Synthetic oil

[Colo Springs E]

Any mechanics here? Any thoughts? I ran it in my '89 Corolla from about 25k miles to about 225k, and then switched to conventional (no real reason, just did).

My dad, who was an aircraft mechanic in the Air Force decades ago, doesn't believe in it. I say, if it is "slicker" shouldn't it be better? The one caveat I've heard is that you should use conventional oil the first 15k-20k miles to allow the engine parts to break in--in other words, allow some wear, which I assume from this advice must mean conventional oil allows for more wear.

Thoughts??

[Chris S.]

"Beleeb it or don't"... as 0.F. might say, we actually have had a related thread on the subject:

http://tdpri.com/viewtopic.php?t=31033

And the reason I remember that is because I put up a rather long post in the previous thread – I worked for several years for a client who was manufacturing and selling synthetic oil, so I learned everything I could about the stuff. (My name's gone from the previous post due to the hacker incident last winter, but the thread is still intact.)

And oh, yeah: synthetic oil is all I use anymore, for a variety of reasons. ;-) Hope it helps, CS :-)

[Colo Springs E]

...Hell I even participated in that thread! LOL "A mind is a terrible thing to waste..."

-Eric

[Flaco]

If you are a member of any mechanic based forums there are constantly threads about this stuff. Everything I've read suggests it doesn't matter what you run as long as you change it on a regular basis. Synthetic's main advantage is that it doesn't break down as bad over time, but oil still gets dirty. Changing oil at 3000 miles you don't really see the benefit of synthetic.

Also, you should be able to run synthetic immediately on a factory engine. You don't want to run synthetic on a rebuilt engine because the parts have to wear in.

[Joe-Bob]

Originally Posted by Flaco

Also, you should be able to run synthetic immediately on a factory engine. You don't want to run synthetic on a rebuilt engine because the parts have to wear in.

Uhh....new engines have to break in, too. You should always allow the first couple thousand miles for the rings to seat.

[tweedman]

Check out www.carclinicnetwork.com. Bobby Likus has a weekly radio show and has addressed this topic several times.Check out his archives on the website.

[telefunken]

On an old engine, aciete synthetico( I mean synthetic oil) will blow by any worn rings or valve seals. Don't listen to the mechanics, change your oil every 5000 to 7000 miles, they just want to sell you more oil more often. Get a good filter and name brand oil and you should be alright.
HAPPY MOTORING!!!

[eryque]

The filter seems to be the key thing. You might get away with changing your oil every 5 or 7 thousand miles, but your filter will become clogged long before then. Either it will slow down the flow of oil, or it will become totally clogged and the oil will just go through the bypass, taking the filter out of the equation.

[Tdot]

Originally Posted by Colo Springs E

The one caveat I've heard is that you should use conventional oil the first 15k-20k miles to allow the engine parts to break in--in other words, allow some wear, which I assume from this advice must mean conventional oil allows for more wear.

The owners manual for my new car says (it has, and) to use "synthetic only". I think "how you drive" during the break in period is more important.

I been using synthetic in my older cars for about 15 years and have found that it holds up longer and stays cleaner than conventional oil.

[Tremo]

If you're really interested in oil and filters, you should be reading the forums at the Bob Is The Oil Guy web page.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php

More info on oils and filters, which are good, which are crap, than you ever wanted to know.

I've been running Mobil1 in my car for years, she has about 160k on the clock. M1 is a real-deal PAO synthetic with Group 4 base stocks. Stuff like Castrol is not a real synthetic, they use hydrocracked Group 3+ base stocks which is dino oil. Real deal synthetics do not break down, shear down, etc as quickly as dino oils, and maintain correct viscosity over a wider temp range. You can safely run them a lot longer than a dino oil. Like dino oils, they also get dark with age, which is what you want, as they are keeping the insides of the motor clean. I now run the M1 Truck & SUV oil in both cars, it's their consumer version of their Delvac1 diesel oil, which is superb.

Filters are also very important, the stuff made by Champion Labs is good (they make several brands), as are Wix (aka Napa Gold). Fram is crap.

[Chris S.]

