Which famous guitarists excel at sight reading & music theory?

[cwcowell]

There are many cases of musical geniuses who know no theory and can't sight-read to save their lives (e.g., McCartney and Pavarotti). I'm wondering about the opposite cases: big names in rock/pop who skilled at sight reading and music theory.

Top-flight session guitarists have to be excellent sight readers in order to get work. And Steve Vai's reading/theory skills are legendary. But I wonder how many famous guitarists are self-taught savants who rely on instincts rather than training (not that I have anything against that approach).

I guess anyone who made it through Berklee, GIT, or other music schools must fall into this category, but I don't know who in the rock pantheon comes from that background.

So who among the major guitarists are known for their theory & sight-reading chops?

[bluetele54]

...the famous ones that can read,silly......

[Roli]

Why do you want rock guitarists to be able to sight read the only five notes they can play? -.-

[blacklinefish]

I'm curious about GIT or Berklee. Is reading music a requirement? 100% of the people who complete the programs read music?

A lot of people presume that Van Halen could read music because he won a regional piano contest twice as a youth. As it turned out, the piece that he would play is the only thing he worked on for a whole year until he had it. He jokingly admitted it later on.

I am thinking the proportion of music reading guitar heroes is probably fairly low. I would love to know about them, though. I bet more top-name vocalists can read music than guitar players (especially if they have a church background).

It would not surprise me that some guitarists started band in music on brass or wind, and learned to read for that - but never applied it to guitar.

[Skrik]

Steve Vai famously transcribed some of Frank Zappa's solos thereby landing himself a gig in which people would submit their music for him to sight read.

[DMace]

I think the metal dudes tend to be the sight-readers in the rock genre, at least the ones that went to GIT and Berkley. Other than that, it's jazz guys like Larry Carlton. Oddly enough, if my memory serves me, Jerry Garcia was a sight-reader. And, obviously, Zappa.

[Telenator]

I was in the recording studio doing the photos for The Liquid Tension Experiment album with Jordan Rudess, Mike Portnoy, John Petrucci and Tony Levin.

They were writing the album in the studio.

The group played a very complex run together and Tony said, "guys, play that one more time." They did and I watched Tony write the entire riff on a music staff on the spot! I couldn't believe it!

[Flannel Pat]

Tommy Tedesco, Glen Campbell, Barney Kessel, Howard Roberts...

I'm sure there are more.

[Larry F]

BB King reads music and studied the Schillinger system. Howlin Wolf took music theory lessons for a year from a Roosevelt College professor. Howlin Wolf also went to night school to earn how to read text. I read an interview with one of the country greats, Merle Travis maybe, and in response to the interviewer's question of whether or not he read music, wrote out a passage in traditional notation.

By the way, I consider sight reading to be a particular subset of reading in general. Many musicians who read music are not highly competent sight-readers, me included. I read and write music every day, but can't get very far without making a mistake, and certainly not at tempo. My ex-wife, a piano professor, thinks that sight-reading is a skill that encourages bad technique. Maybe the OP means sight-reading to be the skill of reading music without having to hunt and peck for the notes. Here's another, Randy Rhodes.

To be a famous guitarist is different than being a good guitarist. A famous guitarist has a finely developed personal style. A good guitarist, through reading, among other things, has the ability to play in more than one style. I doubt that, as one's fame grows, the pressure to elevate and hone one's personal style becomes greater.

I would think that famous classical guitarists and the majority of jazz guitarists can read music.

[Jahmbie]

Randy Rhodes was a well known devotee of classical guitar, so it would seem his sight-reading and theory skills would have been consummate.


Howard Roberts was an amazing player and educator whose approach was very much grounded in strong reading and theory skills. I had the extreme fortune to study with him several times in college.

[JayFreddy]

Originally Posted by blacklinefish

I'm curious about GIT or Berklee. Is reading music a requirement? 100% of the people who complete the programs read music?

Can't speak for GIT, but Berklee, yes. 100% of the people who complete the program can read music. The trick is finding a guitarist who went to Berklee who has actually completed the program!

