Musician issues - Did I handle this well?

[OutlawSteph1975]

So all the pickers I have a class with were waiting outside before class time, and the fiddle player starts talking about a band he wants to form. He'll be the leader. It will be "old time" music, and he just wants to play community events. He doesn't like open jams because he's met too many people who play sloppy and don't learn the songs properly but plow through them. He's been playing fiddle 14 years and is pretty good.

So the fiddle player says, "it's hard to find good banjo players". And I'm thinking to myself.. I'm getting pretty competent on banjo and would love to be in a band. The mandolin picker shows up, who is just learning. The fiddle player didn't come out and ask me if I was interested in being in his band, but he asks the mandolin player. So I said I was interested and gave him my phone number and told him I play guitar too.

We went inside and it was basically just me and the fiddle player playing all the breaks and kicking off all the songs. The mando. picker couldn't play a solo on our songs which we've been working on for several months.. all bluegrass/old time standards like Old Joe Clark and Soldier's Joy. (I'm not being judgmental here. I like teaching people and encouraging in a classroom setting). Anyhow, if he calls me about the band, great.. if not.. that's okay too. But I was thinking, well why didn't he think of asking me before I asked him.

[jjh37854]

who knows, doesn't matter, you gotta dive in, now you are involved, thats the important part.

my take is, "dont ask, dont get"

[klasaine]

I think you handled it just fine.
As stupid as this sounds ... he probably didn't ask you because - you're a 'girl'.
I'm of course assuming it was a guy whom we're talking about(?)

[Derek S]

Could be a million reasons why he didn't ask you. I wouldn't worry about it.

[getbent]

klasaine has got it.

[stephwills]

Originally Posted by getbent

klasaine has got it.

+1. And if he has issues with this, you're better off without him.

I remember playing the scene in Lubbock about 15 years ago. During a break, I was looking over the list of bands that'd be playing this particular venue during the next month and wondering Who are the Dixie Chicks? Never heard of them ... I wonder if they need a dummer ... (No, I never followed up, and don't believe it would've mattered.)

If this guy has a "chick" problem, make your own path. You can do it. It sounds like you're surrounded with enough talent that he believes it doable. Do it without him if you have to. The world is yours.

[cowboytwang]

Originally Posted by OutlawSteph1975

So all the pickers I have a class with were waiting outside before class time, and the fiddle player starts talking about a band he wants to form. He'll be the leader. It will be "old time" music, and he just wants to play community events. He doesn't like open jams because he's met too many people who play sloppy and don't learn the songs properly but plow through them. He's been playing fiddle 14 years and is pretty good.

So the fiddle player says, "it's hard to find good banjo players". And I'm thinking to myself.. I'm getting pretty competent on banjo and would love to be in a band. The mandolin picker shows up, who is just learning. The fiddle player didn't come out and ask me if I was interested in being in his band, but he asks the mandolin player. So I said I was interested and gave him my phone number and told him I play guitar too.

We went inside and it was basically just me and the fiddle player playing all the breaks and kicking off all the songs. The mando. picker couldn't play a solo on our songs which we've been working on for several months.. all bluegrass/old time standards like Old Joe Clark and Soldier's Joy. (I'm not being judgmental here. I like teaching people and encouraging in a classroom setting). Anyhow, if he calls me about the band, great.. if not.. that's okay too. But I was thinking, well why didn't he think of asking me before I asked him.

Don't ever second guess yourself in these situations. And more important don't ever, ever try to figure out what a fiddle player is thinkin', especially after he says he wants to start a band and be the "Band Leader".
When someone wants to be "THE" band leader, that's your first clue that there is something mentally wrong them.

[Stackabones]

He probably thought that if he asked you that you might think he was was hitting on you.

[garytelecastor]

OutlawSteph-if you were in Minnesota you could play in my band and I would've asked you first. I think Klasaine has it right. And I have to say that isn't very enlightened of the fiddle player.
Move to the Land of 10000 taxes and you can play in our band.

[MandyMarie]

Originally Posted by klasaine

I think you handled it just fine.
As stupid as this sounds ... he probably didn't ask you because - you're a 'girl'.
I'm of course assuming it was a guy whom we're talking about(?)

+1.

I've been in that same exact situation a million times. But once you really get out there and prove yourself people start to take you more seriously as a musician...I'm not saying he's "anti-girl" or anything hahaha, I just think he may not have considered the fact you could seriously play - or did he know already?

Some men are without a doubt "anti-girl" and take it as a blow to their ego when you do anything other than play rhythm behind them...and those are the guys you don't wanna be around anyway! Or they're at least the ones who make you try harder ;o)

He's going to be kickin' himself soon, my friend! You handled it great!

[getbent]

I think he knows you can kick his butt and it is a threat. You are smart, have great musical taste, are probably easy to get along with... and can probably motivate people to play together... these qualities are wonderful to have unless you have an insecure BAND LEADER... then you are a threat.

Hey, if you move out here, I'll be in YOUR band!

[teledude66]

Fiddle player = Drummer ???