Yup, I'll agree w/Tremo, and in fact, it was Delvac 1 that I was doing the advertising for. ;-) Just 'cuz I'm too lazy to re-type (just like I'm too lazy to keep changing my oil all the time...) ;-) here's my entire post from the earlier thread:

---------------------

Secrets of synthetic oils

I'll preface this by saying that this is one of the few automotive subjects I know a little about (and before you start throwing rocks at me, remember I said a little...). ;-) And I would also agree that <u>following the manufacturer's recommendations in your owner's manual</u> is always the best idea – <u>especially</u> if not following them could affect your warranty protection.

That said, I used to write for a big ad agency that did work for a big oil company, and one of the accounts I worked on was their commercial lubes division (i.e., oils and lubes for big trucks – 18 wheelers). And a hot topic in that field for the last decade or so has been "extended drain intervals," or how far can you <u>safely</u> manage to go between oil changes.

This is a "bread and butter" issue for truckers and trucking companies. Not only does any time spent in the shop represent dreaded "downtime" (trucks that aren't rolling aren't making money) but maintenance costs come straight off the bottom line. An even bigger concern is the cost of fuel. Well, it turns out that 100% synthetic oils offer a number of potential advantages over conventional oils, including greater fuel efficiency, reduced engine wear, easier cold starts, and (ta-da!)... longer intervals between oil changes. In fact, synthetics have long been popular in Europe where the cost of gasoline and diesel is much higher than in the US.

The claims even for consumers using gasoline engines are pretty fantastic: 15,000 miles, 25,000 miles, 35,000, once-a-year oil changes, etc. (And for truckers, who use diesel engines, the claims are even more amazing, like up to 100,000 miles between oil changes!). So I spent a LOT of time researching everything I could find on the subject. And before I changed my own car (which I depend on every day) over to a synthetic, I personally grilled several oil company engineers on the subject, in depth, and on a number of different occasions. But the conclusion I came to is, YES, you can go way beyond the heavily-advertised 3,000 mile oil change IF... 1) You use a 100% synthetic oil (like Mobil 1 or Amsoil, for instance), and 2) You continue to change the oil filter as necessary.

So for the last 7 or 8 years, I've been using Mobil 1 and changing my oil every 10,000 miles. I sold my last car (a Toyota Camry) when it had 150,000+ miles on it, most of which was abusive stop-and-go city/suburban mileage, but it was still running like a champ, and I'm actually kinda sorry I sold it. My current car (another Camry) is still going strong at 135,000 miles, again with a full 10K between changes. (In fact, more than one engineer I interviewed told me the oil would certainly hold up for 15K to 25K miles, but that if it made me feel better to go ahead and change it every 10,000 miles, then that's what I should do, just for my own peace of mind...) ;-)

The big advantage to <u>me</u> is simply time: it's a pain to change my own oil, and it's a pain to have to keep running to someplace like Jiffy Lube every 3,000 miles. I stay pretty busy, and changing the oil is a necessary nuisance. It's also just a lot easier to remember <u>when</u> to change the oil: every time the odometer lines up another four zeros in a row, I take it in. Admittedly, the synthetic oil is more expensive – but I prefer the extra protection it gives the engine (almost zero wear), and I like being able to start up quickly even on bone-chilling cold mornings. And from everything I've been able to read, I believe I'm actually saving enough in better gas mileage to offset the additional cost of the oil (although I don't keep strict records to back up that claim...) :-|

Now, this is all strictly IMO – this subject gets debated a lot on various Web sites, both pro and con, and sometimes quite vehemently. (Try a Google search – but plan on spending all afternoon reading...) And quite literally, Your Mileage May Vary. ;-) But so far, so good. :-) CS

[Joe-Bob]

Originally Posted by Chris S.

YES, you can go way beyond the heavily-advertised 3,000 mile oil change IF... 1) You use a 100% synthetic oil (like Mobil 1 or Amsoil, for instance), and 2) You continue to change the oil filter as necessary.

Yes, you still have to change the oil filter every 3000-5000 miles. BTW - even engines that use synthetic come from the factory with "break-in" oil (and sometimes special filters).
( Unless you own a Jaguar, in which case you never have to change the oil, because in 4000 miles, you've replaced all the oil anyway, just spin on a new filter. ) :)