All the famous guitarists I know who have attended Berklee did not complete their original programs...

I think Berklee does a great job marketing itself, but I wouldn't recommend it for anything more than a summer program. There are better music schools that cost less and provide more in terms of campus life and the other stuff we want our kids to experience in college...

I'd say that 70% of my favorite guitarists can read music, but some of them might not care to admit it. Just as a certain bearded geezer/hellion from Houston actually uses .008 guage strings, but tells the music press he uses .013's...

If you want to get good at public speaking, learning to read books will help you study the great speeches of old such as Lincoln. If you want to get good at playing a musical instrument, including guitar, learning to read music provides a similar advantage.

[Larry F]

Speaking of uses of reading music, when I hear a nice on Youtube, I can go upstairs and write it down. One practical use of reading is that it improves one's memory since you can identify and relate pitches by function. So, while reading music entails playing the notes on the page, a component of that is that you know the notes on your guitar better. And on the theory side, if you know your chords well, you can play a solo around the notes of the chord.

[Skully]

To be a famous guitarist is different than being a good guitarist. A famous guitarist has a finely developed personal style. A good guitarist, through reading, among other things, has the ability to play in more than one style. I doubt that, as one's fame grows, the pressure to elevate and hone one's personal style becomes greater.

And I'd probably much rather listen to the famous guitarist. As a rule, the stylist who has mastered his or her corner of the musical universe, no matter how small, creates much more compelling and than the guy who can -- and does -- do everything. Think Johnny Ramone, The Edge, etc. The guys who can do it all tend to be the employees, not the boss. If they're persistent and lucky, they become studio pros. But most of them wind up playing weddings and bar mitzvahs.

[klasaine]

Originally Posted by JayFreddy

I think Berklee does a great job marketing itself, but I wouldn't recommend it for anything more than a summer program.

If one goes through the program and does what the teachers tell you to - and finishes ... it's a great and unique place to go to music school.
I know and work with MANY Berklee grads and non grads. The one thing they have in common, is that while they were there ... THEY STUDIED!

[JayFreddy]

I think Berklee is a great and unique place to go to music school, regardless of whether you graduate. I especially recommend the summer programs, the four-year degree programs, not so much. YMMV...

[casterway]

Marty Friedman on 'scales'.

[Larry F]

Originally Posted by casterway

Marty Friedman on 'scales'.

What he is doing is pure theory, especially the way he talks about making a flowing line from learned patterns.

[jazztele]

jim hall is supposed to be an excellent sight reader.

a think a lot of guitarists know a lot more than they let on, personally. it's just not "cool" to be a music reader in some circles.

[klasaine]

As to the OP ...
It needs to be put into relative perspective. Paul McCartney says he doesn't read or know 'theory'. That's a relative statement. He knows what an Ab 1/4 note looks like on the staff in both bass and treble clef and he knows what the V chord is in the key of D. But, he's been around guys that read and arrange at an EXTREMELY HIGH LEVEL his whole life and he's humble enough to know that they do it not only better than him but exceptionally better than him. He's not threatened by that because he's Paul McCartney and he doesn't really need to be great reader/theoretician ... because he's Paul McCartney. Robben Ford is another example of a guy that will say, "oh man, I don't really read too well". He maybe doesn't read as well as Dean Parks or any number of session sax, piano and trumpet players ... but he reads and he knows theory pretty good. He's worked with many of the best in the business who read fly sh*t and could write a dissertation on the lydian-chromatic concept. That's maybe not his thing anymore and he doesn't have to do 'sight-reading' sessions because he's made such a name for himself being Robben Ford. Jerry Garcia of course didn't have to read in the Dead but he liked learning and the only way back then was to get a method book with standard notation in it and 'read it'.
As LarryF mentioned, sightreading is different from just being able to read (decipher) music. SR'ing means that you don't have to practice it once before you get it right.

[ac15]

I believe that Brian Setzer knows theory and can read music.

