuel are'nt much...so its just strings, batteries & the odd lead or Harmonica!

[TG]

Around here the bar scene has slowed down alot due things like the smoking ban and the house prices (loads of people have huge mortages and tend to stay at home with a bottle of wine rather than go out to pubs). There are still gigs around and depending on the place and how many in the band you'd get anywhere from 40 to 150 euro a person. And this is within a 30mile radius so petrol doesn't take too big a chunk.
But we've been focusing on weddings recently so I've not done many pub gigs the past few years. Weddings are much better paid and alot more civilised. You don't get beer spilled on your amp or confronted by drunks or any of that ****e.

[Chris S.]

I made my living playing music for a number of years – but that was a number of years ago.

Aside from a very tiny percentage of players I know who've "made it" commercially to one degree or another, almost every "fulltime" player I know – and certainly the guys still working bar gigs – supplement their income by teaching, doing sessions, etc. And a LOT of them have spouses who work; it's like the old bumper sticker, "REAL Musicians Have Girlfriends With Day Jobs." ;-)

My own G.A.S. pains are alleviated by income generated by my "day job" – I don't make anywhere near enough playing music to pay for all the guitars & amps I own. And no, the irony isn't lost on me. :-\ All IMO, of course. CS :-)

[Tony474]

In my observation the whole live music scene in England - or at least my area of it - has been going steadily down the tubes for 10 - 15 years. Back in the eighties agents would just send a bunch of contracts each month, the commission would be sent back and there was rarely any need even to talk on the phone.

But economic factors since the early 90s made it harder for people to get out to their local clubs; the older members couldn't afford to go out any more and as time went by some of them passed on. Meanwhile the younger ones weren't interested in proper music, just chrome, steel and boom boom. Consequently many clubs went into financial decline; many of them closed and at least three venues I knew are now McDonald's outlets. Karaoke's done for a lot of live music here as well.

Pub gigs too have suffered both through economic and demographic factors and also through changes in licensing laws here regarding live music and dancing. The old two-in-a-bar rule no longer applies, killing some duo venues but enabling trios and bigger in others.

The Irish music scene survived in moderate health for a while but even that seems to be starting to peter out to some extent. There are still gigs to be played but they're not easy to find. Even the majority of weddings and similar functions seem to feature some pillock playing records instead of having real music. The galling thing is that recorded material has become something of a de facto norm here.

On the other hand, when there is a gig, provided the band is kept to a small number of players, a duo or trio for instance, it's reasonable for each member to expect to come away with £70 - £100 ($137 - $195) for the evening's work; more if it's a corporate function.

It remains to be seen what effect the total indoor smoking prohibition coming into effect on July 1st in England will have on live music.