Home recording question...

[g-Paul]

Maybe someone can help me with this...

I'm looking to record my band rehearsals - right now I have a Tascam DP-01/FX, which is fine for songwriting, but only allows you to record 2 tracks at a shot. I'd like to be able to record all the instrument/vocals on their own separate tracks if I could. I've got Cakewalk home studio 2002, which I've never really used - I'm thinking of buying an interface and using the Cakewalk.

Does this sound like it's going to do the job? If so, does anyone have any recommendations on what interface I should buy?

Thanks... Paul

[fungusyoung]

Originally Posted by g-Paul

Maybe someone can help me with this...

I'm looking to record my band rehearsals - right now I have a Tascam DP-01/FX, which is fine for songwriting, but only allows you to record 2 tracks at a shot. I'd like to be able to record all the instrument/vocals on their own separate tracks if I could. I've got Cakewalk home studio 2002, which I've never really used - I'm thinking of buying an interface and using the Cakewalk.

Does this sound like it's going to do the job? If so, does anyone have any recommendations on what interface I should buy?

Thanks... Paul

I think it will do the job. Getting the interface to work with your computer is the biggest key, and it may take some tinkering. Since you mentioned Tascam, I'll toss this out as an option:

http://www.tascam.com/Products/US-144.html

I have a similar box from M-Audio that does a good job. There are other options aside from USB 2.0 if your computer has a Firewire port. I hear they work even better. If you have a PC, simply upgrading the soundcard might be an even simpler solution.

I think you would also need a mixer though... especially if you're recording more than 2 tracks live/simultaneously. My USB box doesn't have any XLR mic inputs so I run everything through an inexpensive Behringer mixer and it works out fine:

My chain goes like this:

Laptop (Cool Edit Pro)---
USB box---
Mixer---
Mics

[kludge]

Depending on your rehearsal setup and the purpose of the recording, your best bet may be a mono room mic or a simple X/Y stereo pair. A couple of PZM boundary mics on the walls can be great, too. This is assuming that you're using a PA for vocals and all your levels are basically sane.

Think about it... are you trying to cut an album, or capture moments and find weak spots for improvement? You don't need a complicated, fussy system if the only people who will ever listen to it are the band members. You want something that is as simple and out of the way as possible. You want to be able to push a "record" button, start playing, press "stop" when you're done playing. And then you want to QUICKLY make copies so everyone can take it home that night - not something you can do if you're fussing around with levels and effects in Cakewalk!

[g-Paul]

Originally Posted by kludge

Depending on your rehearsal setup and the purpose of the recording, your best bet may be a mono room mic or a simple X/Y stereo pair. A couple of PZM boundary mics on the walls can be great, too. This is assuming that you're using a PA for vocals and all your levels are basically sane.

Think about it... are you trying to cut an album, or capture moments and find weak spots for improvement? You don't need a complicated, fussy system if the only people who will ever listen to it are the band members. You want something that is as simple and out of the way as possible. You want to be able to push a "record" button, start playing, press "stop" when you're done playing. And then you want to QUICKLY make copies so everyone can take it home that night - not something you can do if you're fussing around with levels and effects in Cakewalk!

Thanks both of you for the help... The primary purpose would be to capture the rehearsal and send everyone home with a CD - for that the boundary mics you suggested would be fine. We run the vocals through a PA and I'd say our levels are pretty sane. However, I was also thinking I'd like to be able to record demos at some point - so I was hoping for a setup that could accomplish both. Maybe that's not entirely reasonable?

I've never really used Cakewalk since I got it (it was a gift) so I have no idea how finicky it is, or whether it would be suitable for the job.

[gtrjones]

If you record with separate mics, you'll have to have a couple of higher-end things... one is a recording interface with enough inputs - most have 2, some 4... if you're going to use 3 mics on the kit, 2 vocals, bass, and 2 guitars, that's 8 inputs... If you've only got 2 inputs, then you're mixing before you record, and you won't have any more flexibility in 'mixing' than you would with 2 well-placed mics in the room.

If you're gonna actually track 8 mics at once, you may need a little more processing power. Converting all those inputs into waveforms stored as 1's and 0s in real time takes a bit of power. If you question your computer's ability to keep-up, check out the specs through the recording software you're using.

Finally, if you DO record 8 tracks at once, somebody's gonna have to mix everything down to a stereo track to burn CDs - that's an extra step that can take minutes or hours, depending on the level of detail. But it's gonna have to happen either way.

[g-Paul]

Originally Posted by gtrjones

Finally, if you DO record 8 tracks at once, somebody's gonna have to mix everything down to a stereo track to burn CDs - that's an extra step that can take minutes or hours, depending on the level of detail. But it's gonna have to happen either way.

Yeah, I read you. So it's sounding to me like separate setups for recording the rehearsals and recording demos might be the way to go - keep it simple and just mic the room into the portable recorder for the rehearsals.

Thanks... Paul

[StuH]

If your thinking about mixing and mastering your stuff here's the options.

Sure you could go out and buy an audio interface that has 8 or more ins,. Presonus Firepod comes to mind and do your mixing with the software, but is your computer up to it? Do you have the horsepower to record 8 simultaneous tracks at one time, do you have the money to invest, and do you have the patience to deal with software glitches?

You could also go with an outboard mixer with digital converters and record to CPU this way aswell. Again is your computer up to par?