[CrazyManAndy]

All this hatin' on fiddle players...yeah, let's hang 'em high!

.....*wait a sec...I am a fiddle player*



I agree with Derek S.

CMA

[vjf1968]

You handled it fine. However, I would be a little wary about someone stating that they want to be the BAND LEADER. Sounds a little egotistical. I was always under the assumption that the role of leader is something that you gradually fall into whether you like it or not.

[geddins]

Originally Posted by teledude66

Fiddle player = Drummer ???

Fiddle player = Frontman??? Those type USUALLY wanna be the "leader"


And I think you handled it perfectly as well....great advice already given.

[Jakedog]

Originally Posted by vjf1968

You handled it fine. However, I would be a little wary about someone stating that they want to be the BAND LEADER. Sounds a little egotistical. I was always under the assumption that the role of leader is something that you gradually fall into whether you like it or not.

First, you handled it great. I wouldn't have done it any differently, male or female.

Second, a player approaching the forming of a band from the standpoint of wanting to be "The Leader" is not necessarily egotistical. Sometimes the only way to be able to do just what you want, is to put yourself in charge, and form your own band, under your own rules. I finally did this, and don't regret it one bit. After sixteen years of playing in bands that never made me 100% happy (although some were great, and I have no regrets) I just decided that the only way I was ever going to be 100% happy was to do things my way, and find good players who were OK with that. You'd be surprised how many great players are more than OK with it. But it comes with a LOT of responsibility, and accountability. For one person to designate themselves "leader", form a band, and be successful, they have to realize, and be willing to accept that all of the responsibility for making things go right, and all of the accountability when things go wrong, falls squarely on their shoulders.

I'm not always great at handling everything I need to handle, but I work really hard at it, my guys see it, and they respect it. Because I treat them well, and keep them working, and respect their contributions (musically) in return, and give a fair listen when they have input about anything, musical or otherwise, the approach has worked great. For several years now it's been a win/win situation that gets better all the time.

[robbysturgis]

Originally Posted by MandyMarie

Some men are without a doubt "anti-girl" and take it as a blow to their ego when you do anything other than play rhythm behind them...and those are the guys you don't wanna be around anyway! Or they're at least the ones who make you try harder ;o)[/i]

Some men do not ask women - who are not their wives - to join them in anything.

Some men don't have women's phone numbers in their cell phone, rollodexes, or black books.

Some me are shy when it comes to meeting and talking to women.

Most men would love to be around, and talk to, and play good music with women.

[SixStringSlinger]

It's possible (though not necessary) that he didn't ask you 'cause you're a woman, whether that means he thinks you can't play 'cause you're a woman, or his wife (girlfriend or whatever)'s radar is just a touch too sensitive. I say run with it. If he doesn't call you, fine. If he does, go for it. If that goes well, cool. If not (be it for the "woman reason" or anything else), bail and move on.

[CatfishStudios]

Sometimes egotistical maniacal band leaders have good ideas, look at James Brown. I look at a band like a human body...couple arms, couple legs, and a head...that head is NOT the job I want, and I look for someone who does want that kinda spot....Ive been in bands with no "leader" that just flopped around before dying...ya need a head! Your bieng a Girl should have nothing to do with it..its your chops and attitude that count...if you are interested in playing with him..jump on it like ya did...but be aware that he intends to direct the band in a direction he has predetermined.

[robbysturgis]

Originally Posted by OutlawSteph1975

He'll be the leader. It will be "old time" music, and he just wants to play community events.

By being the "leader" does that mean:

1) his name is on the marquee - "Tight Wad and the Bunched Panties"
2) he gets the community gigs
3) he is the music director
4) he hires and fires the musicians
5) he pays the musicians
6) he chooses which bowling shirt to wear tonight
7) he manages the band
8) he gets to choose which musician's instrument he overdubs on the record

[superchicken_VI]

You handled it fine.

Personally, I'd rather be in a band with girls than guys. I enjoy the company of women more than the company of men. They tend to be better mannered (much less noisy gas issues), certainly better-looking, definitely better-smelling (see noisy gas issues again), and more attuned to those around them. Ego is typically less of an issue. Importantly for music, women are typically more emotional--vital to good performance.

As a music major in college, there were a lot of women in our music department. There was no technical superiority of either sex, but the men were more aggressive and sought out more playing time. The guys formed groups and played. The girls tended to work more on their individual works--much less group-play. This always aggrivated me, because I'd much rather be in a brass quartet with 3 cute college chicks who could play like hell than with 3 smelly college guys who could play like hell.

Good for you for putting yourself out there an playing. If some of the guys don't get it, don't worry about it. Somebody will. That somebody will be better to hang out with than an ego-dude who doesn't want to play with girls.

[teledude66]

A philosophical question to Steph or any other lady that would care to answer.

He turns you down which would you rather him tell you?

A. because you're a woman

B. because he thinks you're not good enough

I mean both would not be cool, but which pixxes you less?

[mudbean]

Originally Posted by robbysturgis

"Tight Wad and the Bunched Panties"

<