Setup stress...

Greetings all,

I've been playing guitar for over ten years now and I decided that it's time to do my own setups. On paper it all seems very straight forward. It is straight forward actually. There is just one part that is getting me. My strings buzz when the action is where I want it. I know I can adjust the the height of the saddles but when I do that the action is super high. I've adjusted the neck many times(lots of fun when the truss rod is adjusted at the heel of the neck) to see if that would help and it seems that it does not. I'm assuming that the neck adjustment is what is throwing me. I've searched a bit here and elsewhere and it seems that everywhere has the same formula for a setup. I'm wondering if there are any tips and techniques that you guys would like to share that could maybe help me out.

I'm playing a 60's tele, 3 saddle bridge with GHS 10's.

Going back to my truss rod at the heel comment, I've been told of this truss rod adjustment tool that would allow me to not take my neck off or take my neck pickup out. A screwdriver on a 90 degree that's really stubby so that you can get to the truss rod without disturbing the pickup? Maybe there is another way but if there is I don't know it.

Thanks for reading that whole thing. Any information would be appreciated.

Great site too. I'll be around.

Well, for starters...you have to get rid of the notion that the truss rod has much of an effect on Action height, or should be used to adjust for it...It is primarly used to set the amount of relief in the Neck...and nothing more....(maybe seasonal changes)....do a search on Neck Shims....which change the Angle of the whole Neck....and I feel you will have better results.

Yes, do not take your neck off...get the stubby screwdriver.

Also, do not jump to truss rod adjustments too quickly. If it was good before, then it doesn't need adjusting. Also, never tighten the truss rod without first making the strings slack. When you do adjust it, it may take a couple three days to re-settle to the new position.

Fret buzz is a continuous compromise. It's easy to measure the string height and set it to what a "book" says, but in reality, some fret buzz will be necessary to get a low action. It has to be pretty bad in order to be heard through the amplifier, so some fret buzz is OK.

Be patient...this is a learning process that does get easier over time...it sounds to me like it could be best to let this guitar sit a few days and come back to it when the frustration has worn off.

Edit: spelling

As to knowing if you've adjusted the neck properly, capo it at the first fret, hold the E string (high-E or low-E, depending on which side of the neck you're sighting) down at the 15th fret and see how much clearance you have between the string and 7th fret. If the string is touching the fret, you may well have tightened the rod too much and have backbow. Ideally, you should see ~ .008" of clearance. Get the neck adjusted to that spec and play the guitar for a couple of days to let it settle in an monitor it. You may have to do the "string-as-straightedge" thing a few times until it's right. Unless you have a jacked-up neck or fret issues, you should be able to adjust your action at least as low as 5/64" on the low E and 4/64" on the high E, measured at the 12th fret. That's where I like all of mine set, and my customers are happy with theirs set that way, too.

If you have to resort to shimming the neck, it's best to make a tapered shim that covers as much of the neck pocket as you can. Over time and under tension, shimmed necks can sink (warp) where the neck heel isn't supported.

As to knowing if you've adjusted the neck properly, capo it at the first fret, hold the E string (high-E or low-E, depending on which side of the neck you're sighting) down at the 15th fret and see how much clearance you have between the string and 7th fret. If the string is touching the fret, you may well have tightened the rod too much and have backbow. Ideally, you should see ~ .008" of clearance. Get the neck adjusted to that spec and play the guitar for a couple of days to let it settle in an monitor it. You may have to do the "string-as-straightedge" thing a few times until it's right. Unless you have a jacked-up neck or fret issues, you should be able to adjust your action at least as low as 5/64" on the low E and 4/64" on the high E, measured at the 12th fret. That's where I like all of mine set, and my customers are happy with theirs set that way, too.


I'm going to try this technique. My neck was fine before I started messing around. I don't even think it's my neck. It's me not realizing how much string buzz I used to have. I was at first trying to make zero string buzz. So at this point I've tweaked the neck, saddle height and saddle length(?). I may have to start from scratch.

Side note:I noticed that the bridge plate was a little bit loose. I proceeded to tighten the screws that hold it in place. The first two screws on the low E side seem as if they will turn and turn forever. To not strip it out I tightened until the plate felt solid. It does now but what to do about those two screws holes that are getting worked?? Woodfiller? I'm going to the hardware store in a few hours to get the legendary right angle truss rod tool and I also wanted to get some sort of measuring instrument to dial in these small incriments. If I need to get wood filler I will grab that too. You guys have been very helpful and I thank you for everything thus far.

Take out the screws, stick in a toothpick and break it off flush, reinstall screws.

Take out the screws, stick in a toothpick and break it off flush, reinstall screws.

+1 on this tip!

Also, it sounds like you may have tightened your truss rod too much. I just set up my bandmates guitar after he had taken it to a tech and had it 'setup' for $60. WHen he got the guitar worked on, he brought it home and it buzzed everywhere. My bandmate then raised the action really high to get all the buzz out, but it was ridiculously high... and I didn't think he'd just give me the guitar to use as a slide guitar....

I tweaked at the action and tweaked and the more I looked at it, the more I realized the neck was just too straight. There was clearance as stated earlier (capo'd and fretted at the 15th) but I just don't think it was enough for this particular guitar without dressing the frets. I gave it about a half turn of loosening, put it back under string tension and then let it sit for a couple of days. I reset the intonation and I got the action much lower than it had been when it came to me. He's quite happy with it now.

I'm not quite confident enough in my abilities at dressing frets yet to do that to a friend's guitar. I gotta do it on one of mine first. I'm sure this would help him, but.... Right now, the action is low enough to be playable and the only buzzing is the bridge springs.


Good luck,

For years I tryed to set up my guitars,and never did they feel right.Then I spent $25.00 for some Radius gauges(stew mac.com) On my 71/2 rad,you cant see itwithout it. With this simple gauge I was able to dial in the perfect feel and Hit.Also to make a new nut I was able after 2 try's(blowout) to get it right. I went to fast.If you are going to work on your guitars before tweeking ,and over tight'n the neck buy or make some Radius gauges.. It will Feel like a new guitar.

I just bought a 1/64" ruler, a right angle screw driver that doesn't fit and I'm about to raid the pantry for some toothpicks. Easy solution with the toothpicks. I actually used a very similar technique on door hinge screw holes that were stripped. I wasn't sure about the technique on my ax. So after using the ruler to check the string height according to my neck radius I was able to achieve nice string height. Oh yeah, not until after giving my neck some "relief". I'm still in the middle of the setup. I'll let you all know what happens next.

I just wanted to let everyone who contributed to this thread that I'm a big boy now and setup my own guitar. Everyone's input was very helpful. I've heard from a few people that using rulers and gauges were not necessary. These people were guitar tech's who had been setting up guitars for years. I should of known. So after one last neck tweak, in order to give her some relief, and the newly purchased ruler, the rest of the setup process was cake. I do have some string buzz but after reading your replies and some other threads I decided to let it be for now, let the neck finally settle and just play. I haven't played plugged in for over a week. I'm fiending!

Thanks again!

crappy

This is something I saw linked to in another thread.

http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/techtips.shtml

Very cool stuff. Works nicely.

I do quite a bit of tech work, and my Starrett ruler in /32" and /64" is indispensable to me for setups. I would say any tech that just eyeballs everything can't consistently reproduce setups to the degree of accuracy that should be expected of him/her.