In general, guitar players are worse than other musicians at reading and knowing what they're doing. Guitar players tend to be more pattern based, rote players. I've seen countless threads where guys will describe their whole approach to improvising as coming from "boxes" or "pentatonic boxes."

I've been reading for years (since I started), but recently decided to study guitar formally again with a guy who teaches advanced players primarily. He has me doing sight reading studies out of one of those Berklee books weekly. Even though in the "real world" I'm not required to sight read much at all, I like those studies for keeping that skill alive.

This thread reminds me of that old joke:


Q: How do you get a guitar player to turn down?

A: Put a piece of sheet music in front of him.

So true.

[ac15]

Originally Posted by klasaine

SR'ing means that you don't have to practice it once before you get it right.

True, but "sight reading" is often used interchangably by people to describe music reading in general. I don't think the OP was necessarily looking for examples of people who can read through something perfectly the first time, but people who can read music/know theory.

[Larry F]

I have a favorite memory. While I had already been playing professionally for 7 years and teaching for 4 years, I still took guitar lessons from a great player in Portland. At the end of one lesson, I asked if we would meet next week, on Thanksgiving day. He said he would be there. I showed and there were no other students before or after me. We sight-read single line clarinet and flute duets. We went straight through these, without looking them over or starting and stopping when we made mistakes. If was fantastic. We played for four hours like that. What an experience that was.

[OutlawSteph1975]

I can't understand how any jazz guitarist manages to get by without a lot of theory and fretboard knowledge, but somehow Django and a lot of ethnic gypsy jazz guitarists manage without any formal training or theory. It's all instinct and what's passed down by rote.

I read that when Django was playing with Duke Ellington, Duke asked what key one of his songs was in.. Django replyed.. "no key".

[Lerb21]

Don Rich was in orchestra in high school, so he definitely could.

[blacklinefish]

Originally Posted by Larry F

We sight-read single line clarinet and flute duets. We went straight through these, without looking them over or starting and stopping when we made mistakes. If was fantastic. We played for four hours like that. What an experience that was.

That sounds like a great experience, and it follows what I think of being able to sight-read music. I doubt you had heard any of those duets before and yet you were able to recreate them.

I love playing stuff I have never heard before. I have a BOSS RC-2 (loop) and my favorite thing to do is get a lead sheet and put the chords down. Then, with the chords playing in the loop, I play (or try to play) the melody. I need to play it a second time to get a good feel for it, but it's not like I am perfecting it for recording - I get bored, turn the page, and move on. I guess my ability is to do this with standard stuff (quarters/eighths, etc.) up to 120 or 132bpm.

Of course, my favorite thing is when I figure out I know the song, about half-way through.

I guess it would be a dream of mine to do this with other guitarists - but no one else that I know can read. My wife plays flute, so that means I usually have to be rhythm only (unless I get some duet music).

[klasaine]

Originally Posted by OutlawSteph1975

I can't understand how any jazz guitarist manages to get by without a lot of theory and fretboard knowledge, but somehow Django and a lot of ethnic gypsy jazz guitarists manage without any formal training or theory. It's all instinct and what's passed down by rote.

I read that when Django was playing with Duke Ellington, Duke asked what key one of his songs was in.. Django replyed.. "no key".

Django essentially made up his own language. "Innovators" can do that (theory follows practice). The Gypsy Jazzers (with a couple of exceptions) pretty much just play like Django and Stephane. No value judgment - I dig the GJ thing - but it's parameters are VERY finite. Within that realm you can learn by rote. It's like any other 'folk' or regionally specific 'ethnic' music. If it's all you do and you grew up in it, then there's really no need to get academic about it.

[Telemaniac]

This is a nice little skit on reading music - not really sight reading but fun nonetheless - French and Saunders UK TV. Knopfler/Gilmore/Moore/etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cIdJFmFkag

[Deacon Blue]

I've read that T-Bone Walker could sight read, and wouldn't hire a musician who couldn't.

Jeff