You could also go out and buy a multitrack recorder which probably isn't a bad idea. Stable, hands on, but your limited to building the system with outboard gear.

If it's for improving band performance exactly like the guys had mentioned. Outboard mixer line in directly to your pc. You would likely have no problems recording one track and you probably could input in to the mic inout on your computer.

EDIT: My long winded way of saying the exact same thing GTRJones said. My apologies

[raisindot]

Originally Posted by g-Paul

Maybe someone can help me with this...

I'm looking to record my band rehearsals - right now I have a Tascam DP-01/FX, which is fine for songwriting, but only allows you to record 2 tracks at a shot. I'd like to be able to record all the instrument/vocals on their own separate tracks if I could. I've got Cakewalk home studio 2002, which I've never really used - I'm thinking of buying an interface and using the Cakewalk.

Does this sound like it's going to do the job? If so, does anyone have any recommendations on what interface I should buy?

Thanks... Paul

Others have commented on the room set up, mike thing, where I have no knowledge. But I can tell you about Cakewalk and computer-based recording.

First, Cakewalk HS is an excellent product, even if it doesn't have all the "bells and whistles" of the CW Producer series. There is a learning curve, like all software, but once you get things set up it's really a pleasure to use. And the great thing about having it is that it comes with a couple of soft synths, so you can actually add some keyboard tracks to your "acoustic recordings" either through "live performance" direct to audio or through MIDI.

Even Home Studio has some mixing capabilities, but its built-in effects and mastering add-ins aren't as robust as those that come with later versions of Cakewalk. On the other hand, you could still probably create a very usable mix for demo or rehearsal purposes, convert it all to WAV, and press it to CD.

There is a huge Cakewalk support community out there that can answer any questions you have, and the upgrade path to newer version isn't excessive.

That said, you will need to make sure that your PC has the power to handle audio recording, which is incredibly hardware intensive. If you're thinking of recording and/or playing back more than one track at a time, your PC should, at the very least:

o Be a Pentium 4 or better (mine is a four year old Dell P4 2.0GHz)

o Have, at a minimum, 512mb of RAM (1mb would actually be far better)

o Have a hard disk running at 7200bps at least (it's even better to add a second hard drive to be used exclusively for storing audio data)

o Have USB 2.0 (if you're thinking of using a USB interface)

o Be upgraded with the absolute latest service pack of Windows XP (Service pack 1 fixed a large number of audio recording issues; get this at least free)

o Be heavily, heavily, heavily tweaked to turn every single thing off that might consume resources that could be devoted to recording. This means turn off all antivirus programs, firewalls, printer spools, screen savers, network utilities, etc. (just unplug your PC from your internet connection if you're worried about viruses). Disable all hardware components (3.5" disk drives, modems, network cards, parallel cards, etc.) that you won't be using while you record. Defragment your hard disk before recording.

For an audio interface, there are gajillions out there. Someone mentioned the Tascam--I owned the Tascam US-224 as my first audio interface, and it worked quite well, but had only two inputs and no phantom power for condensor mikes, so I upgraded to an Emu 1820, which is a combination PCI card with a wire going to box with multiple XLR, 3/4", RCA and digital inputs and has phantom power. Whatever you get, I'd recommend getting one that does have the phantom power built in so you don't need to rely on an external pre-amp if you want to "go condensor."

As others have suggested, feeding all of your band's signals into a mixer and then sending the output as a single or double line into your audio interface is a great to avoid having to send multiple audio sources directly in your computer.

Jeff in Boston

[Heather Anne Peel]

I use either my Tascam DP-01FX/CD, which allows me to burn CDs on the spot, my Tascam 564 MiniDisc Portastudio or my Tascam 688 Midistudio depending on the situation. I much prefer the world of knobs and faders to GUI-based recording software, but then I am "old school". The best way to find out what works for you is to try things out hands on.

[StuH]

Originally Posted by Heather Anne Peel

I much prefer the world of knobs and faders to GUI-based recording software, but then I am "old school".

You can get midi I/O daw controllers now Heather. Quite a few models have been released recently. Even ones with motorized faders Cost a whack but it's possible to get very hands on with the computer stuff lately. Knobs and all.

[sax4blues]

This is a philosophical response about recording practice.

We multi-track our practice for the main reason we can hear each individual instrument clearly. I'll tell you it's brutal when we critique the playing since we can listen to one track at a time and man there is no hiding in the mix.

[Heather Anne Peel]

Also, I don't wanna have to take a computer of any kind to a recording session. I spend all day on them, and I enjoy them as a hobby, as well, but I like recording without a computer. That is my preference, anyway.

[g-Paul]

Originally Posted by sax4blues

This is a philosophical response about recording practice.

We multi-track our practice for the main reason we can hear each individual instrument clearly. I'll tell you it's brutal when we critique the playing since we can listen to one track at a time and man there is no hiding in the mix.

You and your band mates must have pretty thick skins!

Thanks everyone for the help and advice. I've got a spare computer - a 4-5 year old Dell that was top of the line when I bought it which I can dedicate to recording. It sounds like it will need a little tweaking and an O/S upgrade, but I think it will do the trick. There's a shop up here in Toronto that rents just about everything they carry, so I can try out various hardware devices without having to worry about dropping big $$$ on something that doesn't work out. I think I'll give the PC recording a shot - I'll let you know how it goes.

Thanks again... Paul